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BMore Riots?

So here in this thread we have people justifying the violent riots because the cops did a bad thing, and saying the riots are happening because people don't have enough money.

If money is the only thing keeping people from killing and looting, then we have a major problem. A people problem.
A societal problem. That people think doing stuff like this will change anything is horrifically stupid. Lashing out at innocent people does not solve anything. Lashing out at the person who wronged you also rarely solves anything.

Perhaps people should be taking more personal responsibility. Yes, we have a problem with our police. They do not have enough disciplinary action coming back at them. They are being too violent, too militaristic. That does not mean that people should be having riots!!

Both groups are in the wrong. How anybody could defend either right now is beyond me, but play on and keep on blaming others for what's going on instead of the individuals that are pulling off all of this ********.
 
LogGrad98 said:
Yeah not sure how many jazzfanz on here are from Maryland so I bet a few didn't get that reference.

And national talk or not it helps to have links or at least a little tiny bit of content/context from the OP.



Anywho...




So what does it say about our underlying pressures or desires or stresses when anything like this can set off hundreds of otherwise rational people and get them to commit atrocities as if they suddenly have no sense of right or wrong? I mean I remember the Rodney King riots and a lot of the people they showed were not the stereotypical angry young (pick a race) male. Why is there such violence and sociopathy bubbling just beneath the surface in so many people, just waiting for the slightest excuse to hurt others when they think they won't be caught or whatever? I get the whole crowd mentality thing, but I think it says something either to our nature or our society that it always goes this way. "Hey I'm pissed cuz of this guy I didn't know, so now other people are pissed to, so it's alright for me to destroy this little chinese restaurant and wipe out this guy's means to take care of his family (or burn a community center) in order to show how pissed off I am!! It is justifiable outrage man!!"
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Yeah man! Like I mean .... ****... Current Events! Rioting! A town with "More" at the end of it is what is under fire. You're just old.
 
Howard said:
So here in this thread we have people justifying the violent riots because the cops did a bad thing, and saying the riots are happening because people don't have enough money.

If money is the only thing keeping people from killing and looting, then we have a major problem. A people problem.
A societal problem. That people think doing stuff like this will change anything is horrifically stupid. Lashing out at innocent people does not solve anything. Lashing out at the person who wronged you also rarely solves anything.

Perhaps people should be taking more personal responsibility. Yes, we have a problem with our police. They do not have enough disciplinary action coming back at them. They are being too violent, too militaristic. That does not mean that people should be having riots!!

Both groups are in the wrong. How anybody could defend either right now is beyond me, but play on and keep on blaming others for what's going on instead of the individuals that are pulling off all of this ********.
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You're really downplaying the law enforcement problem in America. This isn't just about individual violence and a lack of accountability, it's about the ~7 million Americans under the supervision of the US adult correctional system. It's about marginal groups, who simply don't have the numbers or economic resources to affect policy change, being preyed upon by the police. It's about the failed War on Drugs - Despite very similar White and Black rates of marijuana use, Blacks are arrested at almost 6 times the rate of Whites for marijuana possession in Baltimore. These people simply don't have any "legitimate" recourse. This has been going on for 40 years, and the only time anyone notices that there's a problem is when riots break out.
 
Stoked said:
By raising awareness, marches, speeches, lobbying congress, bringing in more people from other races to their cause, education...

What they are doing shouldn't even be an option. It's a bandaid for a gunshot wound.

It won't, and never will, fix the problem. It only creates more.
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So you don't support the French and American Revolutions?
 
GVC said:
You're really downplaying the law enforcement problem in America. This isn't just about individual violence and a lack of accountability, it's about the ~7 million Americans under the supervision of the US adult correctional system. It's about marginal groups, who simply don't have the numbers or economic resources to affect policy change, being preyed upon by the police. It's about the failed War on Drugs - Despite very similar White and Black rates of marijuana use, Blacks are arrested at almost 6 times the rate of Whites for marijuana possession in Baltimore. These people simply don't have any "legitimate" recourse. This has been going on for 40 years, and the only time anyone notices that there's a problem is when riots break out.
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it isn't a race issue. it is about financial resources.

it is true the judicial system in America discriminate, but not based on color of skin. based on social cultural and economic differences.

talking about the system as a whole. not just individual cops
 
Stoked said:
It wasn't ignored. It ignited a huge public debate about the issue. Then the protests died off. They should have pressed that advantage without laying blame everywhere. Bring in others.

Imagine. 200k all black march in a major city. Now imagine that March with 50,000 Latinos, 50,000 whites, 10,000 Arabs and 10,000 Asians. That increases its impact 100 fold. Have college speeches with speakers from most to all races. Start up a lobby group with an emphasis on racial inclusion that presses politicians on law enforcement, punishment and changes to law.

Press local an national politicians for police training and changes of laws.

All they have done is turn more potential allies (like myself) against them.
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You can be such an extreme optimist sometimes. How often do we hear about the "1%" anymore? I swear, it's almost gone...

There are definitely times and places where Freedom should have no inherent respect for Law.
 
DutchJazzer said:
the fact that rich black men do not seem to get the same treatment, as black poor men.
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That doesn't mean race isn't a factor. I just don't understand why certain people are so quick to dismiss the possibility that race plays a role.
 
