2023 NBA Draft Megathread

[HermanG]

Locked in Draft had a grass roots basketball guy on and he made a lot of great points about OTE.

I think people are way too caught up on the competition/games being played and are ignoring how much OTE may potentially be better as a NBA development tool with how much practice time, the facilities, the strength/conditioning, the practice quality, etc.

People just see a bunch of HS aged kids playing with a shot clock and NBA spacing for the first time and get too caught up in how raw it all is.

I get that and I think its a good concept. But before they actually produce a star, I wouldn't be willing to invest a star level pick on any of the guys. Competition also jumps up way more once they come to the big league... so at the very least you need to be a lot more patient with those guys.

 

[HermanG]

Yeah OTE is just rough. Its hard to even wartch the games. It seems like an And1 mixtape setup and some of the worst basketball ive seen.

I just see freak athletes from the Thompson twins though and am still high on both.

But are they freak athletes because they look like that in the context? Is there tape where they play against somewhat proven talent? When making eye ball tests and assessments, our brains are always in comparison mode. Thats my worry. That our brains are fooling us because those guys pop out from the context so much because the context sucks.

I would love if someone did a tape that showed their best plays side by side with proven NBA players making the exact same plays in real time speed. If such comparison existed, I would love to see it. Then you can assess how quick their step is, or how fast they are with some known comparison points.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I get that and I think its a good concept. But before they actually produce a star, I wouldn't be willing to invest a star level pick on any of the guys. Competition also jumps up way more once they come to the big league... so at the very least you need to be a lot more patient with those guys.

So if you put Paolo Banchero there instead of at Duke you think he loses something in his development?

Is college competition really that good or do the rules just make it harder? All of the top college teams face several teams that will never have anyone sniff the NBA or high level European ball. Even a lot of the high major teams don't have any of those guys.

The only huge benefit I give to college is that it's currently where most of the eventual NBA pros goe so its the easiest league for us to have a grasp on in terms of how stuff "translates", but it obviously isn't good for that or drafting would be much easier. I'm not sure college does anything to actually prepare players for the NBA other than general maturing and the level of external pressure that comes from fans/media. Obviously no one really cares if Scoot/Amen win individual games the same way Duke fans care about beating North Carolina or winning the tournament.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

But are they freak athletes because they look like that in the context? Is there tape where they play against somewhat proven talent? When making eye ball tests and assessments, our brains are always in comparison mode. Thats my worry. That our brains are fooling us because those guys pop out from the context so much because the context sucks.

I would love if someone did a tape that showed their best plays side by side with proven NBA players making the exact same plays in real time speed. If such comparison existed, I would love to see it. Then you can assess how quick their step is, or how fast they are with some known comparison points.

Lmfao

 

[Park Bites]

So because he has had some minor knee issues you are willing to make a blanket statement like this when you had no access to medical data?

Seems stupid

I will never have access to medical info so I will wrap myself in my blankets and be warm and cozy all day long. Someone needs a Valentines

 

[seattlejazzfan]

Thanks for the recap.

Serious question for everybody, is it even worth it to take a player who doesn't have a 3 point shot in today's NBA? At least, a wing or guard. Even top-notch D doesn't keep a guy on the court if he can't make shots, unless he is a freak of nature, or a rim-protecting big. I would be very wary to take someone who isn't at least decent from 3, say 33% or so, with good form.

kawhi leonard. myers leonard. go look at their college three point shooting. then look at their percentages from three in the nba. bottom line is shooting is one of the main skills that guys can take a huge leap on as they get older. it's risky - they don't always figure it out, but if they do a lot of other things well like kawhi who was a really good athlete, had length, could defend and rebound, it's not a bad idea to pull the trigger and hope for the best in terms of shooting improvement.

 

[Bodhi]

kawhi leonard. myers leonard. go look at their college three point shooting. then look at their percentages from three in the nba. bottom line is shooting is one of the main skills that guys can take a huge leap on as they get older. it's risky - they don't always figure it out, but if they do a lot of other things well like kawhi who was a really good athlete, had length, could defend and rebound, it's not a bad idea to pull the trigger and hope for the best in terms of shooting improvement.

