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1981

LogGrad98 said:
I was 11 years old, and I went to my first Jazz game, first professional game at all. It was in the Salt Palace, and it was in the early part of the season. I think we were playing the Nuggets, in November. It was a high-scoring game. I don't remember a ton other than we were in the 5th row or so, near the Jazz bench. Got good tickets from a friend of my dad. We got to talk to some of the players after the game, and I got some autographs I still have somewhere, on the program I think. Met Eaton, Green, Griffith and Dantley, a few others, got their sigs. I was in complete awe. I had started playing myself just a couple of years before that, at about 9, with a jr rec league kind of thing. No Jr Jazz at that time. I was taller than all my friends, and the next summer I would shoot up to 6'1" and end up playing varsity ball as a freshman, and get a short stint as an honorary ball-boy for the Jazz the year Malone was drafted, an honor for jr high basketball achievement and academics or some such. 10 games throwing the ball back in warm-ups and a couple of practices. It was an amazing time to grow up like that, deep in the bball culture, with time on the floor with some of the greats, like Stockton and Malone.

I had all the hope in the world. We were an up and coming team. Not long after we would make an impact by pushing the eventual champion Lakers to 7 games. The 90's was a magical, and frustrating, time as a Jazz fan. Get to the WCF one year, first round out the next. Hard-nosed defense was the name of the game, and a no-nonsense approach to the game instilled by Sloan. We thought we had what it takes. Then we get The Shot. Unbelievable moment in my Jazz fan-dom. We thought maybe we had a chance, to be the one team that could unseat the Bulls. But bad officiating combined with untimely melt-downs (remember losing by 40? ugh) conspired to keep the elusive ring just out of reach. But we still had hope. We could re-tool, rebuild, come back with a vengeance.

We drafted Williams over Paul. Controversial to say the least. Would we have been a better team with Paul? Who is to say? That team had a shine to it, but it also had a lot of holes, and we just couldn't get anywhere near form.

Losing Sloan we really lost our identity which we haven't been able to find since. Are we a defensive stalwart? An offensive juggernaut? Something in between? But no matter what that fluid identity may be, we are definitely inconsistent. And frustrating. What is the next iteration of the Jazz? What are we going to be? The bumblebees?

So here I sit, soon to be 41 years into my life as a Jazz fan. Having seen the tough road, the failures, the very pinnacle of achievement for the Jazz over the years. Laughed, cried, cheered, loved the team, hated the team, all the ups and downs of fan-dom. Yet we are still no closer than we were when Sloan opted out (RIP Jerry, we love and miss you). And the question arises, will we ever be? Are we destined to be the one team that never gets any closer to the title than we were in 97 or 98, the Cubs of the NBA? But of course the Cubs won the series twice, just had a long time in between. The big question for me, getting on in years, is will we ever win one in my lifetime. I have no answer to that obviously, and I am afraid my hope is dwindling fast. The team now seems in disarray. We are likely looking at the next rebuild coming soon. A half decade or more of mediocrity to come, followed by a high-lottery pick, god willing, and maybe we get back into contention for a few years. It is the cycle of the NBA. The stars will still conglomerate in the coasts, and the also-rans will try to cobble together a contending team from what is left and what they can acquire in the draft. And we hope our rise coincides with a lull for the juggernauts, like the Raptors and the Bucks championship seasons. In real estate, location is everything, and in the NBA, timing of the rise is crucial.

And now we have new leadership, a new owner, with a new direction. It is different, uncomfortable, foreign even. Seems to be on a whim, and not taken as seriously as we have taken the team over the years. The new billionaires new toy. Feels cheapened and disrespectful of the legacy, and it throws everything into question. Who are we? What is our new identity? Does anyone know, is there a plan even?

