Can We Please Just Waive NWG?

[KqWIN]

I'm not sure how much we can read into intel being the reason 30 teams aren't signing him. He's not going to be an all-star. He's going to be a rotation defensive piece (what they tried to sell us on Exum being). The bigger issue here is fit -- we have a need and he's the kind of guy we need. If I'm the Bulls GM, I have no interest in buying wallpaper while I'm busy pouring a foundation. If I'm the Clippers I have a lot of guys who play perimeter defense and I have no need for a minimum guy from Chicago. If I'm Minnesota I know my team sucks and we have much bigger fish to fry. If I'm Miami, I've got a lot of guys who guard the perimeter, including my star player. If I'm New York, it's going to take a lot more than a defensive piece off the bench to put out the dumpster fire. If I'm the Lakers, I have the luxury of finding exactly who I want.

90% of the league doesn't need someone like Shaq. So to say 30 NBA teams know something is misleading. It's more a question of why aren't teams like Utah and Portland signing him. And the answer to the former is more complicated than saying there's a flaw with Shaq. It's because they're holding on to guys that they, for whatever reason, have valued higher. And if you don't think we have a track record of overvaluing our guys compared to other, better options around the league, then I'm not sure what to tell you.

This is 100% about fit.

I completely disagree. Shaq is the player every team in the league needs. A versatile, disruptive defender that can guard multiple positions, potentially play multiple positions on offense, and also potentially shoot. That is what every team in the league needs.

Shaq is the most obvious, "WE SHOULD SIGN THIS GUY" out there. There's no question about it. I'm just not naïve to think that there is a reason why he hasn't signed yet.

 

[Hekate]

That’s all fair and good but half the time I watch Thybulle I see a guy that is disruptive and the other half of the time I see a guy that is a cat chasing a laser pointer and gambling too much.

I think they are in the same class of player even if Matisse is a better defender... because Shaq can do more with the ball.

And again... I know you are with me here... but why the **** would you keep NWG over getting this guy? And he is super duper gettable. I know the front office has more data and info but I’m also
aware that the still **** up constantly.

Shaq has higher usage but it's hard to get usage playing with Embiid and Simmons. Even with that Matisse has shown some point-forward potential and their shooting is a wash. Thybulle is inconsistent but attempted higher no of shots and made %36. I didn't watch Shaq with as much attention so I can't comment on his consistency. FT goes to Shaq but I believe Matisse has a better form.

They can sign him without waiving NWG so I don't know why. The tax thing is bothering me. Just gotta wait and see. I also expected him to sign till now which is weird. He would fill a role on quite a few teams.

 

[Getting Traded]

Maybe NWG is one of those high-IQ but not so good players like Niang, and they function almost like assistant coaches as well as players ??? It would seem there are many players out there who are more athletic and have much greater upside but the Jazz are sticking with them. Teams like guys like that. For instance, look how teams have kept guys like Vince Carter and Udonis Haslem way past their prime.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Shaq has higher usage but it's hard to get usage playing with Embiid and Simmons. Even with that Matisse has shown some point-forward potential and their shooting is a wash. Thybulle is inconsistent but attempted higher no of shots and made %36. I didn't watch Shaq with as much attention so I can't comment on his consistency. FT goes to Shaq but I believe Matisse has a better form.

They can sign him without waiving NWG so I don't know why. The tax thing is bothering me. Just gotta wait and see. I also expected him to sign till now which is weird. He would fill a role on quite a few teams.

Thybulle can’t really dribble or drive and Shaq can masquerade as a point guard... I don’t think that is a function of playing with guys like Simmons and Embiid.

I wanted a striking name to compare to him... its why I used Matisse.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

You're right, Shaq Harrison is a completely obvious signing. He's a not a secret by any means, nobody is on an island alone by vouching for him. Every online basketball nerd is wanting their team to sign him.

Again, I can't stress this enough. It's every single team in the league. The reason why I'm bringing that up time and time again is that people think this is UTA related snub. It is not. It is a league wide snub.

