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LoPo said:
Thanks @fishonjazz for starting this thread.

Gobert A+: keeps improving, has stayed healthy, DPOY

Mitchell A-: sophomore slump start, but All Star quality in 2019

Ingles A-: always ready, runs offense, does everything

Favors B+: very consistent but still only a complimentary player

Korver B-: great addition (on and off court) for what he cost us

Royce B-: for defense and value, he's an A. Offense rough but improving.

Jae B-: great for his role. Would be higher if more consistent

Rubio C: everything Fish said. He's either sugar or ****

Neto C: another solid season especially for as little as he's paid

Thabo D+: solid role player, but for $5+, I expected a bit more

Udoh D+: on court he's a D, but morale off court brings him up

Exum D: if he didn't get hurt, he'd have been in the C range

Grayson D: thought he'd make more of an impact, but I haven't given up

Niang D

Bradley D-: at least Niang plays some


DL D to B (TBD): Pros Korver and bringing back Favors. Cons paying Exum and Favors more than market value and not doing anything else in the offseason. His grade will emerge after the playoffs. If we get ousted in the first round, his grade is D or less. If we make it out of the 1st round, he gets a C. If we compete well into the 2nd round or beyond, his grade skyrockets.

NOTE: my grades also include each player's contract size when determining the overall grade
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Good idea about weighing contract into it. I should have done that too

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Jingled said:
Gobert: A (Still dominant defensively and has shown real improvement on offense. Hasn't missed a game this season.)
Mitchell: A- (Got off to a slow start due to the injury he sustained in last years playoffs. He's been fantastic since January. Might carry the largest offensive load of any player on a playoff team in the entire league.)
Ingles: A- (Averaging career highs in points and assists, highest plus-minus on the team, has played in 300 straight games, possibly our best passer and playmaker. Bit of a down shooting year but still very good at 45% from the field and 39% from 3.)
Favors: A- (Has been incredibly consistent this year and post all star break has been playing some of the best basketball of his career.)
Rubio: C+ (Been pretty inconsistent, shot the ball poorly for the most part. For all his faults the offense is better when he's on the floor and his passing and playmaking has been good.)
Crowder: C+ (Poor shooting and poor shot selection. I also think he's a little overrated on defense. Provides toughness and hustle.)
Korver: B- (Hasn't shot the ball as well as expected but still provides great spacing on offense.)
O'Neale: B-
Exum: D
Neto: B-
Thabo: C+
Niang: C+
Grayson: D-
Udoh: B
Quin: A
DL: C+
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Nailed it
 
Rubashov said:
I'd give Crowder a B- and DL a C+, Royce's season hasn't been terrible but I think most of us after the Houston series last year expected him to take another step this year and he hasn't, I've been slightly disappointed. Joe's season has been remarkable especially when you take into account what's happened off court with his family, love that dude.

Additionally I give the organization a B+ for the way they've handled off court issues this year, Gail Miller is class.
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What kind of crack do y'all smoke together to create these Royce takes?
 
fishonjazz said:
Its that time again. Every year I do a thread for grading the Jazz. Season is about over and i have a bit of time so here goes. (Not gonna grade guys like bradley, naz, cavanaugh, etc) Expectations do come into play.

Rudy "Stifle Tower" Gobert: A+. Best year of his career. Should have been an all star. Possibly top 10 player in the league. Dunks in a season record. Leads the league in field goal percentage. Passed Karl Malone for double double in a season. Likely DPOY again. Possible all nba. Improved his scoring arsenal. Consistency. MVP of the team. Zero missed games iirc.

Donovan "Spida" Mitchell: A-. Only gets the minus cause of expectations and a slow start. Carries the team offensively with little help. Stepped in at pg after all the injuries and did a great job. Efficiency has been great after january (im blaming early struggles on lingering health issues). Leadership. Personality. SHOES on the way soon. Jazz will go as far as he takes us.

Joe "Jingles" Ingles: A-. Ultimate glue guy. Has had some up and downs but mostly ups. Possibly the best point guard on the team. Great defender. Best trash talker in the league. Leads the entire nba in making the opponent get jingled. Iconic. Mr steal yo girl despite looking your drunk uncle at thanksgiving dinner.

