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2020 NBA trade deadline discussion

See you even call people don! No, I apologize, I do not want to have to experience your wrath. I’m sure it is quite scary.
 
So here it is:



David Axelrod hits the nail on the head where he says that we spent a lot on Conley, we spent a lot on a four year deal for Bogdanovic, that now is the time that we go all-in and not look to be a "cute" 50 win team (totally the impression I get from the FO and their surrogates, in my view), and he's surprised that we aren't banging on people's doors trying to make win-now moves. Woj counters saying that we're a team that doesn't make calls and we wait for people to call us.

Yes, I know we're going to get better.

Yes, I know Conley will be better.

Yes, I know the chemistry will come together a little better and we'll look better in the pack.

But FFS, we just traded for two years of Conley and have a window that will close. Lowe totally nailed it on us trying to be a "cute team." That kind of **** was acceptable when we were in team building mode, but now that we've switched gears to thinking we're a contender, the calculus completely changes, and I'm absolutely baffled why we think the exact same approach is how we do things. I mean, you handle turns much different than you do the straight-away. You don't just set the damn cruise control and say "nah, forget the dynamics, pick on strategy and hold steady."
 
infection said:
So here it is:



David Axelrod hits the nail on the head where he says that we spent a lot on Conley, we spent a lot on a four year deal for Bogdanovic, that now is the time that we go all-in and not look to be a "cute" 50 win team (totally the impression I get from the FO and their surrogates, in my view), and he's surprised that we aren't banging on people's doors trying to make win-now moves. Woj counters saying that we're a team that doesn't make calls and we wait for people to call us.

Yes, I know we're going to get better.

Yes, I know Conley will be better.

Yes, I know the chemistry will come together a little better and we'll look better in the pack.

But FFS, we just traded for two years of Conley and have a window that will close. Lowe totally nailed it on us trying to be a "cute team." That kind of **** was acceptable when we were in team building mode, but now that we've switched gears to thinking we're a contender, the calculus completely changes, and I'm absolutely baffled why we think the exact same approach is how we do things. I mean, you handle turns much different than you do the straight-away. You don't just set the damn cruise control and say "nah, forget the dynamics, pick on strategy and hold steady."
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DL has a reputation for being overly passive as a GM. Didn't some reporters say that Denver called DL during 2017 draft asking for a trade down in exchange for Lyles then he accepted it? I mean almost every year fans wanted DL to do something exciting and he usually came out disappointing.
 
jom2003 said:
DL has a reputation for being overly passive as a GM. Didn't some reporters say that Denver called DL during 2017 draft asking for a trade down in exchange for Lyles then he accepted it? I mean almost every year fans wanted DL to do something exciting and he usually came out disappointing.
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He is aggressive in the off season, passive mid season. A philosophy the Jazz management have always had. Contending teams have to be built in the off season.
 
Jazz4ever said:
He is aggressive in the off season, passive mid season. A philosophy the Jazz management have always had. Contending teams have to be built in the off season.
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Yet 2018 offseason was probably one of the most passive offseason in our franchise history.
 
infection said:
So here it is:



David Axelrod hits the nail on the head where he says that we spent a lot on Conley, we spent a lot on a four year deal for Bogdanovic, that now is the time that we go all-in and not look to be a "cute" 50 win team (totally the impression I get from the FO and their surrogates, in my view), and he's surprised that we aren't banging on people's doors trying to make win-now moves. Woj counters saying that we're a team that doesn't make calls and we wait for people to call us.

Yes, I know we're going to get better.

Yes, I know Conley will be better.

Yes, I know the chemistry will come together a little better and we'll look better in the pack.

But FFS, we just traded for two years of Conley and have a window that will close. Lowe totally nailed it on us trying to be a "cute team." That kind of **** was acceptable when we were in team building mode, but now that we've switched gears to thinking we're a contender, the calculus completely changes, and I'm absolutely baffled why we think the exact same approach is how we do things. I mean, you handle turns much different than you do the straight-away. You don't just set the damn cruise control and say "nah, forget the dynamics, pick on strategy and hold steady."
Click to expand...


