Getting CP3 and Granger

[Jerche12]

https://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3vsd7s3

Hornets
Throw in the Warriors first round pick in 2012 that Utah has and another future first round pick and its not bad value for Paul. Okur is an expiring contract and yet can still provide some value in his 1 year left, at worst they swing him again to a contender for young prospects. Devin Harris is a top 10 pg easily and justifiably if he stays healthy. CJ Miles and Hansbrough are young, talented, albeit often inconsistent, players that the Hornets can build around and with only 6 players under contract currently they'll be primed for free agency in 2012. Hell even give them Ante Tomic from oversees if he ever pans out and comes over to the states word is he'll be pretty good.

They'll still need to figure out a way to get out of the contracts of both Ariza and Okafor but I'm sure one championship contender will bite on Okafor after seeing how a defensive center, Tyson Chandler, can drastically change title hopes. By getting rid one of them they suddenly have a ton of cap space, two future first rounders, and young talented players in what they net back from either Ariza/Okafor and CJ Miles, Hansbrough, and a healthy Devin Harris

I'm guessing David West is a lost cause, but if they can resign Carl Landry to a reasonable price he'll only add to their young rebuilding efforts.

Jazz
Jazz get their PG of the future in Paul and an all-star SF in Granger. At the same time they get rid of the log-jam at PF/C by dealing Okur and Jefferson. While dealing away both CJ Miles and Raja Bell puts a lot of pressure on the rookie Alec Burks and 2nd year man Hayward to have productive seasons any trade that nets you Chris Paul is a plus. Re-sign AK and Earl Watson to a reasonable price and the Jazz are set with a very promising mix of veterans and young players.

Pacers
Pacers get the post presence they've been lacking in Jefferson and veteran leadership in Raja Bell for a young team. In one year that terrible Posey contract is gone and they'll have a very talented core in Jefferson, George Hill, Collison, Hibbert, and at times Brandon Rush going into the future with a ton a cap space.

The Hornets get value for Paul before he bolts a sure fire high pick from the Jazz via the Warriors, along with another 1st round pick, young talent, and cap space. The Jazz get Paul and Granger enough said. The Pacers get Jefferson at the age of 25 going forward with their young core and cap space.

Wishful to say the last, but what do you think?

 

[Chad Feldheimer]

Jazz : +9 wins
Hornets: -3 wins. Haha more like minus 30 wins
Pacers: -3 wins

 

[GVC]

Both teams could get FAR better deals.

 

[Chad Feldheimer]

https://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3tprbxz

Plus you'd have to probably throw in the GSW pick. But even at that it would be pretty much getting back into the DWill situation again to certain extent.

 

[margodydek]

There are plenty of deals that will work on paper, but will never happen for a number of reasons. Us getting CP3 is one of those deals. In light of this thread I thought I'd post some names of players that I would love to see in a Jazz uniform who we could realistically acquire.

Granger - this guy has been talked about a ton here, almost ad nauseam, but I think he could give us a scary starting 5

Harden - could be untouchable after his stellar playoff run, but I think he'd be a great compliment to Hayward

Iguodala - another guy that's been talked about a lot here, but I think he'd fit in great as our defensive minded wing who would not demand the ball on offense. His contract is pretty lousy, but if we got rid of Jefferson they'd basically cancel each other out as they are for roughly the same amount with 2 yrs left.

Steph Curry - if it's possible I think he's still underrated, and if you get him on a team without Monta, I think he'd be even better (which probably explains why Ellis' name has been thrown out there so much). If I could have my pick of these 4 guys, I'd pick Curry. I'd probably give up Harris/Millsap and take back another contract to get him. If we got Curry I think in a few years time we could have an extremely well-balanced starting 5 that would be an offensive juggernaut of Curry, Burks, Hayward, Kanter, Favors.

That lineup would give us 3 ball-handlers who can pass, get to the hole and score - and in the case of Curry & Hayward be knock down shooters from deep. We'd also have two guys who'd own the glass - and Hayward & Burks could become above average rebounders for their positions. Not to mention we'd have 4 guys who'd shoot above 80% from the stripe.

 

[NUMBERICA]

https://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3tprbxz

Plus you'd have to probably throw in the GSW pick. But even at that it would be pretty much getting back into the DWill situation again to certain extent.