GVC said:
You're really downplaying the law enforcement problem in America. This isn't just about individual violence and a lack of accountability, it's about the ~7 million Americans under the supervision of the US adult correctional system. It's about marginal groups, who simply don't have the numbers or economic resources to affect policy change, being preyed upon by the police. It's about the failed War on Drugs - Despite very similar White and Black rates of marijuana use, Blacks are arrested at almost 6 times the rate of Whites for marijuana possession in Baltimore. These people simply don't have any "legitimate" recourse. This has been going on for 40 years, and the only time anyone notices that there's a problem is when riots break out.
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Yeah race is the only reason possible that blacks are arrested for marijuana more than whites. It couldn't be the other crimes they are also committing or that they're smoking it on street corners or in alleyways.
 
GVC said:
That doesn't mean race isn't a factor. I just don't understand why certain people are so quick to dismiss the possibility that race plays a role.
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take a recent example of jon jones. hit and run, run back for money, and run away again.
no possession charges are filed. on him. 2500 dollar bail no travel restrictions.
would you seriously tell me same situation but a black man with no money gets the same treatment.

this is only 1 recent example. but yeah the judicial system discriminates based on the contents of your wallet/bankaccount
 
Dumb Bloke said:
Yeah race is the only reason possible that blacks are arrested for marijuana more than whites. It couldn't be the other crimes they are also committing or that they're smoking it on street corners or in alleyways.
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No one said it was the only reason. What other crimes are you referring to? The US Index crime rate (violent and property crime) has decreased markedly over the last 25 years. Incarceration rates have just started to decline over the last couple years (I'm not sure about total corrections rates, as there should be a slight lag here). Effectively, the police force has made up for the decrease in index crimes by arresting more drug and other non-violent offenders. There are 700,000+ marijuana-related arrests per year for example, and the vast majority are for simple possession (with no other charges). This type of policing does far more damage than good in the affected communities. The only people who really benefit are those who work in law enforcement (more jobs, more overtime, more money). It's disgraceful.
 
DutchJazzer said:
take a recent example of jon jones. hit and run, run back for money, and run away again.
no possession charges are filed. on him. 2500 dollar bail no travel restrictions.
would you seriously tell me same situation but a black man with no money gets the same treatment.

this is only 1 recent example. but yeah the judicial system discriminates based on the contents of your wallet/bankaccount
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Once again, this doesn't mean race isn't a factor. Perhaps you could address the relative treatment of poor whites and poor blacks. And no, a single anecdote is not enough.
 
At some point, someone has to stop pointing fingers and make a difference.

For example, Mormons were slaughtered, discriminated against, and had extermination orders placed on their heads. They were run from town to town, until they were driven out of the country and into Mexico.

At every stop they worked hard, they built schools, they looked out for each other, they came together as a community and rose above the hate.

They are a great example of how to "rise above." These communities need to realize that no one cares about them. None of us are there trying to make a difference. None one is going to help them. They need to band together and make it better themselves. Bring in better teachers. Teach your kids at home about safe sex. Give their kids a chance to get an education and better themselves. Etc.

It's not easy. They will have to fight harder than they've ever fought before. They will have to fight bad cops, bad neighbors, drug dealers, gangs, stereotypes, etc. But unless they fight, nothing will change.

In two weeks this will all be forgotten and we will be debating some other issue. If these neighborhoods want to fix this problem, it will start with them.
 
green said:
At some point, someone has to stop pointing fingers and make a difference.

For example, Mormons were slaughtered, discriminated against, and had extermination orders placed on their heads. They were run from town to town, until they were driven out of the country and into Mexico.

At every stop they worked hard, they built schools, they looked out for each other, they came together as a community and rose above the hate.

They are a great example of how to "rise above." These communities need to realize that no one cares about them. None of us are there trying to make a difference. None one is going to help them. They need to band together and make it better themselves. Bring in better teachers. Teach your kids at home about safe sex. Give their kids a chance to get an education and better themselves. Etc.

It's not easy. They will have to fight harder than they've ever fought before. They will have to fight bad cops, bad neighbors, drug dealers, gangs, stereotypes, etc. But unless they fight, nothing will change.

In two weeks this will all be forgotten and we will be debating some other issue. If these neighborhoods want to fix this problem, it will start with them.
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you sir needs bazzillions of rep.


1000% agree
 
The Thriller said:
The complete and utter failure of trickle down economics

I think these riots seen in Baltimore and Ferguson are much more about the pathetic situation many poor black communities have than anything else. Decades of frustration for lack of proper housing, employment, and education opportunities are spilling over. The police are an easy target. But in reality, I think the real anger stems from a government that has mostly turned a blind eye to their situation.

While the rich whites of this country have become even more rich and while we have pissed away trillions in wars, what have we done for the black community? Could you imagine how much better things would be if instead of throwing $2 trillion away in Iraq we had invested $2 trillion into helping poor minorities get out of their slums and get a decent education?

My question is, when will whites finally join in? They too are seeing fewer educational opportunities. Many of their jobs are disappearing. Just how much longer can so many be kicked around? Wealth inequality and expensive higher education are quickly becoming huge issues for 2016 imo
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Nah man... it's not trickle down economics. It's all those vets that came back and became police officers.
 
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