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Forever Utah......

babe

Well-Known Member
So a while ago I was investigating this site's political bearings, trying to figure out if there is room for a conservative Utah Jazz site...... here's some stuff I learned:

http://archive.sltrib.com/article.php?id=4853754&itype=CMSID

archived means, I think, you have to have privileges to see it now.... but you get the drift. The Legacy Trust designed to keep the Utah Jazz and the Vivint Smart Arena right here. A few more good years, a championship, and it might even become a dynasty of sorts.
 
And guess what.... Gail Miller as a political heavyweight in Utah: Number 7 in Gerke's list. Read it.

https://www.sltrib.com/news/politic...list-of-utahs-top-25-political-power-players/

Miller and Zion's CEO(translate that as LDS point man) chief supporters of the Count My Vote initiative. The "establishment" closing the Republican caucus route to the Party nomination allowing big money to outweigh the "Keep My Voice" side of the Republican Party, the usually impoverished principled real Republicans, imo.

uhhhhhmmmmmmm....... no, Miller would like this site better than mine.
 
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I've been in San Jose a lot lately, up and down the 880 and 680 past Oakland...... nah.... I'd like even establishment Utah Rs more than the Warriors. But I do have a standing invitation with the coach of the San Jose Sharks hockey team to take my family to a front row box at one of their games.

https://www.nhl.com/sharks
 
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So a while ago I was investigating this site's political bearings, trying to figure out if there is room for a conservative Utah Jazz site...... here's some stuff I learned:

http://archive.sltrib.com/article.php?id=4853754&itype=CMSID

archived means, I think, you have to have privileges to see it now.... but you get the drift. The Legacy Trust designed to keep the Utah Jazz and the Vivint Smart Arena right here. A few more good years, a championship, and it might even become a dynasty of sorts.

The Miller's definitely put a good spin on the creation of a tax shelter and tool to manage transition of assets to the next generation of Millers. Keeping the $$$ in the team allows it to grow and delaying taxes. However, as you grow the value of a business, at some point you have to get that value out. If the purpose of the trust requires profits to go back to the team, the only way to get the profit out is to eventually sell the team.

The team can still be sold if Gail, as trustee receive an offer that is in the best interest of the beneficiaries of the trust (and she, in her capacity as trustee, may even have a fiduciary duty to sale if the offer was really good--you have to look to the trust documents to determine, but all trustees have a fiduciary duty to the beneficiaries based on common law). Once the ownership passes to the family board, the new board of trustees will have those duties, and I assume based on the information in the article a vote from 4 or 5 of 6 (supermajority is an amount greater than 50%, but generally 66% in documents I have worked with) is enough to authorize a sale. So in some ways, it makes the team harder to sell (more people have to agree to a sale vs. one shareholder), but in some ways it actually makes a sale more likely (a sole shareholder can sell if they want to, and they don't have any fiduciary duty or other pressure to sell--a trustee of a trust has to do what is in the best interest of the beneficiaries).

The real benefit is they get a huge tax deferral/tax break. I appreciate the Miller family for bringing the Jazz to Utah, and it has paid off well for them and their businesses. I hope the team stays in Utah for the long-haul, but the legacy trust does not do that by any means.
 
I'm convinced the thriller and babe are aliens

probably on same side - arguing back and forth to keep everyone disillusioned
 
I mean the thriller didn't even know we beat Golden State this year, then asked if we did it in the regular season or in the playoffs???? I mean WTF

I know I deserve this. Only an alien would not know this stuff until now.

My wife thinks I'm an alien, too.

Almost any night I'm on the road to somewhere. Some truckers honk or flash their lights before trying to pass me. I drive slow because elk, deer, even antelope could do in my radiator. Truckers don think about that. Lots of front end steel. Small animals are no issue.

A very modest space ship that could get me from SLC to Sacramento in an hour would be a plus. (nobody needs to inform me about airplanes in commercial business. My dad was a flying school teacher who told me no fool should try to fly, and explained gravity. Two of his students tried doing stunts over their mom's house and killed themselves crashing in their own yard. I have to do my own driving.)
 
I mean the thriller didn't even know we beat Golden State this year, then asked if we did it in the regular season or in the playoffs???? I mean WTF

For the record, I was one of the first two to enter the final place poll saying the Jazz would take sixth in the conference. Nobody believed we could do better than that. And ask Bullet if I didn't tell him we could beat Golden State when we started our streak. My brother watches every game in the NBA I think. I ask him what he thinks. In Nov he said we were no good this year. In Feb he said we shouldn't have traded away the guy who went the wrong way for Boston to lose the series with Cleveland...... nobody knows it all. Isn't that where we got really good?
 
Maybe they are one alien with multiple personalities...

No.

I've been called lots of things, but I laugh at most of them.

I could render it alphabetically or on the basis of frequency.

Sir is actually the most common. Grandpa is second. Uncle is third. I'm not a grandpa but I am Uncle. I just don't see the kids that much.
but there is not any alt for me in JFC. The JFC member who called himself alt whatever is not me.