Great example.

 

[HermanG]

So if you put Paolo Banchero there instead of at Duke you think he loses something in his development?

Is college competition really that good or do the rules just make it harder? All of the top college teams face several teams that will never have anyone sniff the NBA or high level European ball. Even a lot of the high major teams don't have any of those guys.

The only huge benefit I give to college is that it's currently where most of the eventual NBA pros goe so its the easiest league for us to have a grasp on in terms of how stuff "translates", but it obviously isn't good for that or drafting would be much easier. I'm not sure college does anything to actually prepare players for the NBA other than general maturing and the level of external pressure that comes from fans/media. Obviously no one really cares if Scoot/Amen win individual games the same way Duke fans care about beating North Carolina or winning the tournament.

I dont know if Paolo loses something. Thats the point. OTE is a huge unknown, and thus using a top 5 pick to take a guy from that enviroment seems risky af.

What you said at the start of that last chapter encapsulates what I mean. We know what comes from college, even though its a hit and miss business drafting those guys as well. But we have no freaking clue what OTE produces and if they will ever produce a star caliber guy. Shooting % is the only good measuring stick if the basket is at the same height, but on the other end of the spectrum evaluating how good of a defender someone will be depends almost entirely on who we see him defending. And based on what I've seen and heard, the shooting% is bad and everything else looks great.

 

[sip]

Locked in Draft had a grass roots basketball guy on and he made a lot of great points about OTE.

I think people are way too caught up on the competition/games being played and are ignoring how much OTE may potentially be better as a NBA development tool with how much practice time, the facilities, the strength/conditioning, the practice quality, etc.

People just see a bunch of HS aged kids playing with a shot clock and NBA spacing for the first time and get too caught up in how raw it all is.

His points aren't great at all. The quality of basketball is trash and the facilities, strength and conditioning and level of coaching is mediocre compared to most of these higher end college programs.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

His points aren't great at all. The quality of basketball is trash and the facilities, strength and conditioning and level of coaching is mediocre compared to most of these higher end college programs.

Based on?

Plus there's all the practice restrictions that come with college programs on court time. Not to mention the priorities of a college program are winning, not youth to pro development.

And again, is the competition really that much worse, or are the rules just limiting how these players play? How much different would we view college basketball if the court was NBA spaced, 24 second shot clock, and bigs couldn't camp in the key?

 

[sip]

So if you put Paolo Banchero there instead of at Duke you think he loses something in his development?

Is college competition really that good or do the rules just make it harder? All of the top college teams face several teams that will never have anyone sniff the NBA or high level European ball. Even a lot of the high major teams don't have any of those guys.

The only huge benefit I give to college is that it's currently where most of the eventual NBA pros goe so its the easiest league for us to have a grasp on in terms of how stuff "translates", but it obviously isn't good for that or drafting would be much easier. I'm not sure college does anything to actually prepare players for the NBA other than general maturing and the level of external pressure that comes from fans/media. Obviously no one really cares if Scoot/Amen win individual games the same way Duke fans care about beating North Carolina or winning the tournament.

I think you are missing the point when some of us are talking about the Thompson twins and OTE. Put Paulo in that league last year and I'm confident he looks like easily the most dominant player in the league which is what you would expect against mediocre competition. The fact that the Thompson twins don't look particularly dominant is my primary concern with them. I still like them as prospects because they have the measurables and both are at least solid ball handlers and passers but the lack of shooting is still a major concern for me.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I think you are missing the point when some of us are talking about the Thompson twins and OTE. Put Paulo in that league last year and I'm confident he looks like easily the most dominant player in the league which is what you would expect against mediocre competition. The fact that the Thompson twins don't look particularly dominant is my primary concern with them. I still like them as prospects because they have the measurables and both are at least solid ball handlers and passers but the lack of shooting is still a major concern for me.

So they aren't dominant, but their team is 14-1...

Amen and Ausar have by far the leading +/- of any player. Ausar is +297 and Ausar is +285. Next highest player is 172.