WHOLE TEAM....caught using steroids!!!

[Im A Ninja]

....if it was only a couple of players, I'd agree with you. BUt when the WHOLE team has the SAME condition? I think it's more than coincidence!

I'd be more inclined to believe the exact opposite.

 

[carolinajazz]

.....NOW the truth be known! "Some have speculated that a workout that targeted the triceps, in a hot wrestling room at the school Sunday, could be the cause." Everybody in town knows that "wrestlers" both Pro and Amateur....love to use tons of roids....to build those muscles up! I think "hopper" needs to enter this discussion....and give us his "expert" opinion!

 

[Gameface]

.....NOW the truth be known! "Some have speculated that a workout that targeted the triceps, in a hot wrestling room at the school Sunday, could be the cause." Everybody in town knows that "wrestlers" both Pro and Amateur....love to use tons of roids....to build those muscles up! I think "hopper" needs to enter this discussion....and give us his "expert" opinion!

Well you've proved it! Congratulations.

 

[Scat]

.....NOW the truth be known! "Some have speculated that a workout that targeted the triceps, in a hot wrestling room at the school Sunday, could be the cause." Everybody in town knows that "wrestlers" both Pro and Amateur....love to use tons of roids....to build those muscles up! I think "hopper" needs to enter this discussion....and give us his "expert" opinion!

For years I've seen people refer to you as a racist idiot but I've reserved judgement. This thread has proven them right at least partially... you're an idiot!

 

[carolinajazz]

For years I've seen people refer to you as a racist idiot but I've reserved judgement. This thread has proven them right at least partially... you're an idiot!

...hey, lighten up, will ya! I'm just pulling your chain, that's all! It's the off season and we've got to talk about something, right? I know these guys are completely innocent of any wrong doing whatsoever. They are the victims, not the perpetrators! No need to soil there good names and reputations any further....so I'll stop right now!

 

[LiemD]

creatine aint dangerous at all

 

[Scat]

Its not steroids. Its Creatine. Creatine is dangerous. Steroids do cause dehydration.

"Winkler said blood test results expected Tuesday could show whether the athletes ingested creatine, which is found in legal high-powered protein supplements."

Most high school kids take creatine. Its very common but its also very dangerous on your kidney. They probably took too much. They probably all took those stupid energy drinks for workouts. Those cause dehydration.

Old wive's tale. Creatine has been shown to be perfectly safe.

Researchers from Truman State University also report that long-term creatine use appears to be safe [7].

Twenty-three members of an NCAA Division II American football team were divided into a creatine group and a control group who took no supplements.

Subjects in the creatine group averaged 14 grams of creatine a day for three years. However, the researchers could find no detrimental effects on either kidney or liver function.

7. Mayhew, D.L., Mayhew, J.L., & Ware, J.S. (2002). Effects of long-term creatine supplementation on liver and kidney functions in American college football players. International Journal of Sport Nutrition and Exercise Metabolism, 12, 453-460

In fact, creatine has numerous health benefits.

Most people aren't aware that creatine has protective effects in heart, muscle and neurological diseases. In fact, several months of creatine supplementation in men and women with borderline high cholesterol levels reduces very-low-density lipoprotein levels (the so-called "bad" cholesterol) by almost one-third [1].

Similar findings are reported in the journal Metabolism. Twenty-eight days of creatine supplementation and resistance exercise lowered total cholesterol levels to a greater extent than resistance exercise alone [10].

1. Earnest, C., Almada, A., & Mitchell, T. (1996). High-performance capillary electrophoresis-pure creatine monohydrate reduces blood lipids in men and women. Clinical Science, 91, 113-118

10. Arciero, P.J., Hannibal, N.S. 3rd, Nindl, B.C., Gentile, C.L., Hamed, J., & Vukovich, M.D. (2001). Comparison of creatine ingestion and resistance training on energy expenditure and limb blood flow. Metabolism, 50, 1429-1434

 

[Twin Towers]

Old wive's tale. Creatine has been shown to be perfectly safe.



