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2013 free agency a let down?

Bodhi

Bodhi

Well-Known Member
Contributor
As I keep hearing about teams clearing space to try and get Dwight (Atlanta, Houston) it's clear one of them, plus Orlando, will also have mega cap space next off season as well as us. Also, after a VERY quick glance, it seems there are others as well, like Cleveland, that could potentially sign a max guy or two.Then when you really look at who will be a free agent, and what kind (i.e. restricted/unrestricted), there's potential for a pretty serious Jazz fan let down.............no?

The majors will be: Dwight (un), Bynum (un), Harden (R), Paul (un), Curry (R). IMO, we have very little chance at any of them. In the longest shot of all, but better chance than getting one, you could possibly recruit them to come together (accept there is no star here to "recruit").

So where does that leave us? Who do we give this money to? I know we could take back players from teams looking to shed before getting killed by LT, but who's even realistic there?

Raise of hands, who now thinks the new plan should be "do whatever is needed to land Shabazz in the draft"?





Discuss.
 
Bodhi said:
As I keep hearing about teams clearing space to try and get Dwight (Atlanta, Houston) it's clear one of them, plus Orlando, will also have mega cap space next off season as well as us. Also, after a VERY quick glance, it seems there are others as well, like Cleveland, that could potentially sign a max guy or two.Then when you really look at who will be a free agent, and what kind (i.e. restricted/unrestricted), there's potential for a pretty serious Jazz fan let down.............no?

The majors will be: Dwight (un), Bynum (un), Harden (R), Paul (un), Curry (R). IMO, we have very little chance at any of them. In the longest shot of all, but better chance than getting one, you could possibly recruit them to come together (accept there is no star here to "recruit").

So where does that leave us? Who do we give this money to? I know we could take back players from teams looking to shed before getting killed by LT, but who's even realistic there?

Raise of hands, who now thinks the new plan should be "do whatever is needed to land Shabazz in the draft"?





Discuss.
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Oh Lord .. this may go a thousand pages before the end of next season.
 
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I don't believe there is a correct answer to your queries.
 
Cap space can be used for more than bringing in big name free agents, it can be used to help stupid GM's get under the huge luxury tax by taking players (along with draft picks) off of their hands. Oh, by the way, these teams who are dumping contracts are probably going to suck the next season, hence we get lottery picks from them. This is the second time the Jazz have done this, the first time was the 42ish win season when we had literally garbage on the team and were just a few games away from the playoffs. That garbage was from taking players from other teams for picks and then waiving them or getting what value we could out of them. Then later when we had tons of cap space we landed Boozer and with our own good pick we got to the western conference finals.
 
cctrackstar said:
Cap space can be used for more than bringing in big name free agents, it can be used to help stupid GM's get under the huge luxury tax by taking players (along with draft picks) off of their hands.
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So long story short, you didn't read my whole post.
 
You didn't mention the picks that would come with the players. Those picks could be used on shabazz whoever that is. And teams will definately be dropping salary, so if Houston is willing to waive Lous Scola, who knows what will be available.
 
cctrackstar said:
You didn't mention the picks that would come with the players. Those picks could be used on shabazz whoever that is. And teams will definately be dropping salary, so if Houston is willing to waive Lous Scola, who knows what will be available.
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Lou's what?
 
Bodhi said:
That's the greatest complement anyone has ever given me.
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To be serious, '13 will be very exciting, just not for Utah. I think extending Sap is possibly the most important thing. Obviously CP isn't going to sign with the Jazz, and F that flopper anyways. Al will almost certainly be gone and by that time this board will be talking about how awesome Burks was over this season.

Dwight might still go to Brooklyn. All those guys have to do is trade Lopez to somebody with a lot of space for a pick and a TE, and voila. That would turn some heads especially if Howard walks away from the Lakers or Rockets. Now that Griffin is hurt and Vinny is still coach it wouldn't surprise me at all to see Chrissy walk away from that tumor of a franchise.

Don't see the Jazz doing anything spectacular though aside from a 2nd round series.
 
I think it was pretty well established in an earlier thread that KOC's reputation and the strength of this rebuild will be determined next summer. All of his moves suggest that he's putting eggs in that basket. I'm worried, too. The one thing to be optimistic about is the strength of our core; that should have some draw to some players amped to win.
 
Brown Notes said:
To be serious, '13 will be very exciting, just not for Utah. I think extending Sap is possibly the most important thing. Obviously CP isn't going to sign with the Jazz, and F that flopper anyways. Al will almost certainly be gone and by that time this board will be talking about how awesome Burks was over this season.

Dwight might still go to Brooklyn. All those guys have to do is trade Lopez to somebody with a lot of space for a pick and a TE, and voila. That would turn some heads especially if Howard walks away from the Lakers or Rockets. Now that Griffin is hurt and Vinny is still coach it wouldn't surprise me at all to see Chrissy walk away from that tumor of a franchise.

Don't see the Jazz doing anything spectacular though aside from a 2nd round series.
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Great post. This is the dialogue I was looking for.
 
cctrackstar said:
You didn't mention the picks that would come with the players. Those picks could be used on shabazz whoever that is. And teams will definately be dropping salary, so if Houston is willing to waive Lous Scola, who knows what will be available.
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Valid points. One thing is certain, these next few offseasons are going to be very entertaining, not only for the Jazz and our fans but the rest of the league as well. Trade deadline could be fun as well.
 
Bodhi said:
As I keep hearing about teams clearing space to try and get Dwight (Atlanta, Houston) it's clear one of them, plus Orlando, will also have mega cap space next off season as well as us. Also, after a VERY quick glance, it seems there are others as well, like Cleveland, that could potentially sign a max guy or two.Then when you really look at who will be a free agent, and what kind (i.e. restricted/unrestricted), there's potential for a pretty serious Jazz fan let down.............no?

