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Hayward - Do not get it...

I've seen him play better at the 2, despite the fact that it would make sense that he would be better suited at the 3.
That doesn't mean he will be better at the 3.
He's not playing well at all right now, so it doesn't really matter at this point.

I agree that in theory he would make a better 3. I just haven't seen it in the games yet.

What is interesting is that according to 82 games, his shooting percentages were better at the 2 than at the 3. That would mean he must have been able to do something to get a better shot playing the 2.
 
I am a reformed long time hater of the Hayward pick. I wanted Paul George so bad that I made the point that anyone picked 10 through 15 including Larry Sanders would have been better. Through 3/4 of the season I was right. People would say Hayward played well when all I saw was a tenative scared player. However, after D-Will was traded he started being more aggressive. For the first time I started seeing what everyone liked in Hayward. Hayward can handle the rock, he is a play-maker. You can't see it when he is passing the ball as soon as he touches it. When he gets aggressive and starts taking it to the hole you can really tell he has good handles. I think his number one problem is settling for outside shots. Once he starts to drive again I think his game will come around.
 
Hayward need to drive and finish. That will get him more open for his outside shot and it always helps shooters to drive first and see the ball go through the net.
 
Hearsky said:
And, I'm guessing you look a lot like a character from Deliverance.
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You're trying way too hard. Anyone that read the back and forth would have to admit that my posts were sane and reasonable. Yours is the little ***** guy turn big ***** guy once behind the keyboard.

Walking away from your stupid replies.
 
I think people are overreacting. Hayward is still very young and inexperienced. He is going to have good and bad games. Heck even great players have bad games. Trading him now would be ridiculous. Guys like Hayward, Favors, and Kanter are going to take four or five years before you see the final product. Everyone forgets that these guys would attended zero, one or two years of college ball. They have talent but understanding the NBA takes some time.

Hayward does much better when he just plays. He needs to learn when a shot is good and when it should be passed. Heck some of our vets don't know that. I don't know what KOC was upset about but perhaps he was upset about him passing up the first shot which would have been in the flow of the game instead of passing out and then just chucking it up when the crowd told him to shoot. Ty is going to have to find the best place for Hayward but I still consider him an important part of the Jazz future.
 
PKM said:
You're trying way too hard. Anyone that read the back and forth would have to admit that my posts were sane and reasonable. Yours is the little ***** guy turn big ***** guy once behind the keyboard.

Walking away from your stupid replies.
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Squeal like a pig, squeal like a pig!
 
Well, whether he plays 2 or 3, he does need to think drive first, shoot second, kinda like CJ. He could create a lot of matchup problems at the 2 because of his size. Of course he may sacrifice some quickness on defense at that spot for the same reason. I like watching him play at 2 because I know he can shoot (despite the current slump) and pass the ball very well. He definitely is a playmaker and can do that in either position. He'll be alright. His main problem could very well be confidence, but maybe that's why he should start at the basket & work his way out. When he becomes a more dependable shooter, I'd love to see him at the 2 more.
 
Hayward has a tough time finishing because despite his awkward and dangerous looking white-boy dunks, he's really not very athletic. He cannot for the life of him get elevation off one foot. If he's going to finish at the rim, it's going to have to be him learning to be crafty.

And on udhomers point on 'I don't know if the NBA's for him': I don't think someone that simply can't hack it would have done as much positive as Hayward has to date (even with him stinking about 50% of the time).
 
A month ago Hayward was the only player on the team that passed the ball well. Now the whole team is passing well. You're welcome.
 
billyshelby said:
Because he's not especially quick. Because I can't see him being effective guarding 2's. Because his handle at the 3 (with other 3's guarding him) is a weapon, not so much with quicker 2's guarding him. Because he doesn't create space on his jumpshot that would allow him to take advantage of his height at the 2.
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You mean Leebron and Wallace and Granger and Pierce and Melo and Durant are slower?
You mean because he can't beat anyone off the dribble, get into the lane, jump, and then pass to a covered wing?
He gets past anyone just fine.
He doesn't use the opportunities he creates to score.
Now experimenting with the Spazz-Tiller synthesis.
 
cowhide said:
Everyone forgets that these guys would attended zero, one or two years of college ball. They have talent but understanding the NBA takes some time.
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Fallacy, cowhide.
Most players not only show the ability to become good/great, but they produce instantly.
There are very few exceptions to this, namely Jermain "Not Irish" O'Neal.
Hayward had good month and there is no reason to hang our hope hats on that forever.
That is what Swat Oop Nation has done with CJ for an inconceivable amount of time.
 
cowhide said:
Trading him now would be ridiculous. Guys like Hayward, Favors, and Kanter are going to take four or five years before you see the final product.
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O'Connor has a history of getting rid of his failed first round picks way sooner then that. In fact only DWill lasted with the Jazz longer then 4 years. All other picks were gone after 1-3 years, Brewer lasted 4?
 
Hayward is a second year 9th draft pick........yet people are shocked he's not a consistent 20ppg player?


Give the young boy time. It's hard to get shots with Millsap and Jefferson in the starting lineup.
 
I wondered if you were there, that's why I asked. It just seems a little out of character for KOC so he must have been really angry. I've never seen or heard of him yelling at a player during a game before but maybe I just haven't been paying attention.
 
NUMBERICA said:
Hayward has a tough time finishing because despite his awkward and dangerous looking white-boy dunks, he's really not very athletic. He cannot for the life of him get elevation off one foot. If he's going to finish at the rim, it's going to have to be him learning to be crafty.

And on udhomers point on 'I don't know if the NBA's for him': I don't think someone that simply can't hack it would have done as much positive as Hayward has to date (even with him stinking about 50% of the time).
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I don't really think it's his lack of athletic ability that hinders him as finishing as much as his mediocre layup touch. For him to finish on the break it has to either be a dunk or foul shots.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGggGD-l34I

I know one video doesn't prove anything, but Hayward can get enough elevation off of one foot to give him time in the air to get a layup over defenders. He just either isn't strong enough or doesn't have enough touch/coordination/whatever to lay the ball softly off the glass.
 
I'm 90% sure that Hayward's driving and finding no one problem will be fixed when Big Al or Milsap learn how to cut through the middle like Favors does instead of standing around and watching him wanting to pass
 
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