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End Compulsory Education?

The Thriller

Well-Known Member
https://www.deseretnews.com/article...s-for-end-of-compulsory-education.html?pg=all

SALT LAKE CITY — Compulsory education laws have resulted in parents disengaging themselves from the responsibility to oversee the education of their children and have caused schools to falter under the burden of being all things to all people.

Those points are among the arguments made by Sen. Aaron Osmond, R-South Jordan, in an article posted Friday on the blog of the Utah State Senate, in which Osmond called for the end of compulsory education in the state.

"Some parents act as if the responsibility to educate, and even care for their child, is primarily the responsibility of the public school system," Osmond wrote. "As a result, our teachers and schools have been forced to become surrogate parents, expected to do everything from behavioral counseling, to providing adequate nutrition, to teaching sex education, as well as ensuring full college and career readiness."

Osmond wrote further that in the current state of public education, teachers do not receive meaningful support from parents, while at the same time parents become frustrated that schools are not able to meet the individual needs of their children. Osmond told the Deseret News that there is a need to shift the public mindset to viewing learning as an opportunity as opposed to an obligation, while also reinforcing the idea of liberty and choice.

"Let’s let them choose it, let’s not force them to do it," he said. "I think that’s when you start seeing the shift."

I get what he's saying. But, I really doubt that ending compulsory education will force a disinterested/too busy parent and/or student to suddenly become interested. Furthermore, what happens to those who leave the system? What consequences and costs await us then?
 
https://www.deseretnews.com/article...s-for-end-of-compulsory-education.html?pg=all



I get what he's saying. But, I really doubt that ending compulsory education will force a disinterested/too busy parent and/or student to suddenly become interested. Furthermore, what happens to those who leave the system? What consequences and costs await us then?

I agree. That will not end the bad, and in some cases no, parenting. All this will do is create an avenue for even more kids to slip thru the cracks. You need to get parents and kids interested in education not give them an out.
 
I agree. That will not end the bad, and in some cases no, parenting. All this will do is create an avenue for even more kids to slip thru the cracks. You need to get parents and kids interested in education not give them an out.

Precisely.
 
I agree. That will not end the bad, and in some cases no, parenting. All this will do is create an avenue for even more kids to slip thru the cracks. You need to get parents and kids interested in education not give them an out.

I think I told this story in this forum already, just not in this thread. About the roundup this year, and how my cows outsmarted the cowboys.

Turns out when the big rig cattle trailer comes down my road, my cows know what's going down. If the rig isn't in sight, I can walk out on the field, say with a shovel in hand, and start talking a bit loud while waving my free hand, pointing the direction I want them to go. Usually this means they get to move to a greener pasture, and they will move with hardly a complaint.

Well, this year I promised the cowboys I'd have the ones that needed to go separated and penned up in the corral, so they didn't even bring their horses. And on the appointed day, I went out in the morning and with my verbal powers of persuasion reasoned with the cows, and succeeded in separating the cows from the steers and the bull, putting the cows out on the next field, and used a few bales of hay to get the bull and the steers in the pen. The cowboys with the rig came and backed up to the loading ramp and we began to try to head them into the truck. . . me with my shovel, and the cowboy manning the gate.

But the bull is pretty smart. Smarter than me, I think. He ran in a tight circle and then headed straight for me on a dead run. The dead part of that term "dead run" was me, I think. I'd watched "Cowboys Don't Cry" just the past night, and I was trying to reason with a bull that should be in the rodeos. One line in the movie is "No quicker way to die than trying to make a bull laugh". I looked him in the eyes as he charged, and his eyes shifted a bit to one side, and I ran to the other while he thundered past. The cowboys had given me up for goners already.

The bull, with all the steers right behind ran into the next pen, did another circle, and picked a spot in the fence and took it with a jump. knocking it down a bit. . . . and all the steers followed. They ran to the fence up by the county road, and jumped that too, heading out into the blue sage.

