Either Conley goes or DL you choose...

[homeytennis]

If DL gets sacked who is going to take that kak out of the oven and tell us out how it turned out?

 

[416Klawzz]

If DL gets sacked who is going to take that kak out of the oven and tell us out how it turned out?

Better is out there

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Since 2013, DL had 2 home run wins, 1 good pick in Rodney hood and the rest are entirely misses.

Boston since 2013 has 1 home run pick in Tatum(Tatum himself is solid, but they've got one additional pick from Fultz trade too), 4 good picks in Brown, KO, Smart and Rozier.

Let's say DM and Tatum cancel each other out, would you take Rudy+Hood over Brown+Smart+Rozer+Olynyk?

I won't.

And Robert Williams is a wait and see, sure. But in his second season he's already been contributing to Boston's playoff run at a high level. would you want him on our team, or any of the "wait and sees" (aka SCRUBs) in Bradley, Tucker, Oni, NWG or Brantley?

Warriors FO took Curry, Klay and Draymond in the draft that led to a dynasty but sure you only wanna talk about 2013 onwards in which they consistently had either picks in the late first/second round or no picks at all. Then besides Paschall, they also have taken Kevon Looney at 30th pick who is a solid role player in this league and performed well above average for players taken at that spot.

Same case for OKC, but this time it is Sam Presti who also happens to be the same guy that drafted three MVPs for OKC and all you wanna talk about is his record since 2013 in which he only had 2 picks in the lottery(DL by comparison had 4). And Presti nailed them both. Both Steven Adams and Sabonis turned out to be solid players and performed way better than their positions. I'd even consider Sabonis to be a home-run win because of how weak the 2016 draft was and he's already an all-star on his 4th season. Plus Andre Roberson before his injuries also provided good values for a guy taken at #26.

Could Presti have taken other players that are better? Yes. But it doesn't negate the fact that these are solid selections.

Like I said, DL had 4 picks in the lotto since 2013. And would you likewise consider Burke, Lyles and Dante to be solid selections at the position they were taken? No?

Memphis similarly had only 2 picks in the lottery since 2013. And they nailed them both. You now call JJJ and JA no-brainers, but surely you just can't miss those no-brainer pick, such as an Aussie kid who was touted as the Australian Kobe back in 2014, right?

Besides JJJ and JA, they also got Dillon Brooks and Brandon Clarke. Both these guys are starting caliber players in this league already and considered solid selections for the positions in which they were selected. I'd consider Clarke to be a home-run win given how well he's played in the minutes he's given and i just don't see why he won't keep on improving and have a career similar to Domanta Sabonis.

You can only talk about from 2013 on... because that is when DL took over... if we went back to 2010ish time period he'd have some more wins.

Some of those teams are getting their home runs in the top 4 picks... it is so much harder from say pick 8 on. Exum was a bust... gets a blackeye on that one. Burke didn't turn out well. Lyles is kind of the expected value of pick #12 unfortunately.

Point is since 2013 he's right there with the guys you mentioned and didn't have the luxury of super high picks or 2-3 first rounders every year like Danny. So his draft record is not **** at all. He's done as well as anyone.

Even the Dante pick doesn't look that bad in reverse... he was highly rated by many people. Smart refused to workout for us... so do we take Randle... we could have him right now if we wanted while he is in his prime.

Drafting well is part skill and part luck... you hope to get it right more often than you **** it up. He has gotten a couple picks very right.

 

[jom2003]

Drafting I would say is one of DL's good points... we sold some picks which made me upset but that may have been more of Greggy's pocketbook. Didn't love the Lyles pick but understood it... The TB pick is the only total head scratcher imo. Half the league passed on Giannis.

Not utilizing his cap space to improve the team in the Haywood era is one of the big marks against him. That may have been Greg too. He botched the Haywood negotiation not understanding what the cap was going to do (everyone knew it was going to go crazy but teams were slow to make decisions based on it).

The one year rental pg carousel is his biggest issue. There are a lot of moving parts to that, but I think most of it can be traced to DL in some form or fashion.

He's helped put a culture in place here too. Would I rather have Ujiri or Riley? Yes! The tier of guys below that is where I'd put DL, Morey, Ainge, etc.

DL had much more opportunities in the draft since 2013 than teams like Memphis and Golden State. But has he performed significantly better than these two teams given the number of quality picks he's gotten? I don't think so. He's had a couple of "home run" picks in DM and Rudy, but he also has had several real HARD misses that's gotta deserve points off the board.

In 7 seasons, he's gotten 5 lottery picks, he traded 1 and kept 4. Besides a denver bail out, DL didn't even have a Steven Adams or Kelly Olynyk type of decent hit(could've taken someone who is better, but they are fine being where they are), but Trey Burke, Lyles, Dante Exum type of HARD misses.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

DL had much more opportunities in the draft since 2013 than teams like Memphis and Golden State. But has he performed significantly better than these two teams given the number of quality picks he's gotten? I don't think so. He's had a couple of "home run" picks in DM and Rudy, but he also has had several real HARD misses that's gotta deserve points off the board. Not even a Steven Adams or Kelly Olynyk type of decent pick(could've taken someone better, but they are fine being where they are), but Trey Burke, Lyles, Dante Exum type of HARD misses.