When something is this obvious, but no team will touch him, I understand that there is something that I don't know. Does that mean the teams are right and the nerds are wrong, no...But I can at least acknowledge that there is something I don't know. It could be something like demanding more money or guaranteed playing time. For all we know, the Jazz are dying to sign him but he doesn't see the minutes there behind Donovan, Conley, Clarkson ect that he wants. Maybe he's deciding between 10 different and taking his time.

It may or may not be a league wide snub... he might have several minimum offers on the table and he’s waiting for the right one to flesh out. I’m saying he’s super gettable at this point and even if it’s more than a minimum we should go get him. I think our front office has thrown in the towel and is just focused on our guys at this point. They have a history of casting a narrow net and locking in on one or two guys and then staying with it even when they shouldn’t.

It also isn’t just a Shaq thing. There are a handful of players we could bring in that are clearly better prospects than NWG.

I think there is a lazy/easy element to it and a personal component to it... NWG seems like a great person... It’s like if you were the boss and Harry from shipping is not great and he will never be management material but you know what he’s a great guy and I know his family... we could bring in this guy Jeff who is a great candidate to do more but is also solid when it comes to shipping. We already have a shipping department manager so it’s fine to keep NWG... saves me an awkward conversation too.
Then your shipping manager leaves for a different job and you are left promoting Harry or bringing in outside help... but the outside help will require a big bonus to bring over now and there aren’t any candidates... man I wish we had hired Jeff.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Maybe NWG is one of those high-IQ but not so good players like Niang, and they function almost like assistant coaches as well as players ??? It would seem there are many players out there who are more athletic and have much greater upside but the Jazz are sticking with them. Teams like guys like that. For instance, look how teams have kept guys like Vince Carter and Udonis Haslem way past their prime.

As much **** as Niang gets he has an nba skill... he shoots the piss out of the ball.

 

[Jazzmix]

Maybe NWG is one of those high-IQ but not so good players like Niang, and they function almost like assistant coaches as well as players ??? It would seem there are many players out there who are more athletic and have much greater upside but the Jazz are sticking with them. Teams like guys like that. For instance, look how teams have kept guys like Vince Carter and Udonis Haslem way past their prime.

Well, you can keep Vince Carter on your team because he is still able to play 5 min once in a while and he is a mentor and walking legend who can teach young players. NWG may have 180 BBIQ but it doesnt mean any young guy would even bother listening to him.

 

[infection]

It may or may not be a league wide snub... he might have several minimum offers on the table and he’s waiting for the right one to flesh out. I’m saying he’s super gettable at this point and even if it’s more than a minimum we should go get him. I think our front office has thrown in the towel and is just focused on our guys at this point. They have a history of casting a narrow net and locking in on one or two guys and then staying with it even when they shouldn’t.

It also isn’t just a Shaq thing. There are a handful of players we could bring in that are clearly better prospects than NWG.

I think there is a lazy/easy element to it and a personal component to it... NWG seems like a great person... It’s like if you were the boss and Harry from shipping is not great and he will never be management material but you know what he’s a great guy and I know his family... we could bring in this guy Jeff who is a great candidate to do more but is also solid when it comes to shipping. We already have a shipping department manager so it’s fine to keep NWG... saves me an awkward conversation too.
Then your shipping manager leaves for a different job and you are left promoting Harry or bringing in outside help... but the outside help will require a big bonus to bring over now and there aren’t any candidates... man I wish we had hired Jeff.

DL is on record saying that he does not like the off-season and the trade deadline because he does not like moving people and the whole relationship thing. Of course, you could say this is just PR speak, but every single move he makes (or doesn't make, rather) screams this. The question is, to what degree do we sacrifice improvement to accommodate this?

 

[Hekate]

Thybulle can’t really dribble or drive and Shaq can masquerade as a point guard... I don’t think that is a function of playing with guys like Simmons and Embiid.

I wanted a striking name to compare to him... its why I used Matisse.

Well, it was contraversial. That's why I jumped in, lol.

Not much spacing with Embiid, Horford and Simmons so there is some function but tertiary ballhandler would fit better than point forward. He has some skill and a long way to go. I expect him to be much better this season.