I wouldn't give up that much for a guy that needs the ball in his hands ALL the time, is paid a ****load, and is probably just going to up and peace ASAP.

Now the initial proposal? That rules. Too bad NO would say exactly that immediately.

 

[gregbroncs]

https://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3tprbxz

Plus you'd have to probably throw in the GSW pick. But even at that it would be pretty much getting back into the DWill situation again to certain extent.

I really really hate that deal. 1 year rental for Paul and we get nothing else while giving away Millsap, Hayward and a 1st round pick. Are you a Hornets fan?

 

[Gyp Rosetti]

Devin Harris is a top 10 pg easily and justifiably if he stays healthy.

Derrick Rose
Deron Williams
Chris Paul
Steve Nash
Rajon Rondo
Russell Westbrook
John Wall
Tony Parker
Chauncey Billups
Kyrie Irving
Jrue Holiday

That's 11. Must I go on with guys I'd rather have then Devin running the point?

Devin's an average point guard. Maybe slightly above average. Nothing more.

 

[LogGrad98]

Kyrie Irving, no NBA games played, hardly any in college, already top 10 NBA PG? What are you, the guy's agent?

Jrue Holiday - 14 pts, 6 assts, 4 rebs
Devin Harris - 16 pts, 5 assts, 3 rebs

I don't think Harris is top 10 but neither are your last 2. If you can't come up with someone proven or has shown he is better than Harris, then maybe he does belong in that group.

 

[Gyp Rosetti]

Kyrie Irving, no NBA games played, hardly any in college, already top 10 NBA PG? What are you, the guy's agent?

Jrue Holiday - 14 pts, 6 assts, 4 rebs
Devin Harris - 16 pts, 5 assts, 3 rebs

I don't think Harris is top 10 but neither are your last 2. If you can't come up with someone proven or has shown he is better than Harris, then maybe he does belong in that group.

Holiday is 20 or 21 years old and improving rapidly. Irving was the number one pick and for the most part, pretty much can't miss. Harris' best days may likely be behind him. I guarantee 75% of NBA GM's would rather have Holiday or Irving than Harris. I would too.

 

[Gyp Rosetti]

You're WAY underestimating Holiday.

 

[orangello]

Holiday is 20 or 21 years old and improving rapidly. Irving was the number one pick and for the most part, pretty much can't miss. Harris' best days may likely be behind him. I guarantee 75% of NBA GM's would rather have Holiday or Irving than Harris. I would too.

I would take Holiday right now too but that does not mean that he is better than Harris. Projection and actuality are two very different things.

 

[Gyp Rosetti]

I would take Holiday right now too but that does not mean that he is better than Harris. Projection and actuality are two very different things.

Well he had more assists and rebounds than Harris last year and shot better percentages as well. Add in the fact that he just turned 21 less than a month ago and it's a no-brainer. Everyone talks about Collison on this board but Holiday is an infinitely better player.

The point is Harris is not a top 10 point guard and is pretty much average at best. When you add in other guys like Kidd, Andre Miller, Collison, Jennings, and a couple others, it appears Devin is about as average as you get. I'm not saying he's worse than those players but he's not done much to separate himself from those guys.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Kyrie Irving, no NBA games played, hardly any in college, already top 10 NBA PG? What are you, the guy's agent?

Jrue Holiday - 14 pts, 6 assts, 4 rebs
Devin Harris - 16 pts, 5 assts, 3 rebs

I don't think Harris is top 10 but neither are your last 2. If you can't come up with someone proven or has shown he is better than Harris, then maybe he does belong in that group.

Maybe, but Holiday just finished his second season, and had significantly better shooting percentages across the board than the guy that just finished his seventh season. He's also seven years younger.

Here's the PER rankings from last year for PGs:

1 Chris Paul 23.76
2 Russell Westbrook 23.63
3 Derrick Rose 23.62
4 Deron Williams 21.19
5 Steve Nash 20.81
6 Tony Parker 20.44
7 Stephen Curry 19.46
8 Ramon Sessions 19.01
9 Lou Williams 18.93
10 Chauncey Billups 18.78
11 Rodney Stuckey 18.46
12 Ty Lawson 17.99
13 Andre Miller 17.89
14 Earl Boykins 17.62
15 Devin Harris 17.22
16 Rajon Rondo 17.11
17 Baron Davis 17.05
18 Raymond Felton 16.68
19 Kyle Lowry 16.51
20 Jose Calderon 16.38

PER is just an indicator, but I think it's a relatively strong one. I don't know about some of the guys above Harris, but I'd definitely choose some guys below him for the rebuild as well (Holiday is a great example, as is Darren Collison).