He hasn't had the same opportunities as Memphis at all... they had a top 4 and top 2 pick in back to back drafts. Memphis also whiffed on like 3 guys to go with Brandon Clarke (who is a very old rookie and may not have the ceiling you think).

What have the Warriors done? They whiffed on 4 straight first rounders unless you think Looney is the ****. Paschall is good but lets see how well he does on a team that is trying to win something.

There are plenty of reasons to criticize DL... draft record really isn't one.

 

[jom2003]

You can only talk about from 2013 on... because that is when DL took over... if we went back to 2010ish time period he'd have some more wins.

Some of those teams are getting their home runs in the top 4 picks... it is so much harder from say pick 8 on. Exum was a bust... gets a blackeye on that one. Burke didn't turn out well. Lyles is kind of the expected value of pick #12 unfortunately.

Point is since 2013 he's right there with the guys you mentioned and didn't have the luxury of super high picks or 2-3 first rounders every year like Danny. So his draft record is not **** at all. He's done as well as anyone.

Even the Dante pick doesn't look that bad in reverse... he was highly rated by many people. Smart refused to workout for us... so do we take Randle... we could have him right now if we wanted while he is in his prime.

Drafting well is part skill and part luck... you hope to get it right more often than you **** it up. He has gotten a couple picks very right.

Lyles is definitely NOT an expected value for #12 pick. Even Denver's player development program couldn't save him. This season he's averaged worse numbers in more PT. His next contract will probably be somewhere in China. Steven Adams and Olynyk are guys more representative of a #12 pick player. Or Kevon Looney before his injury, but Warriors stole him with #30.

And I think I've said enough, DL has had MUCH MORE opportunities than you think. If you give 5 lottery picks to any GM over a 7 year-span, i don't think anyone would've done any worse. Even the Suns that fired their entire FO a season ago, picked TJ warren and Devin Booker with #13 and #14. It's not a tough ask.

 

[prodigy]

Thunders, Raptors, Celtics, Warriors, Nuggets, Grizz, and you can throw Lakers in there too, since they've found Kuz, Josh Hart and Thomas Bryant in one draft, but their player development has been ****

I would throw the spurs in there even though the Lonnie Walker pick hasn't quite panned out yet, mostly due to injury hurting his development.

Derrick White was there and we traded up to take... Tony freaking Bradley

 

[jom2003]

He hasn't had the same opportunities as Memphis at all... they had a top 4 and top 2 pick in back to back drafts. Memphis also whiffed on like 3 guys to go with Brandon Clarke (who is a very old rookie and may not have the ceiling you think).

What have the Warriors done? They whiffed on 4 straight first rounders unless you think Looney is the ****. Paschall is good but lets see how well he does on a team that is trying to win something.

There are plenty of reasons to criticize DL... draft record really isn't one.

Memphis had less opportunities than us. C'mon now. If you look prior to 2018, what kind of draft picks they've got?

2013: #41
2014: #22
2015: #25
2016: #17 and #57
2017: #35 and #45

And DL had #9, #5, #12, #12, #13 during this same span... Memphis literally took a pivot from the "Gritt n Grind" in 2018 and rebuilt their entire squad in two seasons, whereas it took DL 4 seasons to find Mitchell in the draft after taking Rudy with the help of Nuggets.

 

[prodigy]

I think DL has done a good job of somewhat making up for his draft flubs but its also a reason why we had a depth issue. He also let Neto go so he could sign.. Nigel Williams Goss? I don't get it.

 

[jom2003]

I would throw the spurs in there even though the Lonnie Walker pick hasn't quite panned out yet, mostly due to injury hurting his development.

Derrick White was there and we traded up to take... Tony freaking Bradley

yeah, cuz Mr. Handlogten wanna set the timeline to be 2013 and beyond, in which teams like Memphis, GSW and Spurs were constantly stuck with picks between #25 and #60. But they still managed to steal solid rotation pieces like Dillon Brooks, Derrick White, Dejounte Murray, and Kevon Looney. All are better players than a injury-prone Rodney Hood who we traded for a bag of chips. And don't even get me started on Bradley, Neto, Hanlan, Wallace, Bolomboy, NWG, ****

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Memphis had less opportunities than us. C'mon now. If you look prior to 2018, what kind of draft picks they've got?

2013: #41
2014: #22
2015: #25
2016: #17 and #57
2017: #35 and #45

And DL had #9, #5, #12, #12, #13 during this same span... Memphis literally took a pivot from the "Gritt n Grind" in 2018 and rebuilt their entire squad in two seasons, whereas it took DL 4 seasons to find Mitchell in the draft after taking Rudy with the help of Nuggets.

