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Jackpotting Around - The Great Walker Kessler Debate

underdog said:
These negotiations often take time. Kessler’s agent is pushing the price up, as he should, to see how high he can go. Eventually, they’ll reach a deal. I say this because I'm pretty sure AA wants to sign him to a long-term contract.
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Well the news said that we basically announced no extension and no more negotiations... so unless that's a hardball tactic, then its not getting done.
 
KqWIN said:
Man I won’t forgive HH for putting the idea of Keon Ellis in my head.
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Well... every now and again I manifest stuff for the Jazz. So far its just been Shaq Harrison, Jared Butler, and kind of Tay Henny... maybe I can make this happen lol.
 
Jazz probably aren't interested in Kessler long-term because Hardy won't change his scheme and his scheme minimizes Kessler's player type by stopping players from getting to the rim in general.

But they're probably scared of trading him because they don't want to trade him and look stupid because he's successful elsewhere.

But like... You have to make a choice, you can't just choose to do nothing. Either trade Kessler or change the scheme.
 
HadAnEffectHere said:
Jazz probably aren't interested in Kessler long-term because Hardy won't change his scheme and his scheme minimizes Kessler's player type by stopping players from getting to the rim in general.

But they're probably scared of trading him because they don't want to trade him and look stupid because he's successful elsewhere.

But like... You have to make a choice, you can't just choose to do nothing. Either trade Kessler or change the scheme.
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That’s it. Once you turn down the Lakers offer you say to yourself “we are extending him”. Doing neither you will paint yourself into a corner.

Also, be decisive you cowards. Make calls. It’s okay.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Well the news said that we basically announced no extension and no more negotiations... so unless that's a hardball tactic, then its not getting done.
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Yeah, but I don't believe the negotiations are completely over. But if they are, and they had serious negotiations, they must’ve been far apart with no resolution in sight.
 
HadAnEffectHere said:
Jazz probably aren't interested in Kessler long-term because Hardy won't change his scheme and his scheme minimizes Kessler's player type by stopping players from getting to the rim in general.

But they're probably scared of trading him because they don't want to trade him and look stupid because he's successful elsewhere.

But like... You have to make a choice, you can't just choose to do nothing. Either trade Kessler or change the scheme.
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They could put him on waivers.
 
Kessler is the only quality young player the Jazz have following three years of rebuilding. Trading him for picks would be acknowledging that they simply wasted three years for nothing.
 
jazznik said:
Kessler is the only quality young player the Jazz have following three years of rebuilding. Trading him for picks would be acknowledging that they simply wasted three years for nothing.
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It acknowledges several things, but that’s not one of them.
 
FWIW, I'm really not on board with the idea that we shouldn't pay Kessler because we need to build our team around a 5 out center.

One of my non negotiables for a big is that they have to defend the paint. It's just too difficult to build a top of the league defense without a paint protecting big. The number of guys in the NBA who can defend the paint at a high level AND have to truly be guarded on the perimeter are extremely rare.

Of course, I'm sure, that the font office and Hardy would love to have a 5 out rim protector, because every team would love that. I'm just not giving up on my real life elite rim protecting young center for that dream.
 
One thing I might have missed from the pod was the fact that cap space can be used for more than just signing free agents. It feels like we saw that this off season with teams with cap space being able to make trades with teams desperate to shed salary.

Of course we should have plenty of cap space for that sort of thing even with Kessler, but it's just an example of the value of cap space for a team like us.
 
How elite of a defender is Kessler if we are still the worst defense in the league with him doing what he does? Defense is more of a cohesive team effort thing but if we are still the worst defensive team with him starting, is he really worth it with how limited he is offensively?
 
SoberasHotRod said:
One thing I might have missed from the pod was the fact that cap space can be used for more than just signing free agents. It feels like we saw that this off season with teams with cap space being able to make trades with teams desperate to shed salary.

Of course we should have plenty of cap space for that sort of thing even with Kessler, but it's just an example of the value of cap space for a team like us.
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The best thing you can do with your cap space at this point is make sure you get most of your players to sign on value contracts. I agree that protecting the paint is important, but so is lineup versatility and switchability is probably more important in a vacuum, so you gotta be careful on the money you spend on traditional 5s.

I don’t know what’s going on with the negotiations but I am god damn sick of this confusing tension between Walker and the FO. I want to say that they just should extend him or trade him, but there are some fringe scenarios where riding it into RFA could net the Jazz some stuff they couldn’t any other way.
 
Basketball Novice said:
How elite of a defender is Kessler if we are still the worst defense in the league with him doing what he does? Defense is more of a cohesive team effort thing but if we are still the worst defensive team with him starting, is he really worth it with how limited he is offensively?
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I mean, yes, this is the big question, but Hardy's scheme also minimizes the amount of defensive opportunities that Kessler gets. Hardy has guys help off the three point line to stop ball handlers from getting to the paint and if you do that, your center is not going to matter nearly as much.

But this just means that Kessler isn't a good fit with Hardy and you should move Kessler if you're committed to Hardy and he's committed to this scheme. Kessler is an elite shot blocker and rebounder and isn't good at pretty much anything else. If you're minimizing his shot blocking, he's not that helpful.
 
I think the jazz are really hoping hendricks can play the 5 and can have a 5 out offense.

Walker was good year 1, really bad year 2, and better year 3. He's unplayable when the games on the line since he cant improve at the line or anywhere else.

I do think the jazz dont know what to do with him. If the the 2 picks for walker is true from the lakers and you didnt take it... but then won't extend him, what is your goal with him? They're banking on him playing poorly to get a better deal or hoping someone else can take his spot (hendricks) or he plays well and they bite the bullet for it
 
Hendricks just isn't tall or long enough to protect the rim like a center needs to. I would be very surprised if he was anything but a pure PF.

Obviously, if he can play center, that would massively improve his future and the Jazz's.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
I don't think they want Hendricks to play center, but they probably want to see if Hendricks/Ace can protect Flip enough at the 5 for it to be defensively viable.
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I think we can play center less essentially for like 12-15 minutes a night with the guys mentioned (hopefully).
 
The Jazz's roster is semi awkward because Hendricks, Markkanen, and Filipowski are PFs and Ace will eventually be a PF, but I don't think this is a serious issue long-term as most of these guys will eventually get traded and you can probably have Ace be a really big SF next to Filipowski at PF (the other guys are a little trickier)

Filipowski at center next to a rim protector at PF may work OK for stretches, we'll see. Definitely good to experiment this year with Ace-Hendricks-Filipowski, but I doubt that's a long-term, big minutes solution at center.

I would guess they want to just eventually find a mobile and skilled center (instead of relying on Hendricks or Filipowski or keeping Kessler) in the next few years but... we'll see.
 
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HadAnEffectHere said:
The Jazz's roster is semi awkward because Hendricks, Markkanen, and Filipowski are PFs and Ace will eventually be a PF, but I don't think this is a serious issue long-term as most of these guys will eventually get traded and you can probably have Ace be a really big SF next to Filipowski at PF (the other guys are a little trickier)

Filipowski at center next to a rim protector at PF may work OK for stretches, we'll see. Definitely good to experiment this year with Ace-Hendricks-Filipowski, but I doubt that's a long-term, big minutes solution at center.

I would guess they want to just eventually find a mobile and skilled center (instead of relying on Hendricks or Filipowski or keeping Kessler) in the next few years but... we'll see.
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Having too many PF types can be an issue, but as long as they all have skill development, along with big defensive development from Ace/Hendricks, it's not the worst issue.
 
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