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Jazz Should Extend Royce

Handlogten's Heros

Handlogten's Heros

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With the flurry of rookie extensions today I thought this would be a solid stand alone thread. Jazz should extend Royce. There will be an abundance of cap space available this summer and not many free agents to take it. He doesn't get the rookie extension like the guys getting deals now... we can do it in season. Highest we can go is like 4/$48M which is more than enough.

4/$30M seems like it should get the deal done... add some incentives to give it some upside for Royce and limit our exposure. JZ... get er done!
 
Shad said:
No way he extends for 4/30. We gave a pile of garbage 3/33
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Dante's contract does not mean we have to give stupid money to everyone. It was also 3 for 28.8M.

People said Dinwiddie would not extend his deal last year... People were wrong. If you have made good money but not family tree altering money in your NBA career and a team presents you with that bag it is hard to turn down. I'd set the over/under at 4/$30M.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Dante's contract does not mean we have to give stupid money to everyone. It was also 3 for 28.8M.

People said Dinwiddie would not extend his deal last year... People were wrong. If you have made good money but not family tree altering money in your NBA career and a team presents you with that bag it is hard to turn down. I'd set the over/under at 4/$30M.
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I think this is a very, very interesting question, though, basketball aside.

Royce is a guy who’s earned a couple million. $30M has you and generations set forever. You could gamble that on health and perhaps nab another $10-15M, but if you sustain a major injury (not all that likely, but always possible... I pay for life insurance to take care of my family in a scenario that I don’t even think is likely to happen) and it’s possible that $30M could drop to $5M, or you could never play again. $30M vs. $45M — is there fundamentally a difference? How big is the difference between those two, rather than the difference between $30M and nothing? There’s just a lot of risk that carries possible catastrophic consequences (using catastrophic liberally here) when the gain is (relatively) so little. Of course an agent may push for risk, because with their interests diversified amongst many clients, they can distribute those risks. The player is like a single stock, themselves, where the agent is a mutual fund.
 
infection said:
I think this is a very, very interesting question, though, basketball aside.

Royce is a guy who’s earned a couple million. $30M has you and generations set forever. You could gamble that on health and perhaps nab another $10-15M, but if you sustain a major injury (not all that likely, but always possible... I pay for life insurance to take care of my family in a scenario that I don’t even think is likely to happen) and it’s possible that $30M could drop to $5M, or you could never play again. $30M vs. $45M — is there fundamentally a difference? How big is the difference between those two, rather than the difference between $30M and nothing? There’s just a lot of risk that carries possible catastrophic consequences (using catastrophic liberally here) when the gain is (relatively) so little. Of course an agent may push for risk, because with their interests diversified amongst many clients, they can distribute those risks. The player is like a single stock, themselves, where the agent is a mutual fund.
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Good agents should always represent their clients wishes. So getting 30M vs. 45M (with extreme risk) shouldn't matter as much as having a happy client. There might be only a 5-10% chance he sustains an injury or has such a bad season that he takes his market value down to like a minimum deal... but going from $30M to $5M is just a killer.

I know we understand this... but that potential risk is what lands us a bargain deal. Dante was a free agent so he got a little more than he would have under an extension a year before free agency came.

I think Royce's upper limit next year is MLE... if we offer around 30M-ish he should take it. Aminu got like $9-10M over 3 years... that's kinda the comp I'd use with Royce (different players but similar 3 and D role). Say its a base of 4/30, but can go to $34M with bonuses for games played, defensive rating, second round of the playoffs... stuff like that.
 
infection said:
I think this is a very, very interesting question, though, basketball aside.