Derrick "Trans DF Express" Favors: A-. We would be ****ed without this dude. Ultimate team player. No one sacrifices more. Total pro despite constant trade rumours. Best season of his career by advanced stats. Stayed healthy all year. (I refuse to believe he is injured. Just resting)

Ricky "jekyll or hyde" Rubio: C. Only grade that makes sense. He is either sensless or sensational with little in between. Finishing the season strong like last year. We will need a strong effort from him in the playoffs if we want to make any noise. Im rooting for him.

Jae "lobster tail" Crowder: C-. Tough one to grade. I gave him a lower grade cause i was expecting around 40% from three and he hasn't delivered. Gives the team great boost of toughness and attitude. Has expanded his drive game. Ok defender.

Royce "buckets" Oneal: C-. Another tough one. Great defender. Shooting a good percentage from 3. I just wish he provided more consistent offense. My expectations for him this year were probably way too high. I though he would be playing a lot more minutes and scoring more points. Korver probably stole some of his thunder (and minutes)

Kyle "Ashton with plastic surgery gone wrong" Korver: C+. He is what we needed when we acquired him (shooting) but his 38% from 3 is quite a bit lower than i expected. His defense and hustle are better than I expected and his floor spreading still helps even when he is off. I just wish he were off less often. Seems like he is either on fire or cold.

Thabo "i got no nickname for him" Sefalosha: C. Provides some decent defense and his shooting has been better than i expected but i mostly think "meh" when it comes to him (maybe meh should be his nickname lol) but thats ok. He is old and cheap. Cant expect to much. He is what he is.

Raul "pretty boy neato nato" Neto: B-. I love the guy so im biased. If he never got hurt I would give him a B+ or A-. I think he always exceeds everyones expectations. Best 3rd string point guard in the nba. Tough, pesky, high motor, great teammate and steady as can be.

Ekpe "bookworm" Udoh: D. He has had a rough year. Nice to see him play like I expect him to last night. Im probably being to hard on a guy that plays 5 minutes per game but I expected better defense than he has provided.

Dante "unded" Exum: D. I typically give him an incomplete in this thread but im sick of handing him that grade over and over. Signed a new contract. played like **** a bunch and then had flashes of some good games and then predictably got hurt again.

Grayson "Kobra Kai" Allen: D-. Couldn't crack the rotation much and when he did he stunk up the joint (excluding last night). At least he didn't trip and injure anyone.

Georges "Gorgeous" Niang: C+. I enjoy watching him play and always feel like he is on the cusp of being a true rotational nba player but he just cant seem to really get over the hump. Probably deserves a worse grade than im giving him.

Quin "bond villian hooker murdering coke sniffin psycho" Quin: A. (im sure he is a nice guy and feel bad about the nickname but i mean thats what everyone sees and talks about right?) Should be up for coach of the year. Players have always bought what he is selling and thats the most important part of coaching imo. I bitch about his rotations all the time but I would do that no matter who was coaching. Its a tough gig.

Dennis "kevin mchale" Lindsey: D. He got Korver for Burks and 2 2nd rounders. thats all he did this year really. (Drafted allen and picked up guys like cavanaugh and niang) Feel that more should have been done to improve the team. But..... the team he has built over his term at GM has been pretty damn well done so the D grade is just for this season but not a reflection of the job he has done.

Jazzfanz: C- I feel like the forum has been pretty dead and there has been too much complaining about this team. We are gonna win 50 games in the tough *** west! Lets enjoy it! Celebrate these guys!

Jazz fans (at the arena): D The jimmer debacle. The bannings. The orlando boo game. We are better than that.

Discuss
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This might be the worst report card ever
 
A's: Gobert, Favors, Mitchell, and Oneale
B's: Rubio, Thabo, Ingles, Korver, Crowder, Niang
C's: Neto, Exum

No one else has really played enough to grade (Allen/Udoh/Bradley)

DL: A+ for the Korver deal and signing Niang.
 
Zombie said:
Gobert: A+ He's improved his offense and remains the most dominant defender in the league

Mitchell: A struggled a bit to start the year, but he's improved a ton since January and is carrying the offensive load as a sophomore.