So where I sit now as a fan later in years, I am thinking it is just more and more likely we never get the ring during my lifetime, And I also wonder, as a fan, is it worth it? I have been a pretty passionate fan for 40 years, and frankly, in lots of ways it is exhausting. Lots of emotion goes into it, and the defeats are crushing. Often worse for the fans than the players. The players move on. In lots of ways it is just their job, and I think most of them know their odds of winning it all are slim. But for fans, we put so much on the success of our team, we put so much time and commitment into it, it becomes part of our identity, we even introduce ourselves often that way - Hi I am LogGrad and I am a Jazz fan - and for us it doesn't end, we don't move on, we stick around through the bad times and the good. Hoping against hope for the one time our timing is right and we win it all!

But I am starting to see that the light at the end of the tunnel is as elusive as a candle in the wind, and the chase is tiring and mind-numbing, and so, frankly, you have to start thinking, is it worth it?

Is it for you?
Click to expand...
Is it worth it?

@Keefe had an interesting post IMO in this respect, I think we have to consider this first and foremost as entertainment, I mean if it's getting in the way of our responsibilities than no, if it's just a diversion, than why not. I just retired this year and find myself with too much time on my hands, so rooting for this team just took a more prominent role for me. And like you yourself said, we are definitely on the cusp of something - could be good, could be bad. Still, I think that regarding a championship in Utah in my lifetime, I personally find that extremely unlikely - get into that further along.

I'm older than most all of you guys and have some fond memories of rooting for the old Utah Stars with Willie Wise, Zelmo Beaty and Ron Boone as a kid. Then I remember the first iteration of the Utah Jazz after the move from New Orleans. Tom Nisalke was the first coach I remember and I just hated the guy for never, ever playing Pistol Pete Maravich. Bernard King was on that team, well until he engaged in sexual congress with a white woman. Sodomy was the official charge and he was quickly shuttled out of town (later became a really big deal for the Knicks) before he could be tarred and feathered. The Layden years followed with the losing streaks and the one liners. I enjoyed watching Adrian Dantley, "the fastest of them all" Ricky Green and listening to Hot Rod Huntley.

1981 was the title of this thread, but 1985 was when the fireworks began. Sam Battistone had been bleeding money on the Jazz since the move to Utah (NO was no better) and letters were sent out to prominent businessmen to offer a 50% ownership in the Jazz for 8 mil. Larry Miller offered 6.2 but eventually ponied up the balance in order to keep the team in SLC. (The second half of the team apparently came a lot cheaper as Battistone was by that time in debt to Miller 3 mil.) I think that it's fair to say that Miller was a very competitive person competing as a driver in Drag Racing through 1970 and as a fast pitch softball player through 1985 as well as a self-made successful entrepeneur with 43 auto dealerships, two sports franchises, restaurants, theaters, motor sports park and even a television station. But the key word is competitive, he went to most every game, had his own locker room and made frequent unscheduled visits to see the coach. In 1988 he hired a like-minded competitive coach by the name of Jerry Sloan. And even though Miller did his best to project a family friendly franchise, he completely overlooked Sloan's potty mouth as it pertained to lambasting referees and getting into players. The result; the Utah Jazz, at the time of Miller's purchase, the smallest market in the league became the second winningest team in the league under Larry H. Miller.

After the patriarch passed, Gail and her progeny were much more hands off and had a difficult time sustaining the success that her husband had established with this team. Enter Ryan Smith. Now of course the verdict is still out on Ryan, but I must say that I am just a tad concerned. I honestly thought that Snyder deserved to be fired this season after fizzling out of the first round again. Then they put Gobert, the defensive foundation of this team, on the trade block. Then the team made it known that Mitchell the resident gad fly and malcontent (never even found it within himself to thank the departing coach) was untouchable as far as trades and was the cornerstone for any and all further team development. The Rebrand Jerseys. According to recent reports, the team is dead set on hiring a relatively young currently in an assistant capacity with no head coaching experience as it's next head coach. All vexing questions in my mind!

