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The Thriller said:
If his intent was to help students understand different perspectives then his lack of grace certainly was a poor strategy. Isn’t it common sense that insulting and antagonizing an audience doesn’t exactly encourage listening and understanding? If his intent was to antagonize people while making himself out to be a victim, then I guess he succeeded.

I don’t see why one can’t expect better behavior from an audience while admitting that a JUDGE shouldn’t antagonize his audience. Instead, He acted like your typical Fedsoc entitled judge, unaccountable for his behavior (i. e. Brett Kavanaugh). Remember now, He was a guest at their school. If you can’t show grace and speak to pacify an audience that might not be enthusiastic to your speaking, then you probably shouldn’t come. guest speakers have a responsibility too.

I’ll tell you that any guest speaker who calls an audience at my school, “idiots” would probably provoke a similar response as what we saw at Stanford. Please read his comments. He wasn’t trying to express different pts of view, he was berating his audience. What did anyone expect would happen? Put your tribalism aside for a minute and use some common sense. Read what he did:

View: https://twitter.com/mjs_dc/status/1634385861117632513?s=46&t=QT7YFlZ_IlHq81PpZAhKgw


You don’t honk that’s going to antagonize an audience? Again, take your partisan blinders off for a minute.

Meanwhile, Dear Leader Ron bans books and subjects in Florida. Michael Knowles speaks about eradicating transgenderism. Have you spoken out against his attacks on free speech yet?
“Free speech for me but not for thee!”
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I liked this comment: Life-tenured, well-paid guy whose job consists literally of publishing his *opinions* that have the force of law: I am being silenced by 2Ls
 
The Thriller said:
Remember now, He was a guest at their school. If you can’t show grace and speak to pacify an audience that might not be enthusiastic to your speaking, then you probably shouldn’t come. guest speakers have a responsibility too.
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That is exactly why the judge is unhappy with the school. He was an invited speaker. He agreed to come to the campus for a speaking engagement. That was the agreement the judge had with the school. That wasn't the event that happened. The scene in that clip was a debate without a moderator. The school pulled a bait-and-switch. The school did not live up to their end of the agreement to bring the judge in to a speaking event.

As for the judge losing his composure and the children who felt entitled to usurp the space to voice their opinions, both are bad behavior. That all of these people are lawyers or on the way to becoming lawyers, who should be well versed in debate and protocol, the evident quality of future litigators is one more thing that Idiocracy seems to have been predicting correctly.

 
Al-O-Meter said:
That is exactly why the judge is unhappy with the school. He was an invited speaker. He agreed to come to the campus for a speaking engagement. That was the agreement the judge had with the school. That wasn't the event that happened. The scene in that clip was a debate without a moderator. The school pulled a bait-and-switch. The school did not live up to their end of the agreement to bring the judge in to a speaking event.

As for the judge losing his composure and the children who felt entitled to usurp the space to voice their opinions, both are bad behavior. That all of these people are lawyers or on the way to becoming lawyers, who should be well versed in debate and protocol, the evident quality of future litigators is one more thing that Idiocracy seems to have been predicting correctly.

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This reminds me of Milton Friedman and when he was invited to Stanford. You can see from the clip below that the students were respectful and let the man make his points. This is what a healthy discussion looks like. No one is calling him right wing, tribal, or any other names. They go at him with questions in the Q&A and the let him talk and they listen. This is not what just happened at Stanford. I agree with you and thriller that the Judges reciprocal behavior was not appropriate.


View: https://youtu.be/0E-URmNAa5o



View: https://youtu.be/gMLjkt87ICo
 
Bucknutz said:
This reminds me of Milton Friedman and when he was invited to Stanford. You can see from the clip below that the students were respectful and let the man make his points. This is what a healthy discussion looks like. No one is calling him right wing, tribal, or any other names. They go at him with questions in the Q&A and the let him talk and they listen. This is not what just happened at Stanford. I agree with you and thriller that the Judges reciprocal behavior was not appropriate.


View: https://youtu.be/0E-URmNAa5o



View: https://youtu.be/gMLjkt87ICo
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We are long past this kind of discourse. The anonymity of social media has changed the way people interact, since it greatly encourages shouting down, instant dismissal, and even mob mentality and bullying of those with differing opinions. That is what they see and do and follow on twitter, et al, and so it bleeds into real life. Just another symptom of the cancer of social media.
 
fishonjazz said:
I liked this comment: Life-tenured, well-paid guy whose job consists literally of publishing his *opinions* that have the force of law: I am being silenced by 2Ls
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I’m sure he’ll go on many podcasts, Fox News segments, and have many NY Times editorials over the coming weeks describing how he’s been silenced…
 
I’ve been to countless of these events and never once have I seen a speaker act like this. He’s clearly performing for Fox News here. You don’t get to act like a jackass and then play the victim card. Take off your partisan blinders for 5 mins folks.