If Harris is top-10, it's on the more subjective side of assessment, and it's being generous.

 

[somebody]

1 Chris Paul 23.76
2 Russell Westbrook 23.63
3 Derrick Rose 23.62
4 Deron Williams 21.19
5 Steve Nash 20.81
6 Tony Parker 20.44
7 Stephen Curry 19.46
8 Ramon Sessions 19.01
9 Lou Williams 18.93
10 Chauncey Billups 18.78
11 Rodney Stuckey 18.46
12 Ty Lawson 17.99
13 Andre Miller 17.89
14 Earl Boykins 17.62
15 Devin Harris 17.22
16 Rajon Rondo 17.11
17 Baron Davis 17.05
18 Raymond Felton 16.68
19 Kyle Lowry 16.51
20 Jose Calderon 16.38

Anyone notice who's not on that list?

Jason Kidd and Jose Barea.

There is, by some posters here, a bizarre and undying urge to upgrade Devin Harris, and I don't understand it.

 

[Chad Feldheimer]

I really really hate that deal. 1 year rental for Paul and we get nothing else while giving away Millsap, Hayward and a 1st round pick. Are you a Hornets fan?

Not at all. I wouldn't trade for Chris Paul if I were the Jazz unless it was a no brainer deal (like that assortment of average players proposed above, which the Hornets would immediately reject).Just putting up there for kicks and giggles. That's probably what you would have to give up to get him. Jazz were too afraid to lose a lot with DWill they traded him. I doubt they'd try that again with Chris Paul.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Anyone notice who's not on that list?

Jason Kidd and Jose Barea.

There is, by some posters here, a bizarre and undying urge to upgrade Devin Harris, and I don't understand it.

Yeah, why would you want to upgrade from a guy that is tickling 30, never made a team better, and was basically mediocre last year? Just silly.

 

[gregbroncs]

Not at all. I wouldn't trade for Chris Paul if I were the Jazz unless it was a no brainer deal (like that assortment of average players proposed above, which the Hornets would immediately reject).Just putting up there for kicks and giggles. That's probably what you would have to give up to get him. Jazz were too afraid to lose a lot with DWill they traded him. I doubt they'd try that again with Chris Paul.

I agree. Getting Paul at this stage is suicide for this team. They would have to trade most of the talent they have to get him then he will just leave because this team is not better than the NO team he would be leaving.

 

[LogGrad98]

Well he had more assists and rebounds than Harris last year and shot better percentages as well. Add in the fact that he just turned 21 less than a month ago and it's a no-brainer. Everyone talks about Collison on this board but Holiday is an infinitely better player.

The point is Harris is not a top 10 point guard and is pretty much average at best. When you add in other guys like Kidd, Andre Miller, Collison, Jennings, and a couple others, it appears Devin is about as average as you get. I'm not saying he's worse than those players but he's not done much to separate himself from those guys.

Agree whole-heartedly that Harris is not a top 10 PG, but he is a proven quantity. Sometimes the devil you know is better than the devil you don't, especially when our odds of getting a top 10 PG to replace him are pretty long.

But to put a second year player who has yet to prove anything and a rookie who has yet to play a game in your top 10 makes the list suspect. Kidd, Miller or even Collison or Jennings belong there over Irving and Holiday, imo, right now. That might change as those 2 play, but they sure as hell haven't earned a top 10 spot yet.

 

[somebody]

Yeah, why would you want to upgrade from a guy that is tickling 30, never made a team better, and was basically mediocre last year? Just silly.

One could make much the same objections about Kidd when he was in New Jersey. Jazz fans want the John Stockton / Deron Williams super-point guard trend to continue, but it's completely unnecessary especially when you can use our assets to make our team deeper and more well-rounded instead of dressing our point guard in gold. Notice who was right below Devin Harris on that list: Rajon Rondo.