I opened a gate so they could come back for water when they wanted, and the cowboys decided it was time for one of those "educational" chats about how they would no way in hell ever try again to pen that bull or get him on a cattle trailer, and how they didn't wanna to hear the news about me being dead, and how nothing but a 30.06 slug between his eyes would ever win the argument with my bull.

The way I figure it, "compulsory education" is like raising cattle in poop-filled corrals feeding them antibiotic-loaded feed, with plenty of fattening hormones to boot. Corrals like that produce stupid cattle who can't fend for themselves.

With human beings, "compulsory education" produces brain-stunted statists like Thriller and Stoked. Oh they might call themselves Democrats or Republicans and moo at one another in forums like this, but they really don't know how to fend for themselves. If some corporate enterprise doesn't give them a job with clear instructions and secure little niche they just don't know how to take care of themselves in life. And Thriller and Stoked are the smartest you can find in their class, too. Almost half of the class is so stupid they can't do anything but work for the government.

Having people like this prattling about how not having compulsory education will allow "more kids to slip thru the cracks" is proof enough of my point. Can't let human beings be actually free. That would be intolerable. The "State" cannot permit such a breech of control. The People must be managed, the same way cowboys manage their herds.
 
New students are like cows. You put cows in a new area the first thing they do is walk the fence line looking for weak spots. If they find none they settle down in the middle. The first thing new students like to do is try to find weak spots in your teaching. If they find none they settle down.
 
I see the whole thing as a pretty big non-issue. Meaning I don't think attendance or participation or learning are directly tied to compulsory education one bit.

So since it doesn't make any difference I say get rid of the useless law.

EDIT: In no way do I want my comments to be mis-construed to mean I support anything about Aaron Osmond...because I don't
 
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Babe, I like how you know next to nothing about me but have me all figured out.
 
"Some parents act as if the responsibility to educate, and even care for their child, is primarily the responsibility of the public school system," Osmond wrote. "As a result, our teachers and schools have been forced to become surrogate parents, expected to do everything from behavioral counseling, to providing adequate nutrition, to teaching sex education, as well as ensuring full college and career readiness."

This guy really believes parents have children they don't care to raise and nurture, to mold into competent and good adults? We go through all the fights and struggles, sleepless nights, worrying about sickness, ensuring our children are getting enough education and entertainment, with some hard work and responsibility mixed in, constant guardians outside the time they spent in schools, yet for some unexplained reason we want the school to be a surrogate parent? How much more outlandish can these far right Utah lunatics get?

Get the hell out of here, jackass Senator Osmond. I bet you're filling your bomb shelter with a cache of guns and ammo too.
 
This guy really believes parents have children they don't care to raise and nurture, to mold into competent and good adults? We go through all the fights and struggles, sleepless nights, worrying about sickness, ensuring our children are getting enough education and entertainment, with some hard work and responsibility mixed in, constant guardians outside the time they spent in schools, yet for some unexplained reason we want the school to be a surrogate parent? How much more outlandish can these far right Utah lunatics get?

Get the hell out of here, jackass Senator Osmond. I bet you're filling your bomb shelter with a cache of guns and ammo too.

Sadly enough, I have seen many parents that fit that mold.
 
Babe, I like how you know next to nothing about me but have me all figured out.

You have given out too much Reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later.

Well, of course.

That goes right along with knowing next to nothing period, and holding forth as the sage of Jazzfanz.

What did you expect????
 
Well, of course.

That goes right along with knowing next to nothing period, and holding forth as the sage of Jazzfanz.

What did you expect????

Lol. I think that if you and I actually got into a discussion about hot button issues you'd be surprised. Also notice how I talke about cumpulsory education but not what should be taught or how it should be taught.
 
This guy really believes parents have children they don't care to raise and nurture, to mold into competent and good adults? We go through all the fights and struggles, sleepless nights, worrying about sickness, ensuring our children are getting enough education and entertainment, with some hard work and responsibility mixed in, constant guardians outside the time they spent in schools, yet for some unexplained reason we want the school to be a surrogate parent? How much more outlandish can these far right Utah lunatics get?