In fact, creatine has numerous health benefits.

Dehydration

While using creatine and glutamine, water is dawn into the muscles than is normal. This may result in dehydration as a side effect of using these supplements. When using these supplements you should increase your water intake to counteract this effect.


Water Retention
Increase in water retention in the muscles can make them look fuller and shapelier. However some individuals’ body shape means that they will look fatter around the waste which they may find undesirable. Muscles may lose shape when individuals stop taking the supplements.


Upset Stomach
Bloating and stomach upsets are associated side effects with both glutamine and creatine.

Kidneys Problems
No conclusive evidence exists to show that creatine causes problems in the kidneys. However there is significant anecdotal evidence from users linking creatine to kidney problems and specifically to the development of kidney stones. Users should take into account that the likelihood of kidney stones is increased by having a high protein diet, a common habit of bodybuilders. Lack of fluid in the body also increases the chance of kidney stones. Creatine side effects negative impact can include dehydration so it is logical that the creatine could indirectly lead to kidney stones if users do not rehydrate themselves. It is recommended that you contact a medical professional if you have kidney problems.

Creatine can be dangerous is what I meant. Most people think because its legal they can take whatever they want. Most people take too much and get too dehydrated. Its dangerous for this reason. If used properly it is fine.
But any drug can be healthy in some ways but hurt you in others.

Steroids even has many health benefits but there is also side effects if not used properly.

Its the same for any synthetic product. Most people don't drink enough water. And that creates a lot of problems on your kidneys and with dehydration. Combine Creatine with those energy drinks it can cause a lot of problems.

The side effects they listed are not side effects of the steroids. Unless there is a kind I am not familiar with (there are probably over 50 types so its possible but highly unlikely from my research).

 

[Scat]

Creatine can be dangerous is what I meant. Most people think because its legal they can take whatever they want. Most people take too much and get too dehydrated. Its dangerous for this reason. If used properly it is fine. But any drug can be healthy in some ways but hurt you in others.

I think that it goes without saying that anything taken in too great a quantity is bad you. Even drinking too much water will kill you. But this is vastly different than a blanket statement that creatine is dangerous and will damage your kidneys.

 

[carolinajazz]

Is Creatine a banned substance in the NBA, NFL, MLB or Olympics? Just asking.

 

[Scat]

Is Creatine a banned substance in the NBA, NFL, MLB or Olympics? Just asking.

No.

Creatine is in the food you eat. A pound of beef has almost 2 grams of creatine in it. Seafood such as tuna and salmon are high in creatine. Creatine is the driving force that energizes your muscles and replenishes energy stores in skeletal muscle. Creatine has benefits such as promotion of lean muscle mass, enhancement of muscle cell volume, improved work capacity of muscle, better protein synthesis, and improved re-synthesis of glycogen. New studies show that it is helpful in the lowering of bad cholesterol. It is also used by your major organs. Without creatine you would cease to live.

That said, as mentioned above, if taken in quantities above and beyond the recommended dosage it is potentially harmful. But, as also pointed out, water is just as harmful if ingested in too great a quantity. So are any number of vitamins and/or minerals that your body needs to function.

 

[Scat]

Here's an article I just came accross that excercises a little common sense regarding these players and the use of creatine.

ABC News Vilifies Creatine
by Chris Shugart


The media is at it, again, doing their best to vilify the dietary-supplement industry and eventually force stricter and stricter government regulation. They won't be happy until all that's left on the shelves is Flintstones Complete.

This time, the evil culprit is creatine.

ABC just did a piece on 13 high school football players who were admitted to the hospital for compartment syndrome, a condition where swelling muscles are compressed by the fascia, begin to deteriorate, and emit toxins into the blood.