The only thing I don't like is that Woj says we aren't a team that makes calls and we wait for people to call us... why? I have just been around business so long and know that you keep making calls and things come from it. Literally there have been times I have talked with someone 5-6 times and they had little interest in doing something and you send an email or make a call and they are like "glad you called I think we want to make a change". Like you don't think making a call to Vlade every day wouldn't have a payoff at some point.

This may not have been what Woj meant... but there is no doubt we are missing out if we aren't out there having discussions. Weird mentality... and I don't care if that is the "spurs way"... the Spurs were incredibly lucky and they didn't build their dynasty because they wait for people to come to them.
 
jom2003 said:
Yet 2018 offseason was probably one of the most passive offseason in our franchise history.
Click to expand...

Part of building depth is finding value and being active every offseason... Milwaukee added a guy like Connaughton on the cheap a couple years ago and it pays dividends now. Not a world changer, but not using cap exceptions in prior years hurts our current depth. Making all the changes in one offseason then zaps your cap assets and depth. We could have just kept Jae and it would have gone a long way (substitute Dante in the deal).

I think our front office has done awesome. We've stayed out of the lottery... we have added franchise players... had some missteps along the way. Our misses have been on the fringes. Don't want to be a negative Nancy. Ultimately our contender status is reliant on Donovan leveling up and Conley being really good. Even then I didn't know the Lakers and Clippers would be this good... so it may be irrelevant. We will be good, but we aren't a contender... not sure there is a missed step we could correct that would change that.
 
I don't think it matters much if we make a trade, but I'd like to see us play some of the young guys to see what we have. With the standard our bench players are setting I'm not sure there is a lot of benefit to be lost if the young guys suck... having a young guy pop could be one of those things that changes our fortunes. Imagine if David Lee stays healthy and the Warriors never quite figure out how to use Draymond?
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Part of building depth is finding value and being active every offseason... Milwaukee added a guy like Connaughton on the cheap a couple years ago and it pays dividends now. Not a world changer, but not using cap exceptions in prior years hurts our current depth. Making all the changes in one offseason then zaps your cap assets and depth. We could have just kept Jae and it would have gone a long way (substitute Dante in the deal).

I think our front office has done awesome. We've stayed out of the lottery... we have added franchise players... had some missteps along the way. Our misses have been on the fringes. Don't want to be a negative Nancy. Ultimately our contender status is reliant on Donovan leveling up and Conley being really good. Even then I didn't know the Lakers and Clippers would be this good... so it may be irrelevant. We will be good, but we aren't a contender... not sure there is a missed step we could correct that would change that.
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Funny you mentioned Milwaukee because they DID make a world changing acquisition in summer 2018 by signing Brook Lopez to a vet min, an offer that we could've easily put in if not completely outbidding them. Imagine what that would've done to our team and during the Rockets series. But DL signed Niang instead.
 
Zach Lowe:

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David Axelrod:

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jom2003 said:
Funny you mentioned Milwaukee because they DID make a world changing acquisition in summer 2018 by signing Brook Lopez to a vet min, an offer that we could've easily put in if not completely outbidding them. Imagine what that would've done to our team and during the Rockets series. But DL signed Niang instead.
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It was more than minimum... it was a 5M or so offer... your point stands. We don't have the superstar they do so a move like that doesn't change our world as much.

The bench shouldn't be this big of an issue and all I keep hearing is "well we paid Conley and Bojan so now you don't get depth".... weeeellllll we gave up some depth in Crowder Korver to retain Dante.... and we had exceptions that went unused in year's past that went unused in part because we didn't have a spot for them. So yeah... you can't build a bench in one offseason if you have a ton of other moves that use up your major assets.