The majors will be: Dwight (un), Bynum (un), Harden (R), Paul (un), Curry (R). IMO, we have very little chance at any of them. In the longest shot of all, but better chance than getting one, you could possibly recruit them to come together (accept there is no star here to "recruit").

So where does that leave us? Who do we give this money to? I know we could take back players from teams looking to shed before getting killed by LT, but who's even realistic there?

Raise of hands, who now thinks the new plan should be "do whatever is needed to land Shabazz in the draft"?





Discuss.
Click to expand...

As much as I understand what you are saying this off season isn't over yet nor the trade deadline and then the draft. All 3 of those things could quickly change the out look of one or 2 of those gems under the cap.

Little premature to say the jazz don't have a chance. A few examples that could effect the jazz

- Jefferson is traded to a team with cap space for a tpe and draft pick. That tpe could be a major value come trade deadline.

- jazz bring in an under the radar free agent this summer on say a 3 year deal and the free agent thrives in our system.

- jazz get involved in a 3 way for a big trade and add another big asset to the team.

- jazz could have a major injury, I hope not, suck and win the lottery. Drafting another amazing asset.

These could also happen to teams with space. Way to early to be upset by what COULD happen next summer.
 
MDAV28 said:
Go after Curry! GS is screwing themselves cap wise (like always)
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In a perfect world, Mark Jackson turns that team into a Jr High level cliquey cesspool (like JF), Bogut finds a brand new chronic injury, and Steph gets really pissed (thus devaluing himself). This actually sounds almost realistic now that I've typed it.
 
Xthren said:
As much as I understand what you are saying this off season isn't over yet nor the trade deadline and then the draft. All 3 of those things could quickly change the out look of one or 2 of those gems under the cap.

Little premature to say the jazz don't have a chance. A few examples that could effect the jazz

- Jefferson is traded to a team with cap space for a tpe and draft pick. That tpe could be a major value come trade deadline.

- jazz bring in an under the radar free agent this summer on say a 3 year deal and the free agent thrives in our system.

- jazz get involved in a 3 way for a big trade and add another big asset to the team.

- jazz could have a major injury, I hope not, suck and win the lottery. Drafting another amazing asset.

These could also happen to teams with space. Way to early to be upset by what COULD happen next summer.
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Again, valid points but I'm more speaking to the want/need of the organization to add a true star to this roster. Basically a max type guy. Whether that's truly the goal or not we've all hoped that's what would come of 2013. I still can't see where any of your above points, although good, bring that to Utah. Except maybe in taking on a guy another team wants to dump to avoid paying a huge LT payment, but I touched on that in the opening post.

Even that said, if that were the case, you'd have to believe we were getting an overpaid guy who didn't deserve his salary or why else would the team be dumping him?

Basically my point, and line of thinking, are now more along the lines adding value and depth at all positions moreso than an unrealistic splash in free agency, i.e. adding a max guy (or two). I agree Curry is a possibility though.

Identifying a DWill type (not position necessarily, just the circumstance we found ourselves in when we got him) in the draft and using pieces to nab him, then building the core with that guy and "the four" we have, THEN use the space we have to added solid guys at every position, two deep, might be our recipe. (is that a run on sentence?)
 
Also, I think a lot of people overlook the fact that KOC isn't going to want to paint himself into a corner in regards to Hayward and especially Favors. He's probably going to try and avoid putting himself in a situation where someone(looking at you, Portland) might think they may be able to steal one away with an aggressive contract. I'm guessing he'll be leaving himself enough room so that anyone with such ideas will have little doubt about Utah matching.
 
freakazoid said:
Also, I think a lot of people overlook the fact that KOC isn't going to want to paint himself into a corner in regards to Hayward and especially Favors. He's probably going to try and avoid putting himself in a situation where someone(looking at you, Portland) might think they may be able to steal one away with an aggressive contract. I'm guessing he'll be leaving himself some enough room so that anyone with such ideas will have little doubt about Utah matching.
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God damnit, yes. Great point. That's why this **** is so much fun, so many variables. KOCBegone obviously sees all the angles, but for the rest of us......
 
Bodhi said:
The majors will be: Dwight (un), Bynum (un), Harden (R), Paul (un), Curry (R). IMO, we have very little chance at any of them. In the longest shot of all, but better chance than getting one, you could possibly recruit them to come together (accept there is no star here to "recruit").

So where does that leave us? Who do we give this money to? I know we could take back players from teams looking to shed before getting killed by LT, but who's even realistic there?
Click to expand...
I've mentioned this before, but the benefit of cap space goes far beyond signing"max free agents." If you can draft a Rajon Rondo, Gordan Hayward, or Serge Ibaka simply by having excessive cap room - I think it's worth it as opposed to overpaying for mid-level guys who may improve your roster on paper but won't get you over the hump and ultimately tie your hands longterm.

Also keep in mind salaries do not have to match in trades if both teams are under the cap - more flexibility that caproom provides in improving your roster.

Out of the above players you mentioned - a majority would not have tabbed Andrew Bynum and James Harden as max-players after only their 1st (or even 2nd) season in the league. It's quite possible Utah already has a future max-player on their roster right now.

Presently, there really aren't more than 12-14 players in the entire league I would give a max-contract to. As smart of a decision by KOC to trade Deron was - Deron is a bonafide top-14 player in the league. Those guys don't grow on trees, and while you can't underestimate the difficulty it is in acquiring that type of talent, at the same time the worst thing you can do is sign someone to a max-contract simply because you have that ability (Rudy Gay, Joe Johnson, Rashard Lewis).
 
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