"Doctors are investigating whether muscle-building supplements like creatine, common among high school athletes, helped lead to this," the report stated. It ended with a warning to parents about the "possible dangers" of unregulated supplements. "Compartment syndrome is often linked to creatine," the accompanying text on the ABC News website said.

Ah, you can just hear the lamentations of the uninformed now, can't you?

"Creatine is a dangerous, steroid-like supplement! Remember when it killed those three wrestlers back in '97?"

The real story? The wrestlers were trying to drop weight, as much 12 pounds in a single day. They were on creatine, but they also wrapped themselves in trash bags or wore rubber suits and exercised until collapsing... in saunas... while restricting fluid intake... and taking diuretics. Their deaths were tragic, but not surprising given those circumstances.

The final ruling by the FDA? Creatine was not a factor in these deaths.

The newspapers, including the New York Times, retracted their alarmist stories, but the damage had been done. Creatine was, forever after, "dangerous" in the minds of the lay public and the media. As Winston Churchill once said, a lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.

And now it's happening again. And once again, they have the facts dead wrong.


The Facts
1. First off, according to ABC's own story, "...the players who were stricken with the symptoms said they hadn't taken any supplements." That didn't stop ABC from making the allegation and showing the same stock footage of creatine it used in 1997. One newspaper report did ominously say that some of the athletes "admitted" to drinking protein shakes. (Luckily, no one's kidneys imploded.)

2. The players, under the direction of new coach, Jeff Kearin, were involved in "immersion camp" — a period of intense practice where athletes stay overnight at the school. Some of the training involved exercising in a 115 degree wrestling room. (Sound familiar?) Water bottles were not made readily available, but athletes reportedly "had access" to water.

3. Creatine isn't "often linked" with compartment syndrome. Here's the full story: There were a couple of papers published years ago by a researcher named Pottinger that made the association. These papers were criticized due to methodological concerns, and Pottingger ended up leaving the university, reportedly due to these worries.

However, The American College of Sports Medicine (ACSM) picked up on these questionable studies and made them part of their recommendations.


Follow-up papers out of UCONN found:
"A high dose of CrM supplementation during exercise periods of increased thermal stress showed a mild to moderate trend toward increased ACP measures in dehydrated males. However, our results do not support the American College of Sports Medicine's recommendation, because no associated symptoms of anterior compartment syndrome were seen. The differences were minimal, and the increased pressures readily equalized after intermittent exercise."

In other words, one guy thought creatine might have something to do with compartment syndrome. He was wrong and this turned out not to be the case according to follow-up papers. But like the wrestlers who "died of creatine" the misinformation was released and word spread.


Richard Kreider, PhD, who has researched creatine since 1993, comments:
"Isn't it interesting how people always speculate that a supplement is the problem when they miss the obvious: overtraining in hot and humid environments? Train kids in a 115 degree room so they dehydrate during an 'immersion camp' where they no doubt were training excessively (raising CK levels) all day long for several days leading to more dehydration, and the problem is creatine?

"Many studies have been done (since the early 1990's) that show creatine does not cause dehydration. If anything, creatine promotes hyperhydration — whole body fluid retention — leading to less thermogregulatory stress during intense exercise in the heat.

"It would be nice if coaches (and the media) didn't blame their poor and potentially dangerous coaching and training methods on a supplement like creatine that research has own to be safe and effective in a number of populations for years."


Final Thoughts
Creatine has been used extensively by athletes since the early 1990's and Olympic athletes since the 1960's. After years of being studied (creatine is in fact the most studied sports supplement in history), are we to believe that it suddenly has an adverse side effect, and that this side effect mysteriously manifested at the same time in 13 high school footballers who happened to be practicing together?

The superintendent of the school, Maryalice Russell, said she didn't believe the problems were caused by the type of workouts the players were doing during the immersion camp. Of course she didn't. That might lead to accusations of staff incompetence. There could be lawsuits.

Better to point the finger at a supplement, even if it has never been shown to cause this effect, even if the players say they weren't even taking it.