How'd they do with those picks?

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

yeah, cuz Mr. Handlogten wanna set the timeline to be 2013 and beyond, in which teams like Memphis, GSW and Spurs were constantly stuck with picks between #25 and #60. But they still managed to steal solid rotation pieces like Dillon Brooks, Derrick White, Dejounte Murray, and Kevon Looney. All are better players than a injury-prone Rodney Hood who we traded for a bag of chips. And don't even get me started on Bradley, Neto, Hanlan, Wallace, Bolomboy, NWG, ****

that is when DL started... if you go back 10 years like you did when talking about OKC drafting 3 mvps then yeah DL likely pulls a few more rabbits out of his hat.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I think DL has done a good job of somewhat making up for his draft flubs but its also a reason why we had a depth issue. He also let Neto go so he could sign.. Nigel Williams Goss? I don't get it.

Actually Neto had a slightly higher cap hold so he cut him to clear the needed space to sign Bojan.

I would say maximizing cap space and general salary management has been DL's bigger issue.

We can all use hindsight to point at misses... but he drafted two all stars outside of the top 10. One in the late first round... the draft range where Jom is throwing a fit that its unfair to judge GS and Memphis for drafting poorly.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

yeah, cuz Mr. Handlogten wanna set the timeline to be 2013 and beyond, in which teams like Memphis, GSW and Spurs were constantly stuck with picks between #25 and #60. But they still managed to steal solid rotation pieces like Dillon Brooks, Derrick White, Dejounte Murray, and Kevon Looney. All are better players than a injury-prone Rodney Hood who we traded for a bag of chips. And don't even get me started on Bradley, Neto, Hanlan, Wallace, Bolomboy, NWG, ****

Wait... you snuck Looney in there... Really Looney is better than Hood... and Hood is injury prone but looney is not.

I mean these are the examples you gave as better... Jazz are very comparable... it likely means there are 20+teams that drafted worse... so DL draft record is not ****. That's all I'm saying.

 

[jom2003]

How'd they do with those picks?

They turned all those picks into Dillon Brooks, which is still better than all the non-lotto picks that DL's used. Not to mention the two back to back lotto picks in the last two years which they managed to get their franchise cornerstones in Ja and JJJ. If you let DL use those two picks who is to say that he won't select Bamba and Barrett?

 

[jom2003]

Wait... you snuck Looney in there... Really Looney is better than Hood... and Hood is injury prone but looney is not.

I mean these are the examples you gave as better... Jazz are very comparable... it likely means there are 20+teams that drafted worse... so DL draft record is not ****. That's all I'm saying.

Both Looney and Hood are role players in this league with injury concerns. But I'd definitely give Looney the edge because of his unique skillset that holds great values in today's NBA. A streaky bucket-getter like Hood who doesn't play defense literally comes out every year. But how often do you see a small ball 5 like Looney who could guard multiple positions on the floor?

 

[jom2003]

that is when DL started... if you go back 10 years like you did when talking about OKC drafting 3 mvps then yeah DL likely pulls a few more rabbits out of his hat.

Drafting 3 good players in 7 yrs is not a good draft record no matter how you look at it. Especially considering that we had 5 lottos in these 7 seasons. It's not like we are the Spurs or GSW that consistently stuck with picks in the late first or second round. Like I says, even the Suns that had one of the worst FO in the league was able to get Booker and TJ Warren with 2 late lotto picks. DL definitely underperformed given the number of quality picks he's had.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

They turned all those picks into Dillon Brooks, which is still better than all the non-lotto picks that DL's used.

Brooks is better than Rudy... interesting take guy

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Drafting 3 good players in 7 yrs is not a good draft record no matter how you look at it. Especially considering that we had 5 lottos in these 7 seasons. It's not like we are the Spurs or GSW that consistently stuck with picks in the late first or second round. Like I says, even the Suns that had one of the worst FO in the league was able to get Booker and TJ Warren with 2 late lotto picks. DL definitely underperformed given the number of quality picks he's had.

Yeah I mean the suns have never ****ed up a draft... oh wait they drafted Bender, Jackson, Chriss, and passed on a future MVP for a guy who is likely a very solid center but may never even make an all star game.

We didn’t always have picks in the past 7 years either... compare hit percentage and we are way better than a lot of the teams you mention.

 

[416Klawzz]

He hasn't had the same opportunities as Memphis at all... they had a top 4 and top 2 pick in back to back drafts. Memphis also whiffed on like 3 guys to go with Brandon Clarke (who is a very old rookie and may not have the ceiling you think).

What have the Warriors done? They whiffed on 4 straight first rounders unless you think Looney is the ****. Paschall is good but lets see how well he does on a team that is trying to win something.

There are plenty of reasons to criticize DL... draft record really isn't one.

He hasn't had the same opportunities as Memphis because he traded it all of it away for Conley. Stupid turd DL, keep selling us crap and Gayle keeps buying it.