View: https://twitter.com/jaywillis/status/1634785821382328321?s=46&t=QT7YFlZ_IlHq81PpZAhKgw



View: https://twitter.com/jaywillis/status/1634794334024519680?s=46&t=QT7YFlZ_IlHq81PpZAhKgw



View: https://twitter.com/jaywillis/status/1634794942349582336?s=46&t=QT7YFlZ_IlHq81PpZAhKgw


This is especially appalling. Again, I’ve never seen a guest speaker act like this. What do people expect will happen when a guest speaker acts with so little grace and respect?

View: https://twitter.com/chrisgeidner/status/1634791941350064128?s=46&t=QT7YFlZ_IlHq81PpZAhKgw
 
meanwhile this month France join the growing long list of countries who have health officials who can read and write and only recommending further boosters for those over 60 or in cases of people at high risk due to having serious health issues. Moderna remains banned
 
The Thriller said:
Weird. I wonder why those “lab leak” theorists from a few days ago didn’t report this? After all, we want to get down to the truth of this, right?
www.theatlantic.com

The Strongest Evidence Yet That an Animal Started the Pandemic

A new analysis of genetic samples from China appears to link the pandemic’s origin to raccoon dogs.
www.theatlantic.com www.theatlantic.com
View attachment 14042
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No one is mentioning it because this is a news story for morons. Chinese government officials uploaded some "proof" to a Chinese government database a few days ago and international researchers found the "proof" in the Chinese database, except it isn't actually proof because no one can find any SARS-CoV-2 in the species that was the supposed carrier even today, after SARS-CoV-2 is everywhere. This is Chinese propaganda. Even the article straight out says there is zero actual proof in any of this.
the evidence falls short of, say, isolating SARS-CoV-2 from a free-ranging raccoon dog or, even better, uncovering a viral sample swabbed from a mammal for sale at Huanan from the time of the outbreak’s onset.
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This is nothing but Chinese propaganda and you shut down the schools causing massive damage to children's social health and learning loss.
 
Al-O-Meter said:
No one is mentioning it because this is a news story for morons.
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I am seeing quite a few stories about it today. But, I’m not a virologist, not really in a position to make a call, unlike an expert like yourself(?), but here are the three authors. I’m not qualified to refer to them as “morons”, but, since you consider the news something that is aimed at morons, perhaps you do consider the authors of the study morons as well.


Michael Worobey | Ecology & Evolutionary Biology

eeb.arizona.edu eeb.arizona.edu

asm.org

Edward Holmes, Ph.D., FRS, FAA

Edward Holmes, Ph.D., FRS, FAA, dubbed the
asm.org asm.org
 
“Andersen adds that he does not expect the new data to convince everyone that the virus originated at the market. He suspects some people may interpret the new information to mean simply that humans infected with SARS-CoV-2 transmitted the virus to the animals at the market.

Joel Wertheim, an evolutionary biologist at the University of California, San Diego, who is collaborating with Andersen and others in the analyses of the newly discovered sequences, says some critics of the spillover hypothesis want more conclusive evidence than science can possibly deliver. “You can’t observe the zoonotic transmission of a novel virus from animals to humans,” Wertheim says. “We’re just never going to get that level of data.”

www.science.org

Unearthed genetic sequences from China market may point to animal origin of COVID-19

French scientist finds previously undisclosed data from Chinese research team
www.science.org www.science.org
 
Red said:
“Andersen adds that he does not expect the new data to convince everyone that the virus originated at the market. He suspects some people may interpret the new information to mean simply that humans infected with SARS-CoV-2 transmitted the virus to the animals at the market.

Joel Wertheim, an evolutionary biologist at the University of California, San Diego, who is collaborating with Andersen and others in the analyses of the newly discovered sequences, says some critics of the spillover hypothesis want more conclusive evidence than science can possibly deliver. “You can’t observe the zoonotic transmission of a novel virus from animals to humans,” Wertheim says. “We’re just never going to get that level of data.”

www.science.org

Unearthed genetic sequences from China market may point to animal origin of COVID-19

French scientist finds previously undisclosed data from Chinese research team
www.science.org www.science.org
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So the study involved here is as yet unpublished. The Atlantic first reported on it, but that means paywall, as is the case with The NY Times as well, here’s a free copy of the Times…

DNyuz - Latest Breaking U.S. News

Latest Breaking News, U.S. and World Politics, Crime, Business, Science, Technology, Autos, Entertainment, Culture, Movie, Music, Sports.
dnyuz.com

“The jumbling together of genetic material from the virus and the animal does not prove that a raccoon dog itself was infected. And even if a raccoon dog had been infected, it would not be clear that the animal had spread the virus to people. Another animal could have passed the virus to people, or someone infected with the virus could have spread the virus to a raccoon dog.