Ed has been a big whiff thus far... I don't blame them for the move... it looked solid... bad luck. Same money could have landed Holmes who has been amazing in sacramento… if you asked me at the time I'd have likely taken Ed too.
 
jom2003 said:
Funny you mentioned Milwaukee because they DID make a world changing acquisition in summer 2018 by signing Brook Lopez to a vet min, an offer that we could've easily put in if not completely outbidding them. Imagine what that would've done to our team and during the Rockets series. But DL signed Niang instead.
Click to expand...

Lopez is enjoying the superstar gravity of Giannis to nail all his open 3s, he wouldn't be the same here. Malcom Brogdon's 3 pt% went from 42.6 to 34.7 after leaving Giannis for Indy (still a good player though).
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
It was more than minimum... it was a 5M or so offer... your point stands. We don't have the superstar they do so a move like that doesn't change our world as much.

The bench shouldn't be this big of an issue and all I keep hearing is "well we paid Conley and Bojan so now you don't get depth".... weeeellllll we gave up some depth in Crowder Korver to retain Dante.... and we had exceptions that went unused in year's past that went unused in part because we didn't have a spot for them. So yeah... you can't build a bench in one offseason if you have a ton of other moves that use up your major assets.

Ed has been a big whiff thus far... I don't blame them for the move... it looked solid... bad luck. Same money could have landed Holmes who has been amazing in sacramento… if you asked me at the time I'd have likely taken Ed too.
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Nah, it was 3mil, not 5 mil. And Ed move doesn't look good when you have a hole to fill on your PF spot. I was hoping he could play next to Rudy like the way Favs played. But he is too raw/unskilled even at the center spot, let alone playing forward. Management should've saw their development in Bradley and made better use of their MLE instead of spending it on Udoh replacement.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
It was more than minimum... it was a 5M or so offer... your point stands. We don't have the superstar they do so a move like that doesn't change our world as much.

The bench shouldn't be this big of an issue and all I keep hearing is "well we paid Conley and Bojan so now you don't get depth".... weeeellllll we gave up some depth in Crowder Korver to retain Dante.... and we had exceptions that went unused in year's past that went unused in part because we didn't have a spot for them. So yeah... you can't build a bench in one offseason if you have a ton of other moves that use up your major assets.

Ed has been a big whiff thus far... I don't blame them for the move... it looked solid... bad luck. Same money could have landed Holmes who has been amazing in sacramento… if you asked me at the time I'd have likely taken Ed too.
Click to expand...
I've been bitching about that for a while... mostly just the Exum trade issue. Everyone kept throwing out how foolish it would be to let him go, and how he could be special because of 5 minutes against Harden or something. But it's cost us Crowder and Korver. If we were willing to dump him for straight cap space, which many people said would be ludicrous, you could have landed a Patrick Patterson, a JaMychal Green, an Aminu, possibly a Morris, PLUS landing a Caruso. But yeah, let's wait for Exum to finish baking.
 
I think the Jazz will make a move. Last year, they moved Alec Burks for Kyle Korver. The year before they moved Rodney Hood for Jae Crowder. I think they'll make a similar move this year, probably Exum and one or two 2nds for someone with size, like Portis or Thad Young.
 
Jazz4ever said:
Lopez is enjoying the superstar gravity of Giannis to nail all his open 3s, he wouldn't be the same here. Malcom Brogdon's 3 pt% went from 42.6 to 34.7 after leaving Giannis for Indy (still a good player though).
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Giannis didn't elevate to superstar status until last season though. Before that we can make an effective argument about DM having the gravity comparable to Giannis(before his 2018 MVP season) after his historical rookie year. Different story now of course... And I honestly don't think it would matter have we offered Lopez twice as much as what Milwaukee offered him. Like 5-8 mil a year. Not that many players out there would say no to the money.
 
Catchall said:
I think the Jazz will make a move. Last year, they moved Alec Burks for Kyle Korver. The year before they moved Rodney Hood for Jae Crowder. I think they'll make a similar move this year, probably Exum and one or two 2nds for someone with size, like Portis or Thad Young.
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I'd be willing to forgive DL of all his Exum sins if he was ballsy enough to move him for someone that could actually improve the team, or at least play.
 
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