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Blind Taste Test - Pick 3 Players

Pick 3 of these guys just based on per 36 stats:

  • Player 1

    Votes: 2 3.9%

  • Player 2

    Votes: 15 29.4%

  • Player 3

    Votes: 11 21.6%

  • Player 4

    Votes: 38 74.5%

  • Player 5

    Votes: 1 2.0%

  • Player 6

    Votes: 30 58.8%

  • Player 7

    Votes: 23 45.1%

  • Player 8

    Votes: 15 29.4%
  • Total voters
    51
Let’s compare his numbers since the trade deadline when he started getting regular minutes:

Per 36

16.5 PPG, 3.1 RPG, 2.6 APG

40/34/87 on 8.3 attempts from 3 per game

That is in his rookie year after a first half of the season where he wasn’t playing very much and didn’t play with a ton of playmaking.

Meanwhile you’re comparing him to players who have been in the NBA multiple years and four of whom play a lot of minutes for playoff teams.
 
HH literally was down on Ochai because he didn’t get enough stocks in his rookie season. Let’s not forget he said that.
 
Elizah Huge said:
Let’s compare his numbers since the trade deadline when he started getting regular minutes:

Per 36

16.5 PPG, 3.1 RPG, 2.6 APG

40/34/87 on 8.3 attempts from 3 per game

That is in his rookie year after a first half of the season where he wasn’t playing very much and didn’t play with a ton of playmaking.

Meanwhile you’re comparing him to players who have been in the NBA multiple years and four of whom play a lot of minutes for playoff teams.
Click to expand...
Great! Totally valid analysis, even though it’s as or more cherry-picked than the thing you’re criticizing for cherry-picking. Added context: the Jazz were trying to lose those games. I also don’t know what to make of THT’s explosion because the context is lacking. Players tend to produce when lacking more proven options.

No one is saying Ochai sucks. I think the point of all of this as has been stated many times over is that maybe foregoing improving the team or the position due to the greatness of Ochai is a little overboard.
 
Here’s a fun exercise: find a hype-beast rookie that actually never panned out and imagine the counterfactual that they were traded at peak value:

What could the Warriors have gotten if they had traded Eric Paschall after his rookie season?

(OF COURSE you run the risk of trading a player that is just on the beginning of a growth curve! Of course it could be a mistake! That’s what makes the player conceivably valuable to other teams!)
 
NUMBERICA said:
I don’t know what you’re saying.

EDIT: if you’re saying that there was no hype with Paschall, then I would point out that he was All-Rookie 1st Team
Click to expand...
No, how is Ochai a hype-beast rookie?

Ochai is a role player who fits the modern NBA perfectly. He isnt comparable to freaking Eric Paschall.
 
Elizah Huge said:
Let’s compare his numbers since the trade deadline when he started getting regular minutes:

Per 36

16.5 PPG, 3.1 RPG, 2.6 APG

40/34/87 on 8.3 attempts from 3 per game

That is in his rookie year after a first half of the season where he wasn’t playing very much and didn’t play with a ton of playmaking.

Meanwhile you’re comparing him to players who have been in the NBA multiple years and four of whom play a lot of minutes for playoff teams.
Click to expand...
I understand... and I said I get that he's a rookie... but if he does improve then it will likely look a lot like the players I listed and many are really meh. Like even the 16.5/3/3 is fine but at 40/34/87 that's really inefficient. So medium volume and below average shooting efficiency and not a lot of activity stats just doesn't scream "this guy needs to start next year". If he was a 19 yo rookie then okay... as a 22 yo rookie... its still fine but I'm still in wait and see mode.

For a guy who is "athletic, long" the activity stuff is REALLY low... even when he got minutes later in the season. Like not low for a rookie like Niang levels of low... so yeah those things aren't the things that generally double in a few years.... and they kind of need to unless he is like an efficient 17-18 ppg guy.

I just think its funny that if you mention him as a trade asset people lose their minds.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I understand... and I said I get that he's a rookie... but if he does improve then it will likely look a lot like the players I listed and many are really meh. Like even the 16.5/3/3 is fine but at 40/34/87 that's really inefficient. So medium volume and below average shooting efficiency and not a lot of activity stats just doesn't scream "this guy needs to start next year". If he was a 19 yo rookie then okay... as a 22 yo rookie... its still fine but I'm still in wait and see mode.

For a guy who is "athletic, long" the activity stuff is REALLY low... even when he got minutes later in the season. Like not low for a rookie like Niang levels of low... so yeah those things aren't the things that generally double in a few years.... and they kind of need to unless he is like an efficient 17-18 ppg guy.

I just think its funny that if you mention him as a trade asset people lose their minds.
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The irony is the best player on the list is Norm Powell, an older rookie who also posted OK rookie year numbers similar to Ochai's and was also a low vote getter.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I just think its funny that if you mention him as a trade asset people lose their minds.
Click to expand...

You have mentioned 16/Ochai for 10 a couple of times now. That isn’t good enough to me to trade Ochai. That’s the entire point. You are devaluing him to the point where he is an add in to move up 6 spots in the back part of the lottery.
 
NUMBERICA said:
Here’s a fun exercise: find a hype-beast rookie that actually never panned out and imagine the counterfactual that they were traded at peak value:

What could the Warriors have gotten if they had traded Eric Paschall after his rookie season?

(OF COURSE you run the risk of trading a player that is just on the beginning of a growth curve! Of course it could be a mistake! That’s what makes the player conceivably valuable to other teams!)
Click to expand...
What was Quentin Grimes trade value last year versus this offseason. May not be all that much different I guess... but that would be a comparison to use. Duarte is another guy but he was a couple years older than Ochai so not totally fair.

Again... not saying trade him no matter what. I'm saying if an offer came in at say the 15th pick type of value... I'm going to pull the trigger most likely (depends a little bit on who is on the board).
 
Elizah Huge said:
You have mentioned 16/Ochai for 10 a couple of times now. That isn’t good enough to me to trade Ochai. That’s the entire point. You are devaluing him to the point where he is an add in to move up 6 spots in the back part of the lottery.
Click to expand...
6 spots is hard to do my friend... requires at least another pick... and if I can go from drafting JHS to Cason Wallace... then I'm trading in Ochai. That is kind of the tipping point for me. Literally one additional spot and I may say no.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
The irony is the best player on the list is Norm Powell, an older rookie who also posted OK rookie year numbers similar to Ochai's and was also a low vote getter.
Click to expand...
I did it intentionally... and again Ochai got zero votes. I wanted to show how different the rebounds and steals were compared to Ochai since Norm is often the comp for Ochai. If we develop a poor man's Norm that's good... if that is a solid median outcome then great... but that isn't an untouchable prospect.
 
Trade good players for a near all star or better. If you feel the draft selection will be that then do it. However, I doubt it -- unless we are talking Dick, Brice or Kobe.
 
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