Royce is a guy who’s earned a couple million. $30M has you and generations set forever. You could gamble that on health and perhaps nab another $10-15M, but if you sustain a major injury (not all that likely, but always possible... I pay for life insurance to take care of my family in a scenario that I don’t even think is likely to happen) and it’s possible that $30M could drop to $5M, or you could never play again. $30M vs. $45M — is there fundamentally a difference? How big is the difference between those two, rather than the difference between $30M and nothing? There’s just a lot of risk that carries possible catastrophic consequences (using catastrophic liberally here) when the gain is (relatively) so little. Of course an agent may push for risk, because with their interests diversified amongst many clients, they can distribute those risks. The player is like a single stock, themselves, where the agent is a mutual fund.
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and if he truly is worth a little more than that surely he's still young enough to get another decent payday after this contract ?
 
Douchebag K said:
and if he truly is worth a little more than that surely he's still young enough to get another decent payday after this contract ?
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He'd be 30 but guys like Danny Green got $14M a year on a shorter deal... I think his next contract will represent more than half his NBA money.

I wouldn't be surprised if we ended up offering him a little extra... it also isn't wise for use to fight him over a couple million if we are close.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Good agents should always represent their clients wishes.
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Should, but my biggest argument during the lockout is that these guys were willing to forgo up to a year of salary over some minuscule BRI number that is only relevant if you have long-term skin in the game. Most these guys have 5-7 year careers. Missing a year is huge. They’d never recoup that (if they hypothetically held out a year, as there was some talk of). Who has long-term skin in the game, and who’s advising these kids? The agents.
 
infection said:
Should, but my biggest argument during the lockout is that these guys were willing to forgo up to a year of salary over some minuscule BRI number that is only relevant if you have long-term skin in the game. Most these guys have 5-7 year careers. Missing a year is huge. They’d never recoup that (if they hypothetically held out a year, as there was some talk of). Who has long-term skin in the game, and who’s advising these kids? The agents.
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Yes. but if you asked them individually during the lockout if they would forego the money I'm guessing that'd be a no... also the lockout was resolved after they started missing some checks. The middle class player in the NBA hasn't been well represented by the player's union.

Some guys are dumb... like Nerlens Noel and some guys get bad agents/advice... like George Hill. Most will take the bag.

I think our regular rotation players have solid local marketing opportunities here that aren't available everywhere... plus he can ride DM's coattails to fame. I think we get something done.
 
Speaking of extensions... Jazz just extended Ingles for another year... 1 year 14M.
 
NUMBERICA said:
It kinda maybe might. Players - like other insanely wealthy people - run out of valid reasons to want more, so wealth most times becomes a measuring stick against peers.

Another reason that contract is more than just a complete embarrassment.
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There is some truth here for sure... I think it's less of a concern if you've never made the big NBA money, but who knows.
 
I'm sure the Jazz are trying to hammer something out with him. Problem is, he likely sees himself as a starter. And he could be. Big difference between starter and bench money. Will he be restricted if he's not extended? This could be a Hood-like situation where he and his agent take a gamble on him proving he's worth a lot more than what Utah is willing to give him right now. I have no problem with Utah having to pay him $45M next summer; that means he had a great year.
 
Wow...Jaylen Brown got 4/$115M. Have to think Tatum will get the rookie max in 2 years. At some point, don't the Celtics have to stop printing money? I could see Gordie getting shown the door when his contract is up.
 
Jack Strop said:
I'm sure the Jazz are trying to hammer something out with him. Problem is, he likely sees himself as a starter. And he could be. Big difference between starter and bench money. Will he be restricted if he's not extended? This could be a Hood-like situation where he and his agent take a gamble on him proving he's worth a lot more than what Utah is willing to give him right now. I have no problem with Utah having to pay him $45M next summer; that means he had a great year.
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I think the 4/$45 million is what it will take. I’m sure the Jazz have tried to get something done but it’s probably best for both sides to wait until next summer which is what I see happening. Royce will be restricted. Royce’s agent is Ty Sullivan, also Donovan’s agent. I very much hope the Jazz can just get something worked out with Royce before he ends up a RFA, we shall see. Exums $11 mill will come off in 2021 which will be good.

Something to also keep an eye on is the China situation. It could end up having some cap implications going forward. If China sticks it to the NBA it may impact money/cap space available going forward.
 
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