And yet, as of this writing, the core is intact. A team that two seasons ago finished the regular season with the best record in the league. Yeah I agree that we have to do something concerning the diminutive starting guard line, but for me, that means either Conley or Mitchell. Still our problems are relatively miniscule and we have the added bonus of seeing what a different set of eyes can pull out of these guys. Whatever happens, I just hope by some colossal fluke of nature we hire another in your face potty mouth coach like Jerry Sloan! Course, like the Jazz themselves, I'm certainly not betting on it.
 
Last edited:
Release the Kraken said:
Is it worth it?

@Keefe had an interesting post IMO in this respect, I think we have to consider this first and foremost as entertainment, I mean if it's getting in the way of our responsibilities than no, if it's just a diversion, than why not. I just retired this year and find myself with too much time on my hands, so rooting for this team just took a more prominent role for me. And like you yourself said, we are definitely on the cusp of something - could be good, could be bad. Still, I think that regarding a championship in Utah in my lifetime, I personally find that extremely unlikely - get into that further along.

I'm older than most all of you guys and have some fond memories of rooting for the old Utah Stars with Willie Wise, Zelmo Beaty and Ron Boone as a kid. Then I remember the first iteration of the Utah Jazz after the move from New Orleans. Tom Nisalke was the first coach I remember and I just hated the guy for never, ever playing Pistol Pete Maravich. Bernard King was on that team, well until he engaged in sexual congress with a white woman. Sodomy was the official charge and he was quickly shuttled out of town (later became a really big deal for the Knicks) before he could be tarred and feathered. The Layden years followed with the losing streaks and the one liners. I enjoyed watching Adrian Dantley, "the fastest of them all" Ricky Green and listening to Hot Rod Huntley.

1981 was the title of this thread, but 1985 was when the fireworks began. Sam Battistone had been bleeding money on the Jazz since the move to Utah (NO was no better) and letters were sent out to prominent businessmen to offer a 50% ownership in the Jazz for 8 mil. Larry Miller offered 6.2 but eventually ponied up the balance in order to keep the team in SLC. (The second half of the team apparently came a lot cheaper as Battistone was by that time in debt to Miller 3 mil.) I think that it's fair to say that Miller was a very competitive person competing as a driver in Drag Racing through 1970 and as a fast pitch softball player through 1985 as well as a self-made successful entrepeneur with 43 auto dealerships, two sports franchises, restaurants, theaters, motor sports park and even a television station. But the key word is competitive, he went to most every game, had his own locker room and made frequent unscheduled visits to see the coach. In 1988 he hired a like-minded competitive coach by the name of Jerry Sloan. And even though Miller did his best to project a family friendly franchise, he completely overlooked Sloan's potty mouth as it pertained to lambasting referees and getting into players. The result; the Utah Jazz, at the time of Miller's purchase, the smallest market in the league became the second winningest team in the league under Larry H. Miller.

After the patriarch passed, Gail and her progeny were much more hands off and had a difficult time sustaining the success that her husband had established with this team. Enter Ryan Smith. Now of course the verdict is still out on Ryan, but I must say that I am just a tad concerned. I honestly thought that Snyder deserved to be fired this season after fizzling out of the first round again. Then they put Gobert, the defensive foundation of this team, on the trade block. Then the team made it known that Mitchell the resident gad fly and malcontent (never even found it within himself to thank the departing coach) was untouchable as far as trades and was the cornerstone for any and all further team development. The Rebrand Jerseys. According to recent reports, the team is dead set on hiring a relatively young currently in an assistant capacity with no head coaching experience as it's next head coach. All vexing questions in my mind!

And yet, as of this writing, the core is intact. A team that two seasons ago finished the regular season with the best record in the league. Yeah I agree that we have to do something concerning the diminutive starting guard line, but for me, that means either Conley or Mitchell. Still our problems are relatively miniscule and we have the added bonus of seeing what a different set of eyes can pull out of these guys. Whatever happens, I just hope by some colossal fluke of nature we hire another in your face potty mouth coach like Jerry Sloan! Course, like the Jazz themselves, I'm certainly not betting on it.
Click to expand...

