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jazznik said:
I think Ainge is targeting young players who had bad years in hopes that they are undervalued and can really improve. Sometimes it works (Lauri, Sexton), sometimes it really doesn't (THT) and sometimes they show some improvements but nothing special (Collins). It's just a way to invest the cap space of a rebuilding team for profit. I am OK with that.
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Lauri and Sexton were apart of something much bigger and not comparable to THT and Collins deal. I am fine doing deals like the THT and John Collins deals… but all the “profit” on those deals is generally coming on the buy side. So negotiate harder or pass and find another deal. The THT deal was a fail and Collins is underwater imo. Tough to profit in a deal when you buy in higher than you should.
 
I’ll ask another way. John Collins is an unrestricted FA… how much money/years is he getting?
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Is John Collin’s value higher than last year. I understand people saying we bought low on Collins because his price before trade seemed higher but I’d argue his value currently is lower (we’d have to add something to dump him) so I’d say we bought high on Collins.

Like if a stock goes from 30 to 25 and you buy it at 25 but now it’s worth 20… can you keep saying you bought low?
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And this doesn’t even factor in the cost of having John Collins on your team. Which has proven to be a really horrible experience. I was in the camp of it being a “low risk high reward” move that I liked. Major L taken on that one.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
3/45ish
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Hearsky said:
Two years, $20m total. Team option on the 2nd year. I think he could have got 3/45 fully guaranteed last year. I think this year proved it wasn't the organization holding him back.
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I think this is the ballpark. I’d say it’s likely 3/40 with a team option on third year. Something based on about the MLE for 2-3 years. So 2/56 is pretty negative… by about 20M. We took him into space when he had 3/80… we gave up Rudy’s 7M or whatever but clearly we bought high. It was lower than peak value but we still bought way too high and the Hawks were the ones with urgency. We absolutely should have waited them out and make them add a pick.

THT same deal.
 
homeytennis said:
In hindsight the Jazz probably would have been better off keeping Gay and letting his deal expire. Collins ended up using valuable minutes that could have gone to Tay Henny.
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Gee I wonder who threw a tantrum when the jazz made that trade?
fishonjazz said:
Sounds about right.

What is his current deal with the jazz?

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Pretty sure it’s 25million a year somewhere around that.
 
Bawse Dawg said:
And this doesn’t even factor in the cost of having John Collins on your team. Which has proven to be a really horrible experience. I was in the camp of it being a “low risk high reward” move that I liked. Major L taken on that one.
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Me too. I hated the trade when it happened. Then talked myself into thinking it was a great trade.



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jazznik said:
Here are players making about 15 million this season: Bullock, Strus, KCP, Kennard, Dort, LeVert, Valanciunas, Huerter. I think it could be argued that Collins is more valuable than a typical 15 million player.
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Ya john collins at 15 million? Thumbs up. John collins at 25 million (current)? Thumbs down.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I think this is the ballpark. I’d say it’s likely 3/40 with a team option on third year. Something based on about the MLE for 2-3 years. So 2/56 is pretty negative… by about 20M. We took him into space when he had 3/80… we gave up Rudy’s 7M or whatever but clearly we bought high. It was lower than peak value but we still bought way too high and the Hawks were the ones with urgency. We absolutely should have waited them out and make them add a pick.

THT same deal.
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again we need salary to send back during trades. y'all are freaking out about nothing. This is a far less ****** move than looking at our PG rotation and keeping THT instead of sending away NAW to the Wolves (criticized it then, and I'm vindicated with every passing month)

George W
 
George W said:
again we need salary to send back during trades. y'all are freaking out about nothing. This is a far less ****** move than looking at our PG rotation and keeping THT instead of sending away NAW to the Wolves (criticized it then, and I'm vindicated with every passing month)

George W
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Sending naw AND Conley to the team whose future picks we own was so dumb and unnecessary

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No interview because there is nothing to say. 8th and 9th picks no stars no future. We are stuck for years to Come. Who was against tanking for Wamby??
 
jazzfan1132 said:
No interview because there is nothing to say. 8th and 9th picks no stars no future. We are stuck for years to Come. Who was against tanking for Wamby??
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So you were going to jettison Laurie to strain for a 25% chance at getting him?

What was your plan to up the odds, ie outsmart the NBA?
 
UpArrow said:
So you were going to jettison Laurie to strain for a 25% chance at getting him?

What was your plan to up the odds, ie outsmart the NBA?
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Jettison Conley and Clarkson doe. Sit Lauri, sexton etc sometimes when they don't really need to sit. You know, like we literally just did. We were the worst team in the league this season since the trade deadline. WITH a healthy Lauri markennan on the team

Tell Kessler he has to shoot 5 threes per game.

Play tht 40 minutes per game at point guard.

This is the way (should have been the way anyways)



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jazznik said:
Here are players making about 15 million this season: Bullock, Strus, KCP, Kennard, Dort, LeVert, Valanciunas, Huerter. I think it could be argued that Collins is more valuable than a typical 15 million player.
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I’d take 5 of those guys over John. I’d take every one of those contracts over John’s. Bullock JV and Kennard were expiring deals.

He is not more valuable than the typical 15M player.
 
George W said:
again we need salary to send back during trades. y'all are freaking out about nothing. This is a far less ****** move than looking at our PG rotation and keeping THT instead of sending away NAW to the Wolves (criticized it then, and I'm vindicated with every passing month)

George W
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Not freaking out but there are lots of different and better ways to get salary for trades. If the argument is “we need his salary to reach the floor to trade in 2 years” then you already lost.
 
UpArrow said:
So you were going to jettison Laurie to strain for a 25% chance at getting him?

What was your plan to up the odds, ie outsmart the NBA?
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He never said that.

But in all fairness to the jazz. No one thought Lauri would be that good. Next thing you know the jazz are 10-3 in first place. If the jazz had known what they had before the season started they may have made some more tanking moves.
 
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