I'm becoming a Sharks fan, the more I read about them. I was a pretty good skater but never played hockey. They barely lost to Las Vegas this year, so close. And Vegas almost took the Stanley Cup.
 
So a while ago I was investigating this site's political bearings, trying to figure out if there is room for a conservative Utah Jazz site...... here's some stuff I learned:

http://archive.sltrib.com/article.php?id=4853754&itype=CMSID

archived means, I think, you have to have privileges to see it now.... but you get the drift. The Legacy Trust designed to keep the Utah Jazz and the Vivint Smart Arena right here. A few more good years, a championship, and it might even become a dynasty of sorts.
See the discussion here: https://jazzfanz.com/threads/utah-jazz-ownership-restructured-and-placed-in-family-trust.59887/

Personally I think it's an amazing thing. But some forum members were more cynical.
 
Lonnie Walker and Colin Serxton

See the discussion here: https://jazzfanz.com/threads/utah-jazz-ownership-restructured-and-placed-in-family-trust.59887/

Personally I think it's an amazing thing. But some forum members were more cynical.
If memory serves, wasn't the precursor Gail stepping in to take back control of the team because none of the boys, including Greg, were all that interested in the basketball side of the family empire? So no, it's not a guarantee, but had Gail died before the trust were put in place, I think it's a certainty the Miller children would have cashed out immediately. As it is, now they can't just raid the team for profits.

Jazz will be sold eventually. Hopefully there are enough MLM guys in Utah county who can band together to buy the team and keep it in Utah. I'd hate to have to go to Vegas to worship at the shrine of Donovan.
 
If memory serves, wasn't the precursor Gail stepping in to take back control of the team because none of the boys, including Greg, were all that interested in the basketball side of the family empire? So no, it's not a guarantee, but had Gail died before the trust were put in place, I think it's a certainty the Miller children would have cashed out immediately. As it is, now they can't just raid the team for profits.

Jazz will be sold eventually. Hopefully there are enough MLM guys in Utah county who can band together to buy the team and keep it in Utah. I'd hate to have to go to Vegas to worship at the shrine of Donovan.

It's a tax shelter. Inheritance taxes would have forced them to either sell or load each one of them in debt up to their eyeballs. Debt that the Jazz profits couldn't service. Gail did it to avoid that scenario forcing a sale.
 
Someone on this board was in the room when this stuff was being discussed with the city. What I have heard about that meeting is that Gail Miller was trying to keep the Jazz in SLC, trying to preserve something Larry H Miller cared very deeply about, protecting it from the children.
 
I kinda got that drift form some other comments above, too. Stuff like the kids aren't really that interested. That's more of less normal for kids up to a point. The effort to institutionalize it and make it a tradition supported by the community and more determined by community interests is my kind of ideal. Gail Miller is top flight.
 
It's a tax shelter. Inheritance taxes would have forced them to either sell or load each one of them in debt up to their eyeballs. Debt that the Jazz profits couldn't service. Gail did it to avoid that scenario forcing a sale.

I think there could be better "tax shelter" plans. Maybe better plans to keep estate taxes from forcing a sale. I favor doing in, deep sixing, estate taxes entirely. The folks already paid taxes on everything once. Or more.

I think a conservation trust could be something we as a society should consider in enabling assets of community value, traditional value, to be preserved. Just get the tax collectors off the case entirely.
 
I think there could be better "tax shelter" plans. Maybe better plans to keep estate taxes from forcing a sale. I favor doing in, deep sixing, estate taxes entirely. The folks already paid taxes on everything once. Or more.

I think a conservation trust could be something we as a society should consider in enabling assets of community value, traditional value, to be preserved. Just get the tax collectors off the case entirely.

Still hitched to the British Royalty system you despise because of your anti-tax sentiment?

You do realize your 2nd paragraph is Rockafeller territory, yes? You are promoting a solution that you actively fight against. Conservation trusts is a cool idea but you damn well know how moneyed interests will [and have controlled in like kind] control law regarding this.

I realize you won't ever accept anything but pull yourself up from your bootstraps, which I consider the most commendable human trait, but I can't burn down a community that makes that situation possible. No estate tax (with threasholds) leads to that possibility being impossible.
 
I like people who will try to reasonably inform me.

I confess to being conflicted on this particular issue because I know as you do what the super moneyed people have done with the idea of trusts and a thousand other tax favors our bought and paid for legislators have given them.

But the estate tax is an issue that seriously harms most farmers whose land values have steadily increase decade by decade for 150 years. A family farm literally has to be sold to pay the estate taxes. Gail Miller's Utah Jazz faces similar problems. I am looking for a stable progressive (not in the political sense, but in the financial sense or practical sense of "progress") way for people to build their security and wealth over time.

I have seen first-hand how the very wealthy do their business and conserve their assets on favorable terms, paying less taxes in every respect than the ill-informed and unwashed masses, but I do not believe people should be taxed twice.... especially poor dirt famers who lived their whole lives on the brink of bankruptcy stirring the dust that just inflated in value under their feet. Let them have their land.

And let Gail Miller have her Utah Jazz.

But maybe it would be a good idea to get those hoity-toity bluebloods taxed once, any way.
 
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