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2020 Annual All-Time NBA Draft

I just want to say the recency bias is horrible and there have been some really bad picks made this year. If Spy picks who he should here he’s just widening the lead he already had on all of us. Dude shouldn’t even be on the board.
 
White Chocolate said:
I just want to say the recency bias is horrible and there have been some really bad picks made this year. If Spy picks who he should here he’s just widening the lead he already had on all of us. Dude shouldn’t even be on the board.
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I'm just not sure how Bob Cousy would have faired against modern players.
 
Beer said:
I'm just not sure how Bob Cousy would have faired against modern players.
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Sounds like a personal problem. Like Khris Middleton? Zion Williamson? Klay in the top-25. Its all hilarious to me. Just terrible picks.
 
White Chocolate said:
Sounds like a personal problem. Like Khris Middleton? Zion Williamson? Klay in the top-25. Its all hilarious to me. Just terrible picks.
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Possibly don't disagree with those picks depending on who you are referencing. I'm an old game hater though.
 
Wes Mantooth said:
Great quality with Paul and Malone based on where you drafted them. Gobert is tough. I think a couple rounds later would’ve felt more appropriate. I don’t know.
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I don't want to under-value a 2x DPOY (should be 3x) who was in the top 5 in the league in offensive efficiency both of those years. At the time I didn't see anything that much better that fit my plan.
 
Thee jazz fan said:
Agreed. I got killed on here for drafting Cousy in the 9th round one year.

we should do a pre-80’s draft. I think that would be fun and pretty fair.
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We did a Legends last year, only people who are no longer playing.

I ran it, and won it, I believe. No correlation, I actually tried to handicap myself, but I ended up with Russell, Magic, and Jordan. You can see why I won.
 
gandalfe said:
We did a Legends last year, only people who are no longer playing.

I ran it, and won it, I believe. No correlation, I actually tried to handicap myself, but I ended up with Russell, Magic, and Jordan. You can see why I won.
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But still your going to draft mostly players from mid 80’s, 90’s, 2000’s.

something we can try is maybe forcing drafters to be obligated to draft so many players from each era, I don’t know.
 
Beer said:
I'm just not sure how Bob Cousy would have faired against modern players.
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I think we have to be careful with this kind of comparison. I mean, these guys were all-world athletes in their eras, all the while most of them smoked, the training facilities, although cutting edge at that time, were YMCA gyms compared to modern facilities. They didn't have the benefits of modern nutritionists, 60+ years of basketball knowledge and experience in coaching. They didn't have people who specialized in nothing but perfecting their shot, or footwork, or what-have-you. Give any of them these modern advantages and how much better would they have been?

Also I am not a fan of the "but the league was small, there was no competition" argument. I would actually argue their competition was much stronger. The talent at the time was concentrated into fewer teams. They faced multiple all-star and all-league level players in every single game, not just maybe 1 or 2 with a bunch of role players around them. Now the talent is diluted. Imagine how much stronger the teams would be if we shrink the league today to say 20 teams. Or even 25.

Imagine Wilt with modern gym facilities, trainers, nutritionists, coaches. Summer skill programs. He would have been Shaq-and-a-half. He would likely have been far more dominant than anything we have seen.

So if we are comparing eras and thinking about dropping them all into the same arena, we have to give them the credit of the same inputs and acknowledge that the players of previous eras would just be that much better as the support facilities and staff around them improved.
 
Thee jazz fan said:
But still your going to draft mostly players from mid 80’s, 90’s, 2000’s.

something we can try is maybe forcing drafters to be obligated to draft so many players from each era, I don’t know.
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Trying to mesh and compare players from the 60's and today is like trying to combine cricket and MLB players. It's just not possible. They are pretty much different sports.
 
LogGrad98 said:
Imagine Wilt with modern gym facilities, trainers, nutritionists, coaches. Summer skill programs. He would have been Shaq-and-a-half. He would likely have been far more dominant than anything we have seen.
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I'm sorry but I don't believe that for one second.
 
Beer said:
I'm sorry but I don't believe that for one second.
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What is your argument against it then? Do you deny that better nutrition and training and coaching can make a player better? Are you saying that the nutrition, training, and coaching of the 60's was exactly equivalent to that of today?
 