The problem is this “entertainment” doesn’t entertain. We’re a boring, unlikeable team whose fate is fairly predictable. There are far too many other ways I can entertain myself rather than investing any sort of energy in what is truly an act in futility.
 
I hate to admit this, but I'm addicted to following the Jazz. It's kind of like when you first watch Breaking Bad. At first you're curious, and then before you know it, you're addicted to everything they say and do and you can't look away. The dam Jazz have me.
 
sojodave said:
I hate to admit this, but I'm addicted to following the Jazz. It's kind of like when you first watch Breaking Bad. At first you're curious, and then before you know it, you're addicted to everything they say and do and you can't look away. The dam Jazz have me.
Click to expand...
Yeah a better example is something like the Kardashains or Jersey Shore. Flashy eye-candy brings you in, then you get stuck with it, and then you realize it is vacuous empty **** that really isn't that entertaining, you are just in too deep to do anything about it.
 
LogGrad98 said:
I was 11 years old, and I went to my first Jazz game, first professional game at all. It was in the Salt Palace, and it was in the early part of the season. I think we were playing the Nuggets, in November. It was a high-scoring game. I don't remember a ton other than we were in the 5th row or so, near the Jazz bench. Got good tickets from a friend of my dad. We got to talk to some of the players after the game, and I got some autographs I still have somewhere, on the program I think. Met Eaton, Green, Griffith and Dantley, a few others, got their sigs. I was in complete awe. I had started playing myself just a couple of years before that, at about 9, with a jr rec league kind of thing. No Jr Jazz at that time. I was taller than all my friends, and the next summer I would shoot up to 6'1" and end up playing varsity ball as a freshman, and get a short stint as an honorary ball-boy for the Jazz the year Malone was drafted, an honor for jr high basketball achievement and academics or some such. 10 games throwing the ball back in warm-ups and a couple of practices. It was an amazing time to grow up like that, deep in the bball culture, with time on the floor with some of the greats, like Stockton and Malone.

I had all the hope in the world. We were an up and coming team. Not long after we would make an impact by pushing the eventual champion Lakers to 7 games. The 90's was a magical, and frustrating, time as a Jazz fan. Get to the WCF one year, first round out the next. Hard-nosed defense was the name of the game, and a no-nonsense approach to the game instilled by Sloan. We thought we had what it takes. Then we get The Shot. Unbelievable moment in my Jazz fan-dom. We thought maybe we had a chance, to be the one team that could unseat the Bulls. But bad officiating combined with untimely melt-downs (remember losing by 40? ugh) conspired to keep the elusive ring just out of reach. But we still had hope. We could re-tool, rebuild, come back with a vengeance.

We drafted Williams over Paul. Controversial to say the least. Would we have been a better team with Paul? Who is to say? That team had a shine to it, but it also had a lot of holes, and we just couldn't get anywhere near form.

Losing Sloan we really lost our identity which we haven't been able to find since. Are we a defensive stalwart? An offensive juggernaut? Something in between? But no matter what that fluid identity may be, we are definitely inconsistent. And frustrating. What is the next iteration of the Jazz? What are we going to be? The bumblebees?

