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Prop 2 Utah

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Very personal anecdotal story

When my sister was fighting her battle with cancer and the awful but only hope chemo treatment opiates were the only legal and regulated option for her pain. She hated them. One of her biggest complaints was that she just wanted to be awake.
She didn't use MJ but decided to try it. The only option available was to obtain it illegally. An unregulated black market narcotic designed to get you high. Dope with high levels of THC and likely lower levels of other beneficial canabonoids. She didn't like that either. It put her out too. I hate to think that there likely was some more mellow strain that could have afforded her both more comfort and dignity in her last few months.

Seriously who the **** do you people think you are? Can you not understand the desperation that people feel? Can you not empathize with people in agony who just want aN opportunity to try something that might make their short lives more liveable? Why are your fears more relevant than theirs?
 
♪alt13 said:
Very personal anecdotal story

When my sister was fighting her battle with cancer and the awful but only hope chemo treatment opiates were the only legal and regulated option for her pain. She hated them. One of her biggest complaints was that she just wanted to be awake.
She didn't use MJ but decided to try it. The only option available was to obtain it illegally. An unregulated black market narcotic designed to get you high. Dope with high levels of THC and likely lower levels of other beneficial canabonoids. She didn't like that either. It put her out too. I hate to think that there likely was some more mellow strain that could have afforded her both more comfort and dignity in her last few months.

Seriously who the **** do you people think you are? Can you not understand the desperation that people feel? Can you not empathize with people in agony who just want aN opportunity to try something that might make their short lives more liveable? Why are your fears more relevant than theirs?
Click to expand...
No legitimate reason. Even if it was passed recreationally, no one is forcing anyone to smoke it.
 
Where can you find Prop 2 without reading someone else's take on it?
There are too many news stories to wade through to find a link to the actual document, if it's out there.
 
I'll go through it again, but a couple of things caught my eye on the first go round.
1- The firm that did the church's assessment seemed more correct than the rebuttal, but the rebuttal was more geared towards the Eagle whatever and not the church's document or the proposition document.
2- I found it interesting that because the federal law is much stronger and restrictive, that there is a section stating that the State cannot expend resources whether that be money or time of law enforcement officers to enforce things that would break federal law but not the new prop 2 state laws if enacted. Basically law enforcement cannot enforce federal law in Utah.
3- All sales are exempt from sales tax.
4- Everything is considered medical cannibis, whether in raw form, or product form.
5- This is not just medical cannibis, this is all cannibis shoved in under the medical cannibis umbrella.
6- It was interesting that there was a section on not allowing cannibis use or handling to be a factor in deciding child custody.
7- Peace officers and child welfare cannot take children into custody solely based on possession of cannibis.
8- While it goes into effect in 2020, basically it goes into effect immediately because if you prove you would have a card, then you are good.
9- The largest portion of this proposition deals with definitions, cannabis cultivation facilities, cannabis dispensaries, and those agents.
10- I can be a cannabis processing facility if I am an individual that acquires or intends to acquire cannabis from a cannabis production establishment; possesses cannibis with the intent to manufacture a cannabis product; manufactures or intends to manufacture a cannabis product from unprocessed cannabis; and sells or intends to sell a cannabis product to a cannabis dispensary.
11- I don't know what it takes to get the cards necessary to be an agent of a cultivation facility, or dispensary, or user, or whatever. That is not included.

Those were just some thoughts as I went through it briefly, not solidified, but just points of interest for me to look into later in greater detail. Read through it yourself though, my thoughts and points of interested are nudged by what is important to me. I would think your biases would affect what you see.
 