Ingles: A- He's added more play making to his game, but his 3pt accuracy has suffered.

Favors: B+ Favors has just been solid all year, super consistent. It's a luxury to have a starting caliber center along with Rudy. I held out a little help he'd develop his outside game more than he has.

Rubio: C Even when he's not shooting the ball efficiently, he is important to getting our offense going. His defense has been bad at times, and we haven't seen a huge second half efficiency improvement from him this year.

Royce: B Still a great wing defender who is shooting the three well. Decisive with his decision making, wish he wouldn't step out of bounds so much.

Jae: B Seems about as good as last year. Hustles his *** off, and is great when his shot is dropping. Questionable shot selection at times.

Exum: D Just a ****in bummer. Not his fault at all obviously.

Neto: B Wish he was more durable, but when he plays he's great. He's shooting well, doesn't turn the ball over. Does what you want your backup PG to do.

Niang: C I thought he'd shoot better based on preseason. I feel like he's been better lately though. Better defender than you'd think looking at him.

Korver: B. Yeah he hasn't shot as well as I'd hoped, but he gets a ton of respect and opens up the floor. I'm impressed with his defense at his age. Doesn't make mistakes.

Coaching Staff: A Considering the overall lack of offensive talent on this team it's remarkable what we're doing right now. Top three offense since the All Star break, I believe. Our player development is top notch imo.

DL: TBD I think most of us were hoping for a big trade deadline, but I don't think the Grizzlies were super serious about moving Conley. I think the Korver trade is underrated a bit. There was no move that would have made us real contenders this season so I'm withholding judgment until we see how FA works out.
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How does the Kak taste?
 
I don't know how Oneale is anything but an A.

The guy is an undrafted 2nd year player who is our best perimeter defender and now one of our best open 3 shooters. Sorry you idiots thought he was going to transform his game into being a scoring gorward 1 off-season because he had two good scoring games in a playoff series.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
I don't know how Oneale is anything but an A.

The guy is an undrafted 2nd year player who is our best perimeter defender and now one of our best open 3 shooters. Sorry you idiots thought he was going to transform his game into being a scoring gorward 1 off-season because he had two good scoring games in a playoff series.
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That's one side of the coin.

If he is an A player then you gotta give quin a bad grade for playing him less than 20 minutes per game. Wonder how many A level players play less than 20 minutes per game.

Also interesting that royce is scoring less, rebounding less, assisting less, getting to the line less, lower PER, and fouling more this year vs last year. I look at a stat saying +/- per 100 possessions and see that last year he was a +10 and this year +5.7 while on court. Turnover percentage is worse this year vs last. Usage is less this year vs last year. I dont know how that effects his stats

So last year he must have been an A++ and should have been all NBA and an all star. Only thing he is doing better this year is shooting percentage on less fg attempts of course.

I like Royce. A lot. I think he should play more. Take all of thabo minutes and some of Ingles (quin doesn't agree though for some reason). I had very high expectations for him. I thought he would work on his offense in the off season and that this season his minutes, usage, points, shot attempts, etc would all go up by quite a bit. His nickname is buckets after all. Maybe that is just a funny ironic nickname.

I kinda think that A grade level players should be guys that are at least in the realm of all Star consideration. I mean if Royce is an A player then harden, giannis, Durant, etc need a whole other alphabet and there should just be no such thing as a grade below b.

He is a good 3 and D player who plays less than 20 minutes a night and averages 5 points, 3 rebounds, and 1.5 assists per game. 9.3 per. That doesn't equal A to me.

Now if my grades were based on how much money a guy makes and where they were drafted then I would give him an A cause he is much much better than most undrafted players who make what he makes.

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Saint Cy of JFC said:
And lest we forget: Ingles wasn't as good as Royce in their respective 2nd seasons. **** takes time.
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Oh, I see. My grades weren't based on future seasons.
I agree that it will take time for Royce to be an A grade level player.
And yes, ingles wasnt very good in his second season with the jazz. Probably why he only played 15 minutes per game and the lowest amount of minutes of his career despite not being on playoff team.
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For me A level players are the players that we couldn't do without. If they don't play, we lose. Like we be ****ed without them.

