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What next moves do you WANT to see?

Coach Ellis said:
The Jazz have to learn their hard lessons. There’s no way they should attach any picks to Collins/Clarkson to move them. Better moves are bound to be out there and they should prioritize those. Trading Derrick Favors like that screwed this team hard. Jazz should be hoarding assets, not dumping them.
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I would be willing to give up a late first or two for a franchise player. That's how I'm looking at it.



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Coach Ellis said:
If you went for Ingram, would you also expect the team to extend him? If so, at what number?

I’m thinking there’s a not-zero possibility that Ingram is the next target domino for DA, and I don’t think they trade for him as a rental if they go that route.

If you aren’t tanking, I think you do Collins, Sensabaugh and draft assets for Ingram - keeping Sexton and Kessler for your rotation - at least for this year.

If you are tanking, I think you expand the deal into Sexton, Collins and Clarkson for Ingram and McCollum. Extend Ingram and then look to trade McCollum next year as an expiring, while prioritizing the 1st and 2nd year players in the rotation right now.
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Only the Pelicans can extend him and now it's past the time he can be extended and traded by the deadline I believe, just like the Lauri situation
 
fishonjazz said:
I would be willing to give up a late first or two for a franchise player. That's how I'm looking at it.



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I still think you run the risk of dumping assets and still being better than you expect tbh. Which makes it doubling down on bad bets. Too much is outside of your control for that to be a good strategy imo.
 
Coach Ellis said:
I think Sexton and Collins off the bench bring a lot more value than you give them credit for. Sexton is a winning player imo. If he and Markkanen are both healthy and playing, the Jazz give their pick to the Thunder this year.
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Yeah Sexton plays too hard for the tank.

He’s on the wrong team and clearly needs to go, like yesterday.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Only the Pelicans can extend him and now it's past the time he can be extended and traded by the deadline I believe, just like the Lauri situation
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If the Jazz can’t extend him, it makes the price tag for trading for him go way down. No way I want to attach significant assets to a potential rental.
 
Indifferent on Ingram but his agent is apparently looking for a contract that starts north of $50 mil and will be eligible for a 5/$269 mil contract next offseason. His extension deadline already passed on June 30th. I don't think he's worth more than Lauri but some team such as the Spurs could give it to him. Not a huge fan of his game as he tends to ball stop and take too many mid range jumpers. Ofc Hardy has had some success working with other players with flaws in their games.

Bottomline it would kinda suck to have him ruin a tank and then not re-sign him next summer. You know he's not going to cooperate with tanking or capping his numbers in a contract season.
 
Also, I know that the current plan is to keep Prodica in Europe for another season to let him recover from his late-season injury issues. . . but I might be tempted to use some of the available cap space to just buy him out and bring him over now while his stock is still kind of middling.
 
Yeah. After looking into it more, I’m kind of out on Ingram. It’s a solid move in theory, but there’s too much risk at this point to make a big investment in him. I think the Jazz probably pivot to tanking now and then hunting stars after this offseason to team up with Lauri and hope one or more of the young guys break out. Still too much talent on this team to bottom out, IMO.
 
Coach Ellis said:
If you went for Ingram, would you also expect the team to extend him? If so, at what number?

I’m thinking there’s a not-zero possibility that Ingram is the next target domino for DA, and I don’t think they trade for him as a rental if they go that route.

If you aren’t tanking, I think you do Collins, Sensabaugh and draft assets for Ingram - keeping Sexton and Kessler for your rotation - at least for this year.

If you are tanking, I think you expand the deal into Sexton, Collins and Clarkson for Ingram and McCollum. Extend Ingram and then look to trade McCollum next year as an expiring, while prioritizing the 1st and 2nd year players in the rotation right now.
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Get Ingram and wait and decide next summer on what to do. Maybe trade him next summer, maybe resign him. I just like getting off of the Collins salary.

Also, mess with the roster construction hardcore so that there is no rim protection and you only have rookies + sophomores in your guard lineup (bye Kessler, Collins, Sexton, Clarkson).
 
The Midnight said:
Yeah Sexton plays too hard for the tank.

He’s on the wrong team and clearly needs to go, like yesterday.
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The way to limit his production is limit his minutes similar to what they were doing early in the season. Of course that will completely tank his value.

Unfortunately there are a bunch of scoring guards who are probably available (Beal, Poole, Simons, Herro, Clarkson, DLo). When you consider contract, production and age I'd take Sexton over any of them.
 
Coach Ellis said:
If the Jazz can’t extend him, it makes the price tag for trading for him go way down. No way I want to attach significant assets to a potential rental.
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Just to clarify, the Jazz can extend him....but it can only be 5% raises and two more additional years. I'm not sure Ingram will take that as he probably has aspirations to get a full max.

The other angle to this would be the classic wink wink. Lowe and McMahon mentioned this when they had the initial conversation that has become the source of every aggregated "rumor". If the Jazz promised him the full max I'm sure Ingram would agree to it and stick by it like Siakam did.
 
I'm sure Pelicans would love to trade Ingram given the contract situation, but I wouldn't think they're too keen on selling him cheap. Probably better to give it another run and hope to stay healthy then lose him for nothing.
 
Coach Ellis said:
I still think you run the risk of dumping assets and still being better than you expect tbh. Which makes it doubling down on bad bets. Too much is outside of your control for that to be a good strategy imo.
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If we are better than expected because Hendricks and Williams popped (due to Collins and Clarkson not taking their minutes) then I'm down to pay a price to make that happen as well.

Get rid of Collins and Clarkson and we get a top 3 pick or we are too damn good because the young guys popped. I like both of those scenarios.

What I don't like is Collins and Clarkson each playing 30 minutes per night and we end up with the 9th or 10th pick in the draft.

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whatthe said:
Maybe trade him next summer, maybe resign him.
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I don't think you can trade a free agent.

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On the one hand, we have people worrying about needing to attach an asset to get rid of Collins.

On the other hand we worry, if we were somehow able to trade Ingram for Collins, that Ingram would walk at the end of the year.



Not sure that those worries fit with each other very well.
 
My main thing would be to do everything I can to eliminate the worst case scenario. The worst case scenario is finishing the season and going into the lottery with horrible odds for a top pick because Collins, Clarkson, Lauri, and Sexton were all playing 30 plus minutes per game and we were trying to win them all.

Do what it takes to get rid of Clarkson and Collins. That eliminates the worst case scenario. Nice thing is that it also increases the odds of the best case scenarios happening (top 5 pick or the current young dudes balling out with bigger roles)

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Bawse Dawg said:
I would love to see this

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You missed the part where we also get the second and third picks.
 
idiot said:
On the one hand, we have people worrying about needing to attach an asset to get rid of Collins.

On the other hand we worry, if we were somehow able to trade Ingram for Collins, that Ingram would walk at the end of the year.



Not sure that those worries fit with each other very well.
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Ingram walking is as much a bug as a feature.
 
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