Get the hell out of here, jackass Senator Osmond. I bet you're filling your bomb shelter with a cache of guns and ammo too.

Aside from being from South Jordan, a stronghold of urban farmers and ********* barns, there's little I know about Osmond that I really approve. I was surprized he came out on this side of this issue.

I homeschool my kids, or try to. . . . . One day I was being visited by a conservative truly of the stripe who believes a cache of ammo and stashed guns in the pipes of the corral fences mean freedom in the information age was curious about this funny chart I was using to teach my ten-year olds.

" I went to a private school, but I never saw anything like this", he said.

It was the Periodic Chart of the Elements.

However, I do believe the public school institutions as they have been constructed in brick and mortar with a superfluous administrative staff must be changed with an educational revolution.

No reason we cannot go to Internet Education. No reason to go on paying for all the educational personnel and to keep those buildings doing little beyond warehousing kids and forcing parents to drive the loop to school and then work. We can do the job with half the staff, half the buildings, and half the compulsory indoctrination. . . . and get twice the actual preparation for jobs. . . . and ten times the effectiveness in building citizenship values. And one hundred times the level of freedom.
 
Aside from being from South Jordan, a stronghold of urban farmers and ********* barns, there's little I know about Osmond that I really approve. I was surprized he came out on this side of this issue.

He may have come out on the right side of the issue, for you, but the path taken to get there was being a condescending jackass and an ignoramus.

I've never met a single person who wants the schools to become surrogate parents. Not one even remotely close to that mindset. If they did then why would they bother with the children at all? It's nonsense, but I hear in the news every time this comes up that these people are swarming our neighborhoods. Yet I haven't met a single one yet.
 
He may have come out on the right side of the issue, for you, but the path taken to get there was being a condescending jackass and an ignoramus.

I've never met a single person who wants the schools to become surrogate parents. Not one even remotely close to that mindset. If they did then why would they bother with the children at all? It's nonsense, but I hear in the news every time this comes up that these people are swarming our neighborhoods. Yet I haven't met a single one yet.

I've meet tons. As for why they bothered with kids. It is not so much trying to have them as not caring enough to prevent it. That is from lack of education, lack or resources or just beeing blazed/buzzed out of their minds.
 
Aside from being from South Jordan, a stronghold of urban farmers and ********* barns, there's little I know about Osmond that I really approve. I was surprized he came out on this side of this issue.

I homeschool my kids, or try to. . . . . One day I was being visited by a conservative truly of the stripe who believes a cache of ammo and stashed guns in the pipes of the corral fences mean freedom in the information age was curious about this funny chart I was using to teach my ten-year olds.

" I went to a private school, but I never saw anything like this", he said.

It was the Periodic Chart of the Elements.

However, I do believe the public school institutions as they have been constructed in brick and mortar with a superfluous administrative staff must be changed with an educational revolution.

No reason we cannot go to Internet Education. No reason to go on paying for all the educational personnel and to keep those buildings doing little beyond warehousing kids and forcing parents to drive the loop to school and then work. We can do the job with half the staff, half the buildings, and half the compulsory indoctrination. . . . and get twice the actual preparation for jobs. . . . and ten times the effectiveness in building citizenship values. And one hundred times the level of freedom.

And your kids will be one hundred times more socially backward than any of their peers, will have no friends, will not date, will have no communication skills, and will generally be weird as ****. By show of hands, has anyone ever met a home schooled kid who DIDN'T fit this mold? Me either.
 
And your kids will be one hundred times more socially backward than any of their peers, will have no friends, will not date, will have no communication skills, and will generally be weird as ****. By show of hands, has anyone ever met a home schooled kid who DIDN'T fit this mold? Me either.

Raises hand. They compensated for this by having the kid very active in sports and other after school organizations. I think it was reading club, baseball, scouts...
 
Raises hand. They compensated for this by having the kid very active in sports and other after school organizations. I think it was reading club, baseball, scouts...

Nice. Nothing screams "normal" like "reading club".
 
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