But the analysis did establish that raccoon dogs — fluffy animals that are related to foxes and are known to be able to transmit the coronavirus — deposited genetic signatures in the same place where genetic material from the virus was left, three scientists involved in the analysis said. That evidence, they said, was consistent with a scenario in which the virus had spilled into humans from a wild animal.

A report with the full details of the international research team’s findings has not yet been published. Their analysis was first reported by The Atlantic.

The new evidence is sure to provide a jolt to the debate over the pandemic’s origins, even if it does not resolve the question of how it began.

In recent weeks, the so-called lab leak theory, which posits that the coronavirus emerged from a research lab in Wuhan, has gained traction thanks to a new intelligence assessmentfrom the U.S. Department of Energy and hearings led by the new Republican House leadership.

But the genetic data from the market offers some of the most tangible evidence yet of how the virus could have spilled into people from wild animals outside a lab. It also suggests that Chinese scientists have given an incomplete account of evidence that could fill in details about how the virus was spreading at the Huanan market.

Jeremy Kamil, a virologist at Louisiana State University Health Sciences Center Shreveport who was not involved in the study, said the findings showed that “the samples from the market that had early Covid lineages in them were contaminated with DNA reads of wild animals.”

Dr. Kamil said that fell short of conclusive evidence that an infected animal had set off the pandemic. But, he said, “it really puts the spotlight on the illegal animal trade in an intimate way.”
 
Red said:
So the study involved here is as yet unpublished. The Atlantic first reported on it, but that means paywall, as is the case with The NY Times as well, here’s a free copy of the Times…

DNyuz - Latest Breaking U.S. News

Latest Breaking News, U.S. and World Politics, Crime, Business, Science, Technology, Autos, Entertainment, Culture, Movie, Music, Sports.
dnyuz.com

“The jumbling together of genetic material from the virus and the animal does not prove that a raccoon dog itself was infected. And even if a raccoon dog had been infected, it would not be clear that the animal had spread the virus to people. Another animal could have passed the virus to people, or someone infected with the virus could have spread the virus to a raccoon dog.

But the analysis did establish that raccoon dogs — fluffy animals that are related to foxes and are known to be able to transmit the coronavirus — deposited genetic signatures in the same place where genetic material from the virus was left, three scientists involved in the analysis said. That evidence, they said, was consistent with a scenario in which the virus had spilled into humans from a wild animal.

A report with the full details of the international research team’s findings has not yet been published. Their analysis was first reported by The Atlantic.

The new evidence is sure to provide a jolt to the debate over the pandemic’s origins, even if it does not resolve the question of how it began.

In recent weeks, the so-called lab leak theory, which posits that the coronavirus emerged from a research lab in Wuhan, has gained traction thanks to a new intelligence assessmentfrom the U.S. Department of Energy and hearings led by the new Republican House leadership.

But the genetic data from the market offers some of the most tangible evidence yet of how the virus could have spilled into people from wild animals outside a lab. It also suggests that Chinese scientists have given an incomplete account of evidence that could fill in details about how the virus was spreading at the Huanan market.

Jeremy Kamil, a virologist at Louisiana State University Health Sciences Center Shreveport who was not involved in the study, said the findings showed that “the samples from the market that had early Covid lineages in them were contaminated with DNA reads of wild animals.”

Dr. Kamil said that fell short of conclusive evidence that an infected animal had set off the pandemic. But, he said, “it really puts the spotlight on the illegal animal trade in an intimate way.”
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Occam's razor analysis would lean toward the wild variant as well, since we know this has happened many many times, the likelihood is that is where this one originated as well. Obviously that doesn't play as well in the new cycles or in conspiracist circles, but hey, logic is just a word.
 
Red said:
I am seeing quite a few stories about it today.
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Yep, the 2 I saw were the Atlantic and NYT. I also saw many tweets talking about it from both sides. Pretty interesting threads:


View: https://twitter.com/ballouxfrancois/status/1636609923403358208?s=46&t=BMMZjW7vq0_zwnmLDjNTgQ



View: https://twitter.com/philippmarkolin/status/1636515138193768449?s=46&t=BMMZjW7vq0_zwnmLDjNTgQ




Red said:
But, I’m not a virologist, not really in a position to make a call, unlike an expert like yourself(?), but here are the three authors.
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I’m not an expert either and both theories make sense to me.
 
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Is there a difference between a racoon and a racoon dog?
 
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