So here I sit, soon to be 41 years into my life as a Jazz fan. Having seen the tough road, the failures, the very pinnacle of achievement for the Jazz over the years. Laughed, cried, cheered, loved the team, hated the team, all the ups and downs of fan-dom. Yet we are still no closer than we were when Sloan opted out (RIP Jerry, we love and miss you). And the question arises, will we ever be? Are we destined to be the one team that never gets any closer to the title than we were in 97 or 98, the Cubs of the NBA? But of course the Cubs won the series twice, just had a long time in between. The big question for me, getting on in years, is will we ever win one in my lifetime. I have no answer to that obviously, and I am afraid my hope is dwindling fast. The team now seems in disarray. We are likely looking at the next rebuild coming soon. A half decade or more of mediocrity to come, followed by a high-lottery pick, god willing, and maybe we get back into contention for a few years. It is the cycle of the NBA. The stars will still conglomerate in the coasts, and the also-rans will try to cobble together a contending team from what is left and what they can acquire in the draft. And we hope our rise coincides with a lull for the juggernauts, like the Raptors and the Bucks championship seasons. In real estate, location is everything, and in the NBA, timing of the rise is crucial.

And now we have new leadership, a new owner, with a new direction. It is different, uncomfortable, foreign even. Seems to be on a whim, and not taken as seriously as we have taken the team over the years. The new billionaires new toy. Feels cheapened and disrespectful of the legacy, and it throws everything into question. Who are we? What is our new identity? Does anyone know, is there a plan even?

So where I sit now as a fan later in years, I am thinking it is just more and more likely we never get the ring during my lifetime, And I also wonder, as a fan, is it worth it? I have been a pretty passionate fan for 40 years, and frankly, in lots of ways it is exhausting. Lots of emotion goes into it, and the defeats are crushing. Often worse for the fans than the players. The players move on. In lots of ways it is just their job, and I think most of them know their odds of winning it all are slim. But for fans, we put so much on the success of our team, we put so much time and commitment into it, it becomes part of our identity, we even introduce ourselves often that way - Hi I am LogGrad and I am a Jazz fan - and for us it doesn't end, we don't move on, we stick around through the bad times and the good. Hoping against hope for the one time our timing is right and we win it all!

But I am starting to see that the light at the end of the tunnel is as elusive as a candle in the wind, and the chase is tiring and mind-numbing, and so, frankly, you have to start thinking, is it worth it?

Is it for you?
Click to expand...


Dude I wasn't even born, **** you're old...
 
Keefe said:
Dude did a lot of coke.
Click to expand...

This dude did an awful lot of coke in the 70s, reportedly 12 million in 1970s money. What a legend.

01donhair_465_466_int.jpg
 
Keefe said:
The problem is this “entertainment” doesn’t entertain. We’re a boring, unlikeable team whose fate is fairly predictable. There are far too many other ways I can entertain myself rather than investing any sort of energy in what is truly an act in futility.
Click to expand...
I’m not sure how to even respond to the idea of it being entertainment. I think if I had my first experience watching this as an adult with the idea that it’s entertainment, maybe my perspective would be different. It’s like when I go back and watch movies or shoes I really liked as a kid and often times wonder why I liked them. Or if they came out now without me being biased by liking it as a kid, would I like it? Like the Naked Gun movies or Spaceballs… I’m guessing if I saw them for the first time now, I wouldn’t like them. Maybe that’s how it would be with the Jazz. It’s just something I’ve always done and at no point has this been a choice.
 
infection said:
I’m not sure how to even respond to the idea of it being entertainment. I think if I had my first experience watching this as an adult with the idea that it’s entertainment, maybe my perspective would be different. It’s like when I go back and watch movies or shoes I really liked as a kid and often times wonder why I liked them. Or if they came out now without me being biased by liking it as a kid, would I like it? Like the Naked Gun movies or Spaceballs… I’m guessing if I saw them for the first time now, I wouldn’t like them. Maybe that’s how it would be with the Jazz. It’s just something I’ve always done and at no point has this been a choice.
Click to expand...
I completely understand this line of thinking. It's exactly the reason I could never watch wrestling again after I got into high school. As a kid I bought into the narrative completely, rooted for the good guys, booed the bad guys. I was heavily invested. I remember crying when one guy I had really come to root for got beat, can't even remember who now. Then I found out it's all an act. It's all fake. I felt betrayed. And to this day I can only look on the sport with disdain.
 
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