Jazz Spazz said:
I'll go through it again, but a couple of things caught my eye on the first go round.
1- The firm that did the church's assessment seemed more correct than the rebuttal, but the rebuttal was more geared towards the Eagle whatever and not the church's document or the proposition document.
2- I found it interesting that because the federal law is much stronger and restrictive, that there is a section stating that the State cannot expend resources whether that be money or time of law enforcement officers to enforce things that would break federal law but not the new prop 2 state laws if enacted. Basically law enforcement cannot enforce federal law in Utah.
3- All sales are exempt from sales tax.
4- Everything is considered medical cannibis, whether in raw form, or product form.
5- This is not just medical cannibis, this is all cannibis shoved in under the medical cannibis umbrella.
6- It was interesting that there was a section on not allowing cannibis use or handling to be a factor in deciding child custody.
7- Peace officers and child welfare cannot take children into custody solely based on possession of cannibis.
8- While it goes into effect in 2020, basically it goes into effect immediately because if you prove you would have a card, then you are good.
9- The largest portion of this proposition deals with definitions, cannabis cultivation facilities, cannabis dispensaries, and those agents.
10- I can be a cannabis processing facility if I am an individual that acquires or intends to acquire cannabis from a cannabis production establishment; possesses cannibis with the intent to manufacture a cannabis product; manufactures or intends to manufacture a cannabis product from unprocessed cannabis; and sells or intends to sell a cannabis product to a cannabis dispensary.
11- I don't know what it takes to get the cards necessary to be an agent of a cultivation facility, or dispensary, or user, or whatever. That is not included.

Those were just some thoughts as I went through it briefly, not solidified, but just points of interest for me to look into later in greater detail. Read through it yourself though, my thoughts and points of interested are nudged by what is important to me. I would think your biases would affect what you see.
Click to expand...
Both sides have expressed that it needs some fine tuning and that can be done even after if it passes in November. The legislature in this state will make sure some changes are made I have no doubt. My bottom line is, people need it, and the state and legislature has sat on its hands and accomplished nothing on this issue and won’t either if this does not pass. I will be voting for it, their hand needs to be forced to address this issue. The final result will not be exactly what’s in proposition 2 when all is said and done.
 
oneye said:
Both sides have expressed that it needs some fine tuning and that can be done even after if it passes in November. The legislature in this state will make sure some changes are made I have no doubt. My bottom line is, people need it, and the state and legislature has sat on its hands and accomplished nothing on this issue and won’t either if this does not pass. I will be voting for it, their hand needs to be forced to address this issue. The final result will not be exactly what’s in proposition 2 when all is said and done.
Click to expand...

I don't think that's correct. At least, it contradicts what I was able to find on the utah.gov website just now: "What is a Voter Initiative? An initiative is a means to enact new laws or ordinances through a direct vote, rather than through a legislative body. If enough voters sign a petition, the proposed initiative is placed on a ballot to be voted on. If the initiative passes, it becomes law, just as if it were passed by a legislative body." from https://propertyrights.utah.gov/voter-initiatives-referenda/

If you have reliable information otherwise please post.
 
colton said:
I don't think that's correct. At least, it contradicts what I was able to find on the utah.gov website just now: "What is a Voter Initiative? An initiative is a means to enact new laws or ordinances through a direct vote, rather than through a legislative body. If enough voters sign a petition, the proposed initiative is placed on a ballot to be voted on. If the initiative passes, it becomes law, just as if it were passed by a legislative body." from https://propertyrights.utah.gov/voter-initiatives-referenda/

If you have reliable information otherwise please post.
Click to expand...
That does not mean the legislature cannot change parts of the initiative once it is enacted like any other law. Laws are fine tuned and changed quite often. You're right as in, it wouldn't be like adding amendments to the bill or changing it before it was enacted, but things can be changed by the legislature by passing laws, etc. in addition to it. No they don't get to specifically bring this bill and change it, but they can add other legislation to address their issues of concern. This happens all the time, it's not like a law is set in stone and can never be changed just because it is passed or that other legislation cannot be passed to address issues with it. How often do you think laws are passed and never change? This at least forces their hand to do so and takes a much needed step to allow the legal use of this drug for those who need it. If this doesn't pass, they will sit on their hands and do nothing like they have for years now and pass nothing. This will force them to address the issue, even if some work needs to be done in addition to this law passing. It's also worth noting what they are asking far as far as regulation and a registered pharmacy cannot happen until the federal government removes it from the banned substance list. It cannot be controlled or administered in the same way other drugs can because it is not legal federally. Essentially what they are saying is, we support medical marijuana through a pathway that can not be accomplished. Which is just a fancy way of saying, we really don't want it at all.
 
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