What's new

2024-2025 Tank Race

It is odd we have had two random games were Kessler got 3's drawn up for him and they just havent done it any other game. I wonder if Hardy lost some kind of bet with Walker for those moments.
Good points. Seems like there’s enough there to use a tanking season to explore and I’m not even joking.

What if he nails them at a 35%+ clip? Great! If he sucks? Great! Either way, it will help answer the question of the viability and allow him to work through any nerves that might be there.
 
The odds are concrete, there is no confusion. When I say disaster situation, I am strictly talking about the actual scenario of falling to 7. I’m not talking about being in 4th position. At 4th position, we have that 19% chance of falling to 7 or below. Is that actually a disaster? Perhaps that’s a bit hyperbolic, but there is a truly significant drop off in quality at that point from my perspective.
I was not thinking of your argument when I made the post you responded to. I was thinking solely of Leif. He was worried especially about falling out of the top 3, so the post you're responding to here reflects that.

As for whether we fall to 5 or to 7: yeah that's a difference. But, as I mentioned in an even earlier post, there are perhaps ways to think about it that make it seem like not such a big deal (particularly if you don't think who you get at #5 will end up being THE GUY).
 
Good points. Seems like there’s enough there to use a tanking season to explore and I’m not even joking.

What if he nails them at a 35%+ clip? Great! If he sucks? Great! Either way, it will help answer the question of the viability and allow him to work through any nerves that might be there.
I hated when he shot htem last year cuz he was playing really mediocre. But hes playing great now, so I dont mind if he takes 1 or 2 a game.
 
I think that is right but I think they keep Lauri. I think I'd sell on Collins/Sexton and of course JC. Don't sign any other functional vets as some of the youngsters are getting more functional and we don't want to tip the scales much.

I wonder if they consider trading Lauri. He does seem pretty bought in to the tank but I wonder if that has an expiration date. I highly doubt they would find something they find satisfactory with how they value him but maybe someone comes strong and they do it.

Even if we trade every vet except for Lauri, I think our young guys will have improved enough such that we won't get a top lotto position. But then again, maybe you can live with it as long as you have Flagg. Flagg+Lauri+5-10% at top 4? I guess. I think just clearing out around Flagg is also a sound choice.

Without Flagg, I am 100% trading Lauri. Sucks that we didn't get to build around Lauri or trade him at peak value, but you have to cut losses.
 
Good points. Seems like there’s enough there to use a tanking season to explore and I’m not even joking.

What if he nails them at a 35%+ clip? Great! If he sucks? Great! Either way, it will help answer the question of the viability and allow him to work through any nerves that might be there.
Should have been doing this since game one of his rookie year tbh. Of course we should have traded conley before that season began and tanked the F's out of that B in the first place.
 
I think that is right but I think they keep Lauri. I think I'd sell on Collins/Sexton and of course JC. Don't sign any other functional vets as some of the youngsters are getting more functional and we don't want to tip the scales much.

I wonder if they consider trading Lauri. He does seem pretty bought in to the tank but I wonder if that has an expiration date. I highly doubt they would find something they find satisfactory with how they value him but maybe someone comes strong and they do it.

I don't think they trade Lauri either....I don't have too much confidence in the FO based on the plans they supposedly failed at. I guess we just have to wish for lotto luck.
 
Watching Flip, Collier, Key, Kessler, and even sensabaugh (though to a lesser extent) all develop has been a joy this season. But it just makes the Hendricks injury so much more devastating for me. He was the one I was most excited to watch develop. So sad he isn't out there having his moments like the rest of the youth.
 
Sensabaugh and Cody should be starting those games
Those are games that they should honestly sit Collier. He has raised the floor of how this team plays in a very real way and we need the floor to drop out.

I get that the objective (or the cover for tanking) is “developing talent” but those are games where we need to dispense with being cute and ****ing around.
 
Sober reminder: our (and the Wizards's, for that matter) chances of ending up with Cooper Flagg in the draft are lower than for the Wizards winning any randomly chosen game.
 
Sober reminder: our (and the Wizards's, for that matter) chances of ending up with Cooper Flagg in the draft are lower than for the Wizards winning any randomly chosen game.
We know our chances of getting Flagg are low. We all know that. We have been told many times already.
Don't rub it in
 
Last edited:
I've worried before that sometimes we don't understand lottery odds very well. Today on Locked on Jazz, Leif Thulein gave at least two statements that lead to misunderstanding:

- "... once the odds reach 4th, they drop precipitously" & "once you reach 4th, you are in a scary position"
- then he goes on to talk about how top 3 lotto positions have a 52% chance of drafting top 4. While holding that thought he says, 50% isn't a guarantee you're drafting top 3, and then proceeds to talk like the odds for drafting top 3 (he somehow slid from talking about top 4 to top 3 without noticing) with a bottom 3 finish are 52%. He then goes on to imply that the "franchise altering talent" of Flagg, Harper, and Bailey that can only be had in the top 3 are vital for the Jazz -- that it will have been a kind of waste of the year if we don't draft top 3.

Why is he wrong?:

A bottom-3 finish only gives you 40% (not 52%) of drafting top 3. It's more likely than not (no matter where we finish, that we won't get franchise altering talent, even if we agree with Leif that Flagg, Harper, and Bailey all possess it).

Odds for finishing 4th are not much lower for getting the top talent than the odds for finishing 3rd. As I've argued before the difference in odds between 4th and 1st (or 2nd or 3rd) odds only matter mathematically (if you're talking about the number one pick) once every 67 years. If you're worried about the difference in the odds of getting Ace Bailey at number 3, then this difference only matters once every 125 years. Even if you decide that getting any one of the top 4 players is what really matters, the difference in those odds between 4th and 1st come into play mathematically once only every 25 years. So describing being in the 4th position (while being fairly safe, for the time being at least, out of danger of dropping to 5th) as a disaster is either terrible hyperbole or basic misunderstanding of how the lotto odds work.
Update: To be fair to Leif, he did much better today in accurately expressing the lottery odds.
 
Back
Top