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God Deniers

The Black Swordsman said:
It's hard to believe in a god because it just seems too good to be true. A god that cares for us or is at least personal and good? Life after death with cosmic justice?

If we didn't live in this life, then this world would be too good to be true. I know by definition it isn't too good to be true since it is true, but you get the point. Imagen telling a child in a womb of a mother about this world. Talking about trees, and water, and mountains, and food etc. It would sound too good to be true.
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It's hard because you just have to believe it because you want to. I don't want to, so the lack of evidence becomes overwhelming.
 
One Brow said:
You have no idea how smug, stupid, arrogant, and ignorant that little screed is. You seem to think that because you have this deep feeling that some spiritual Santa claus exists, so does everyone else. You're wrong.

No, I didn't pray when my kids went to the hospital, nor my mother. I didn't consut with astrologist or spirit medium. I didn't place crystals all over the place. I consoled my family, and was consoled by them.
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I'm happy for you. Sounds like you got it all figured out.

Thanks for replying to my whole post too by the way..

I never said I'm 100% certain.

I understand why someone would have a problem believing in a god. I struggle with it too. The biggest problem I have with it and probably the same for others is the fact that life isn't fair. That some people are just dealt terrible hands in life. And it doesn't sit with people that supposedly there is a god and he loves you but would let you suffer.

I get all that.

But what keeps me thinking maybe there is, is the free will argument. I can see how life wouldn't be what it is without mystery, without mystery there would be no imagination, no creativity, no emotions, nothing. Without having it the way it is there would be no fear, no struggle, no laughter, no happiness, no sadness, no emotions what's so ever. No character building. Nothing.

If everyone could see a god and knew for sure. I can see how it would change everything.
 
Hack said:
I'm happy for you. Sounds like you got it all figured out.

Thanks for replying to my whole post too by the way..

I never said I'm 100% certain.
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My response did not say I have it all figured out, and certainly did not say either of us are 100% certain.

Ibn the future, did you want me to always reply to the entirety of your posts, when I reply as at all? It seems like an odd complaint/request.

Hack said:
But what keeps me thinking maybe there is, is the free will argument. I can see how life wouldn't be what it is without mystery, without mystery there would be no imagination, no creativity, no emotions, nothing. Without having it the way it is there would be no fear, no struggle, no laughter, no happiness, no sadness, no emotions what's so ever. No character building. Nothing.
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We disagree on the necessity of free will for mystery, imagination, ..., character building (depending on what yo umean by free will, of course).
 
Hack said:
Gotta love the God debate. Nobody knows for sure, but yet somehow everyone is so certain.


Myself, I find it hard to believe in a god but I haven't ruled it out. Scientists can study the **** out of everything, but will never be able to answer the why question.

It's easy to deny god when everything is going fine , but when life gets to be its hardest I think almost everyone starts searching for a god. If you have ever come close to death or had a family member on their death bed, you know what I mean. Lets say you have your own five year old child hanging on to dear life. You telling me you aren't praying. If you say no, I say you are a liar, or have never experienced something like that. Just wait, those days will come, I can assure of that.
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I've been there, more than once. Never did I seek fantasy as a way to cope with reality.
 
Many people have a problem with believing in god because they have never been loved in their life. The idea of a god loving them is simply too foreign to them. They then turn around and pretend it is because of science.
 
The Black Swordsman said:
The idea of a god loving them is simply too foreign to them.
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"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence";)
To my knowledge there was nothing even remotely close to "gods love" happening ever. Why god who "loves people" would not show it at least once where it would be obvious it was god who did it - by saving plane from crash for example? I bet people on planes who crashing pray as much as they can - so what, your god loves people but is deaf to their prayers? So why pray to the gods ( I bet in those planes were at least 4-5 different religion representatives who prayed to Jesus, Allah, Krisna, God of Thunder, Manitou and whatever you name them) if they don't bother?
Simple question for you. You boat is sinking, you end up in the water, shore is about 500m away, what do you do? Swim or pray for gods love? If you believe in afterlife and gods love, why bother swimming? Just sink and pray I would say.
 
AKMVP said:
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence";)
To my knowledge there was nothing even remotely close to "gods love" happening ever. Why god who "loves people" would not show it at least once where it would be obvious it was god who did it - by saving plane from crash for example? I bet people on planes who crashing pray as much as they can - so what, your god loves people but is deaf to their prayers? So why pray to the gods ( I bet in those planes were at least 4-5 different religion representatives who prayed to Jesus, Allah, Krisna, God of Thunder, Manitou and whatever you name them) if they don't bother?
Simple question for you. You boat is sinking, you end up in the water, shore is about 500m away, what do you do? Swim or pray for gods love? If you believe in afterlife and gods love, why bother swimming? Just sink and pray I would say.
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So you are saying that when you pray you expect miracles to happen and that is why you don't believe in god? In Islam a miracle means "sign of prophethood" and Muhammad was the last prophet.

Extraordinary Claims do require extraordinary evidence. I have provided that here.
https://jazzfanz.com/showthread.php?9826-Why-I-think-being-a-Muslim-is-rational&highlight=muslim
 
Snout said:
As a firm believer in a higher power, I feel it is absurd for any politician to bring Gordon into anything. Separation, fools. Get some.
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Proverbs 18:2 A fool takes no pleasure in understanding, but only in expressing his opinion.

All the great American leaders recognize God and reverence Him in their speeches.

Martin Luther King Jr. in his I Have a Dream Speech
Lincoln in his Gettysburg Address
Even the "separation" guy himself said this:

“Can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with his wrath? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just: that his justice can not sleep forever."
 
The Black Swordsman said:
Many people have a problem with believing in god because they have never been loved in their life. The idea of a god loving them is simply too foreign to them. They then turn around and pretend it is because of science.
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If that is in any way directed at me, go **** yourself! You know very little about anything, especially human behavior.
 
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