LogGrad98 said:
What is your argument against it then? Do you deny that better nutrition and training and coaching can make a player better? Are you saying that the nutrition, training, and coaching of the 60's was exactly equivalent to that of today?
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Sure, Wilt probably would have been an NBA player still, maybe an All Star, hell maybe even a HOF'er. But to say he would have been Shaq and a half is ridiculous. I think Wilt is one who's sheer size and athleticism would have allowed him to be an NBA guy in any generation. There are lot of NBA legends that wouldn't have sniffed the league, probably not even D1, if they were born in 1995 instead just because they weren't big or athletic enough.

Listen to this if you have a minute. It's very interesting. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...yers-of-all-time/id1483267868?i=1000474186426

Their arguments for Wilt being overrated are 1. The stats are so BS in his era because of the pace of play, the lack of skill, the fact guys played the entire game every game, the style of his play. It's pretty interesting.

Isaiah Thomas, Allen Iverson, and Wilt are their top 3 overrated of all time guys.
 
Beer said:
Sure, Wilt probably would have been an NBA player still, maybe an All Star, hell maybe even a HOF'er. But to say he would have been Shaq and a half is ridiculous. I think Wilt is one who's sheer size and athleticism would have allowed him to be an NBA guy in any generation. There are lot of NBA legends that wouldn't have sniffed the league, probably not even D1, if they were born in 1995 instead just because they weren't big or athletic enough.

Listen to this if you have a minute. It's very interesting. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...yers-of-all-time/id1483267868?i=1000474186426

Their arguments for Wilt being overrated are 1. The stats are so BS in his era because of the pace of play, the lack of skill, the fact guys played the entire game every game, the style of his play. It's pretty interesting.

Isaiah Thomas, Allen Iverson, and Wilt are their top 3 overrated of all time guys.
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I think that is still underrating what modern advantages would have meant to many of these top players. But I see the argument.
 
Beer said:
Sure, Wilt probably would have been an NBA player still, maybe an All Star, hell maybe even a HOF'er. But to say he would have been Shaq and a half is ridiculous. I think Wilt is one who's sheer size and athleticism would have allowed him to be an NBA guy in any generation. There are lot of NBA legends that wouldn't have sniffed the league, probably not even D1, if they were born in 1995 instead just because they weren't big or athletic enough.

Listen to this if you have a minute. It's very interesting. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...yers-of-all-time/id1483267868?i=1000474186426

Their arguments for Wilt being overrated are 1. The stats are so BS in his era because of the pace of play, the lack of skill, the fact guys played the entire game every game, the style of his play. It's pretty interesting.

Isaiah Thomas, Allen Iverson, and Wilt are their top 3 overrated of all time guys.
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Wow! I usually like your takes but this is by far your worst one.

Wilt used to dominate Magic and the Lakers in the early 80’s at UCLA. He was in his 40’s too. Wilt is underrated if anything. I just think it’s funny that someone like Babe Ruth is so well respected but not Wilt Chamberlain.
 
LogGrad98 said:
I think that is still underrating what modern advantages would have meant to many of these top players. But I see the argument.
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I don't completely disagree its just impossible to quantify. I have a hard time believing Dwight Howard placed in 1965 doesn't do exactly what Wilt did and is Dwight even considered a top 100 player, let alone top 10 like Wilt?
 
White Chocolate said:
Wow! I usually like your takes but this is by far your worst one.

Wilt used to dominate Magic and the Lakers in the early 80’s at UCLA. He was in his 40’s too. Wilt is underrated if anything. I just think it’s funny that someone like Babe Ruth is so well respected but not Wilt Chamberlain.
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You know one of the most unreliable forms of evidence in a criminal case is an eyewitness right. People like to remember what they want and romanticize the past. Wilt not allowing NBA stars to score at all in his 40's in a pickup game is a fun but silly story. Ever listen to your dad and grandpa tell stories and absolutely know for a fact they a complete bs even though they aren't necessarily lying? Same thing.
 
Beer said:
I don't completely disagree its just impossible to quantify. I have a hard time believing Dwight Howard placed in 1965 doesn't do exactly what Wilt did and is Dwight even considered a top 100 player, let alone top 10 like Wilt?
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This is a chicken and egg scenario. Is Dwight simply a better athlete from the level of the DNA or is he just as much a product of the machine that makes athletes into what they are in the modern era? No doubt he would be a stellar athlete, but I think Wilt would be that much better again today with the same modern advantages, for example.

And yes, it is impossible to quantify, it is an interesting thought exercise however.
 
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