 

[KqWIN]

It may or may not be a league wide snub... he might have several minimum offers on the table and he’s waiting for the right one to flesh out. I’m saying he’s super gettable at this point and even if it’s more than a minimum we should go get him. I think our front office has thrown in the towel and is just focused on our guys at this point. They have a history of casting a narrow net and locking in on one or two guys and then staying with it even when they shouldn’t.

It also isn’t just a Shaq thing. There are a handful of players we could bring in that are clearly better prospects than NWG.

I think there is a lazy/easy element to it and a personal component to it... NWG seems like a great person... It’s like if you were the boss and Harry from shipping is not great and he will never be management material but you know what he’s a great guy and I know his family... we could bring in this guy Jeff who is a great candidate to do more but is also solid when it comes to shipping. We already have a shipping department manager so it’s fine to keep NWG... saves me an awkward conversation too.
Then your shipping manager leaves for a different job and you are left promoting Harry or bringing in outside help... but the outside help will require a big bonus to bring over now and there aren’t any candidates... man I wish we had hired Jeff.

If he's super gettable, than every team has passed on him. If he's not, than he's looking for something PT, money, location ect that we may or not provide. One more time...If you're saying this is Jazz specific incompetence that's preventing them from making a move like this, I really don't see it. If the Jazz could get him, then the rest of the league can also get him and are choosing not to.

So all this fluff about the Jazz being conservative or being in love with NWG as the reasons why he isn't signed....big nothing burger to me. There's something about Shaq that is preventing all teams from signing him. Not just UTA.

I also thing it's false that the Jazz cast a narrow net. In fact, they are well known for casting a wide net and holding their own minicamps for FAs and work out more players for the draft than just about anyone. This is how they found Royce, Ingles, ect. Casting a wide net. I would agree that they are focused on their own guys at this point. But that is part of the process. To find guys, you have to believe in them. Sometimes you get Royce, sometimes Niang, and sometimes NWG. The belief/concern calculation isn't that different for NWG and Ingles. The reasons why you would like or dislike NWG as an unproven player are about the same as an unproven Ingles. That not my read on things, but it's also not without reason.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Well, it was contraversial. That's why I jumped in, lol.

Not much spacing with Embiid, Horford and Simmons so there is some function but tertiary ballhandler would fit better than point forward. He has some skill and a long way to go. I expect him to be much better this season.

The defensive splits being so similar just help show how disruptive he is... just want people to know he's an elite perimeter defender... not just a hustler Ellijah Millsap type.

The interesting thing is he could be used in multiple positions on or off ball and can guard 1-3. He has a definite NBA skill you can bank on. The other stuff is interesting and if he refines/develops he's got potential for more.

 

[jom2003]

I'm not sure how much we can read into intel being the reason 30 teams aren't signing him. He's not going to be an all-star. He's going to be a rotation defensive piece (what they tried to sell us on Exum being). The bigger issue here is fit -- we have a need and he's the kind of guy we need. If I'm the Bulls GM, I have no interest in buying wallpaper while I'm busy pouring a foundation. If I'm the Clippers I have a lot of guys who play perimeter defense and I have no need for a minimum guy from Chicago. If I'm Minnesota I know my team sucks and we have much bigger fish to fry. If I'm Miami, I've got a lot of guys who guard the perimeter, including my star player. If I'm New York, it's going to take a lot more than a defensive piece off the bench to put out the dumpster fire. If I'm the Lakers, I have the luxury of finding exactly who I want.

90% of the league doesn't need someone like Shaq. So to say 30 NBA teams know something is misleading. It's more a question of why aren't teams like Utah and Portland signing him. And the answer to the former is more complicated than saying there's a flaw with Shaq. It's because they're holding on to guys that they, for whatever reason, have valued higher. And if you don't think we have a track record of overvaluing our guys compared to other, better options around the league, then I'm not sure what to tell you.

This is 100% about fit.

Exactly. He was a 10min bench guy coming from one of the worst teams in the league. And that team just waived him for nothing. I won't overreact to teams not being interested as if we are looking at a starter caliber player. He fills an obvious need here but teams in today's NBA actually prioritize perimeter defense because they don't funnel everything to the big man inside so what he brings seem valuable to us but rather redundant to other contending teams.