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Still A Harsh Reality... Players not wanting to play in Utah

Adrian Dantley said "there isn't much for a young black dude to do here" when he was first traded to the Jazz from the Lakers some 40 years ago. Unfortunately that image still persists.
 
Sean said:
I think a big reason the Millers sold the Jazz is that they knew it was becoming increasingly difficult to attract and keep talent.
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Then you're wrong, Sean. The Millers sold the Jazz because they lost a ******** of money during the pandemic and had to right the ship.
 
The Jazz Wonderbra said:
Agreed with everything here but the oppressive language...

Mormon culture can come across as uncomfortable, inclusive, uppity, holier than thou, and a lot of things, but oppressive is a bit over the top. I went to Saudi Arabia 2 months ago where hands are cut off for stealing and heads are cutoff for selling drugs. People sell reeds in the streets... the purpose... to whip any woman who exposes her legs. If you don't veil your head you are seen as lessor than...

I lived in Hawaii where if you aren't native, you are outcast. Dude peed on my car just because I was a tourist (even though I lived there).

I lived in Mexico where terms unnacceptable to most are extremely common and where people pee in bags to throw them at opposing players on the soccer pitch.

When I lived in Alberta, Canadians wouldn't interact with me because they felt I was there to steal their jobs (similar perspective as many here in the US treat Mexicans and many Mexicans treat Guatamalans). Cold shoulder treatment at lunch, in meetings. Very uncomfortable, but clearly not oppressive.

Most places have some level of cultural discomfort, but perspective makes a big difference. Oppressive is a bit over the top methinks.

Perhaps we have seen each other retreating in the hills and lakes btw. I wouldn't know... I was too busy practicing wicken.
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Toronto is the complete opposite it's literally one of the melting pots of the World
 
416Klawzz said:
Donovan fought for equality but was shut down... But that's on Utah, his efforts were observed by many around the league thus the perception remains ...
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I don't get what he thought was going to happen.

Utah is a pretty conservative, patriarchal, racist place. I don't think anyone is going to argue that. There's a long way to go.

It's just that Mitchell comes off as thinking that because he made an All-Star game and bought some kid a new smart phone, he was going to end racism in Utah. There are activists and organizations in Utah who have all been working for decades to make it a less racist place, and while there has been progress, it's been slow and hard-won. The problem apparently, is that they all just needed some rich kid from Connecticut to come and end racism in Utah like Fonzie.

 
JimLes said:
I don't get what he thought was going to happen.

Utah is a pretty conservative, patriarchal, racist place. I don't think anyone is going to argue that. There's a long way to go.

It's just that Mitchell comes off as thinking that because he made an All-Star game and bought some kid a new smart phone, he was going to end racism in Utah. There are activists and organizations in Utah who have all been working for decades to make it a less racist place, and while there has been progress, it's been slow and hard-won. The problem apparently, is that they all just needed some rich kid from Connecticut to come and end racism in Utah like Fonzie.

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I think your take on Mitchell is wrong, he tried it didn't work it may never. Take this as a non Spida ambassador. I'm Canadian and from Toronto. My parents are from South America Guyana to be exact. When I played college ball here .when I came across anyone who found out I was a Jazz fan they were always shocked. Why Utah? Are you a Mormon? Are you from Utah ? Is your wife a Mormon? All cringed at the thought of me being a coloured fan of the Jazz. It's getting better though but everyone I've come across hated the Jazz or rooted against them. I always wondered why ?
 
Flc said:
Then you're wrong, Sean. The Millers sold the Jazz because they lost a ******** of money during the pandemic and had to right the ship.
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I mean, the Millers sold the Jazz in the fall of 2020. I doubt it was a deal that happened quickly (something like that doesn't) - it's hard for me to believe in a few months that the pandemic raged, that they became so destitute they needed to sell the Jazz. There was definitely more at play and I guarantee they were looking to get out of the NBA game long before we even knew what COVID was.
 
MT Steve said:
3 of the last 5 NBA champions are franchises that did not rely on stars from free agency at all to win their title.
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Nikola Jokić played with the Nuggets for eight seasons before they won their NBA title. Utah got five seasons out of Mitchell before they unloaded him.

Steph Curry was in his sixth season when he won his first title with the Warriors - or one more than Mitchell played in Utah.

Giannis was in his eighth season with the Bucks when he won his title.

Since the Stockton and Malone era ended, here's the longevity with the Jazz of every player they've drafted who turned into NBA All Stars:

Deron Williams (six seasons)
Gordon Hayward (seven)
Rudy Gobert (nine)
Donovan Mitchell (five)

None of those players have had the longevity with Utah as the three title winners I've listed (over their entire career).

There's ample enough evidence to suggest Utah has a very small window to win with their drafted NBA talent. Every player who they drafted that went on to be an All Star since the Stockton-Malone era came to an end, peaced out in some capacity after less than ten seasons.

Gobert is the only one who stands out and let's be honest, Utah was never winning a title with just Gobert.

It's not just about drafting the talent. It's about retaining that talent so eventually you get that NBA run. Utah hasn't been able to do that since the S&M days.
 
I think the constant chatter about player not wanting to be here is part of the problem. Utah has this stigma, but for a 19 year old I cant imagine that they would feel much different about going to Milwaukee or Oklahoma vs Utah.
 
Sean said:
Nikola Jokić played with the Nuggets for eight seasons before they won their NBA title. Utah got five seasons out of Mitchell before they unloaded him.

Steph Curry was in his sixth season when he won his first title with the Warriors - or one more than Mitchell played in Utah.

Giannis was in his eighth season with the Bucks when he won his title.

Since the Stockton and Malone era ended, here's the longevity with the Jazz of every player they've drafted who turned into NBA All Stars:

Deron Williams (six seasons)
Gordon Hayward (seven)
Rudy Gobert (nine)
Donovan Mitchell (five)

None of those players have had the longevity with Utah as the three title winners I've listed (over their entire career).
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Gobert would have. Lauri by all accounts loves it here and wants to stay long-term.

I genuinely believe if we had drafted Jokic or Giannis, they would have stayed here if our team was strong.
 
Sean said:
It's not just about drafting the talent. It's about retaining that talent so eventually you get that NBA run. Utah hasn't been able to do that since the S&M days.
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And since that time the Utah religislature has worked tirelessly to make sure S&M is legally unacceptable in the state.
 
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