There are plenty of games this season where Royce barely even played and we were just fine. He is a bench role player. And a very good one. Bench role players don't get A grades from me. I'm a tough grader I guess.

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fishonjazz said:
For me A level players are the players that we couldn't do without. If they don't play, we lose. Like we be ****ed without them.

There are plenty of games this season where Royce barely even played and we were just fine. He is a bench role player. And a very good one. Bench role players don't get A grades from me. I'm a tough grader I guess.

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POTY

Not really but that's a good post.
 
LogGrad98 said:
POTY

Not really but that's a good post.
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Thanks.
At the same time I don't want to be the guy arguing against jazz players. I love this team and love this season so I'm done when this nonsense. (Maybe too late lol.)
If Cy thinks Royce deserves an A then good on him.

Go Jazz!

I do think that jae and Royce are the biggest X factors on this team and if they both play their best in the playoffs then we will overachieve.

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fishonjazz said:
That's one side of the coin.

If he is an A player then you gotta give quin a bad grade for playing him less than 20 minutes per game. Wonder how many A level players play less than 20 minutes per game.

Also interesting that royce is scoring less, rebounding less, assisting less, getting to the line less, lower PER, and fouling more this year vs last year. I look at a stat saying +/- per 100 possessions and see that last year he was a +10 and this year +5.7 while on court. Turnover percentage is worse this year vs last. Usage is less this year vs last year. I dont know how that effects his stats

So last year he must have been an A++ and should have been all NBA and an all star. Only thing he is doing better this year is shooting percentage on less fg attempts of course.

I like Royce. A lot. I think he should play more. Take all of thabo minutes and some of Ingles (quin doesn't agree though for some reason). I had very high expectations for him. I thought he would work on his offense in the off season and that this season his minutes, usage, points, shot attempts, etc would all go up by quite a bit. His nickname is buckets after all. Maybe that is just a funny ironic nickname.

I kinda think that A grade level players should be guys that are at least in the realm of all Star consideration. I mean if Royce is an A player then harden, giannis, Durant, etc need a whole other alphabet and there should just be no such thing as a grade below b.

He is a good 3 and D player who plays less than 20 minutes a night and averages 5 points, 3 rebounds, and 1.5 assists per game. 9.3 per. That doesn't equal A to me.

Now if my grades were based on how much money a guy makes and where they were drafted then I would give him an A cause he is much much better than most undrafted players who make what he makes.

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fishonjazz said:
For me A level players are the players that we couldn't do without. If they don't play, we lose. Like we be ****ed without them.

There are plenty of games this season where Royce barely even played and we were just fine. He is a bench role player. And a very good one. Bench role players don't get A grades from me. I'm a tough grader I guess.

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LMFAO.
 
I'm a massive O'Neale fan. He's awesome and has a bright future. Fish is right though. He's not yet an "essential" player who plays enough or provides enough to rate him above a B. I think something in the B range is very fair for what O'Neale provides.

But we don't need to get too upset by Cy's outrage. He rated DL an A+ after all. The GM who replaced Stockton with Allen, Jerekbo with Niang and Burks with Korver. Sure Korver is the best player out of those 6 guys, but an A+ rating for a GM who took a step back replacing Jerekbo with Niang and only made an improvement by upgrading Burks with a 37 year old bench shooter? We would have to win the NBA Finals for DL to deserve an A.
 
Korver has had a massive impact.

Niangs per 36 minutes are practically the same as Jerebko's.

Why the **** ate you even bringing up Stockton? The guy played 9 minutes last year.

DL stayed patient and made smart moves that improved the team without hurting their future.
 
Fish gave Raul Neto a B- despite him not physically being able to handle more than 15 minutes in a game without missing the next 2 weeks.

But then he gives Oneale a C?
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Fish gave Raul Neto a B- despite him not physically being able to handle more than 15 minutes in a game without missing the next 2 weeks.

But then he gives Oneale a C?
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And said I was being bias right in the post. Also mentioned expectations playing a part in the grades. High expectations for Oneal and low ones for Raul played a part without a doubt. Also Raul leading the team in net rating 2 years running influenced me with neto. (I don't know that he is still leading the team in that stat but he was a month or so ago)


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