Deron lumping himself in the same breath and kobe and lebron
- Thread starter Fishsticks
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Oh yeah, because teams around the league make a habit of trading 2 proven young big men, ultra efficient veteran PG and a proven "must double team" young wing (2012 GS pick) for a top 5 PG?
I'll say it slower since your parents obviously didn't have a burlap sack handy when you were born. If NJ ended up drafting Kanter and he ended up being Kevin Love lite, got the GS pick and that turned into some Durant-esque wing, Favors progressed into a defensive monster and averaged 18pts and 9rbs a game and Harris developed a 3 pt shot and team running abilities would they still have traded us for Deron Williams? NOPE!
If you think the Jazz made that trade based on what the pieces were at the time you're extremely slow mentally. If you think the Jazz would have gotten a better deal from someone else or by waiting, see the Denver/Carmelo deal.
But by all means, hop in your time machine and let us know how it all turns out.
In all honesty that's sort of unclear.
It could potentially put pressure on the owners but all it's going to take is a handful of bad experiences to make it obvious that playing stateside is better for everyone involved and actually weaken the players' position. For example: Some players that go overseas have a hard time actually getting paid because the owners are upset for one reason or another and essentially say "sue me." If that happened to even a single high-profile player and there as a public legal battle over non-payment the Euro option would be a significantly less credible threat than it is today.
As to the topic of Deron's standing in the league presently I don't think there's any real question he took a big step back last season. Personally I'd rate his performance as outside of the top-5 pgs in the leage last season (who were, in some order, Rose, Westbrook, Nash, Rondo, and Paul), which would obviously take him pretty far away from the top 10 players in the whole league.
7StraightIsGreat
Well-Known Member
I loved D-Will as much as the next guy when he was here, but let's face it, there were starting to be more and more red flags. I really started to re-evaluate my opinion of D-Will after the Hayward incident and it just seemed to spiral from there.
In the days after Jerry Sloan's resignation everybody affiliated with the Jazz were trying to say the right thing- that it wasn't Deron's fault. Some Jazz fans are still buying that, but I don't think I am anymore. The night Karl Malone showed up and basically put D-Will on blast, I wrote it off as Karl being Karl. But now, considering Deron was dealt a few days later and some of the lingering rumors of his locker room behavior, I believe Karl was right in just about everything he said.
Nobody will dispute Deron's talent, but I honestly believe that the team is breathing a sigh of relief that they no longer have to deal with his surliness or the Mello-like "will he or won't he" soap opera that was bound to come along with his contract situation.
The fact that KOC turned an unhappy D-Will into: Devin Harris, Derrick Favors, Enes Kanter and quite possibly another lottery pick in 2012 makes me think Utah's Front Office isn't missing Deron at all either. Again, he's a great talent and quite possibly the best PG in the NBA but I think because of his attitude, he is bound to play for multiple NBA teams and has a career that probably ends up being not as fulfilling as it should have been.
In the days after Jerry Sloan's resignation everybody affiliated with the Jazz were trying to say the right thing- that it wasn't Deron's fault. Some Jazz fans are still buying that, but I don't think I am anymore. The night Karl Malone showed up and basically put D-Will on blast, I wrote it off as Karl being Karl. But now, considering Deron was dealt a few days later and some of the lingering rumors of his locker room behavior, I believe Karl was right in just about everything he said.
Nobody will dispute Deron's talent, but I honestly believe that the team is breathing a sigh of relief that they no longer have to deal with his surliness or the Mello-like "will he or won't he" soap opera that was bound to come along with his contract situation.
The fact that KOC turned an unhappy D-Will into: Devin Harris, Derrick Favors, Enes Kanter and quite possibly another lottery pick in 2012 makes me think Utah's Front Office isn't missing Deron at all either. Again, he's a great talent and quite possibly the best PG in the NBA but I think because of his attitude, he is bound to play for multiple NBA teams and has a career that probably ends up being not as fulfilling as it should have been.
Good post.
Fishsticks
Banned
The last three posts are all stellar
Brown Notes
Well-Known Member
Deron is a franchise player. Yea he soured his fans in Utah by defying Sloan but he is good enough to compare himself to those guys. Some of the posts in this thread seem to be making him out to be DeShawn Stevenson, who really is an *******.
I remember Locke publishing "clutch" stats and D-Will was right up there with the big names at the top. When the game is on the line there are simply not very many players that are better. IMO as pissed as all Jazz fans are (and deservedly so) about how Deron handled 2010-11 it is silly to downplay how good he really is.
I remember Locke publishing "clutch" stats and D-Will was right up there with the big names at the top. When the game is on the line there are simply not very many players that are better. IMO as pissed as all Jazz fans are (and deservedly so) about how Deron handled 2010-11 it is silly to downplay how good he really is.
TheStormofWar
Well-Known Member
I read that story on ESPN. I don't see where Deron lumped himself in with Kobe and Lebron by simply talking about 'em. Not even close. It's a story about moves the players could do to undermine the owners in the lockout. In truth, that's a damn good idea from their perspective.
2010-2011 "Clutch" scoring numbers:https://www.82games.com/1011/CSORT11.HTM This is a per/48 minutes of clutch time stat with clutch time defined as "4th quarter or overtime, less than 5 minutes left, neither team ahead by more than 5 points."
For his time in Utah last season Deron was way down the list. Tied with Daniel Gibson and Gerald Henderson. His shooting percentage in those situations was 42.9% with a 3 point% of 30.8%.
The top five were Kobe Bryant, Derrick Rose, the Cleveland version of Mo Williams, Lebron James and Monte Ellis. Deron was 72nd.
2009-2010 was actually even worse from an efficiency perspective. https://www.82games.com/0910/CSORT11.HTM
37.5% FG in the clutch and 21.4% on threes.
The top five were Lebron, Kobe, Dirk, Carmelo, and Nash. Deron was 63rd.
The moral of the story: David Locke is still paid by the Jazz to produce things that make them look good.
replace Bosh with either Lebron or Kobe and I would agree