yeah but perhaps it's better to be a moron than just sound like one all the time
don't take that personally babe
:wink:
Brexit
- Thread starter Gameface
- Start date
yeah but perhaps it's better to be a moron than just sound like one all the time
don't take that personally babe
:wink:
Jonah
Well-Known Member
Interesting to see how this plays out in the coming months and years; it will take years for the UK to renegotiate new trade agreements and immigration and travel policies. Meanwhile, one unintended consequence of Great Britain leaving the European Union could be end of the United Kingdom itself. England and Wales narrowly voted to leave the EU, whereas Scotland and Northern Ireland voted to stay, both by overwhelming, near 60 to 40 margins. Now Scotland will most likely hold another referendum on independence, so it's entirely possible that Scotland leaves the United Kingdom before what’s left of Britain leaves the EU.
when I wrote that I knew I was leaving open the interpretation that I speak knowledgeably about the uselessness of being an idiot, strictly first-hand observation.
Dal might not have read it that way.
When I pompously attack anyone on any issue, there is an element of the comment that is directed at myself. Still I persist, somehow, being everything I loathe.
The referendum was non-binding.
No doubt, after all the posturing and pretensions, the "real government" will remain the same.
I don't know, Cameron's already announced his resignation. I think with the way the British system of government works, changes take effect more quickly and in a more pronounced fashion than the U.S.
Joe Bagadonuts
Well-Known Member
I can understand why the evidence would be upsetting to a fan of socialism so your attempted insult doesn't bother me. Go on with your sophisticated analysis of why your utopian society should theoretically be so much better. I'll stick to the basics of what actually happens when far-reaching income equalization programs are implemented.
It's not my decision how the UK decides to proceed, but I can understand why a British citizen might feel they would be better off as an independent nation. It seems to me that they got plenty of warning about the short term problems this action would cause, and they decided to rip that band-aid off anyway. They must really believe that it's something that needs to be done.
Joe Bagadonuts
Well-Known Member
He had promised to resign if the vote went this way so his action is not unexpected in the least. He staked his political future to it. He really had no alternative.
Jonah
Well-Known Member
"The British people have made a choice, that not only needs to be respected but those on the losing side of the argument - myself included - should help to make it work.”
--Prime Minister, David Cameron, upon learning the results of the vote.
Further, it’s binding enough that Cameron has already resigned and a new government will be formed in October to negotiate the terms of leaving the EU. In the coming weeks the Scottish National Party is expected to call for a new referendum on independence. So there is, at the very least, some doubt as to what remains the same.
D
Deleted member 848
Guest
You're talking like a simpleton. It isn't an attempted insult, it's factual. Have I ever even typed out the word utopia on Jazzfanz? Socialism is a spectrum, you don't need a PhD to figure this out. Why are you not understanding this?
And why do you figure this "sovereignty" is something that needs to be done? What are the benefits?
You also ignored my point on Putin, Mr Amurikah must remain strong in the eyes of her Enemies
jimmy eat jazz
Well-Known Member
Babe, with due respect, coherence begets understanding.
I believe Dalamon was referring to the anti-immigration sentiment (to a great extent, but not solely, fueled by bigotry), which appears to have been a major motivating factor for the 'leave' vote, and the UK Independent Party, which championed the leave cause, is increasingly become the home of the anti-immigrationists. (Anti-immigration is a more politically palatable moniker than racist or bigot.)
This vote worries me because I see it as the manifestation of a growing nationalist, isolationist, xenophobic, populist trend that is sweeping across Europe. We are seeing it here in the US also with the rise of the carnival barker bigoted buffoon. The post WWII consensus (cooperation and integration, which was a strategy to tie closer together countries with long histories of conflict with each other) appears to be breaking down, and I find that very worrisome. With the economic and political ties that have for decades now successfully bound these countries together fraying, expect to see a strengthened and increasingly powerful nationalist, isolationist, xenophobic, populist trend. Traditional and new grievances will reemerge or emerge. Societal conflicts, both within and across borders, will grow, and the political and economic stability the West has known (relatively speaking) since WWII will be imperiled. (Note, I'm not saying the above will inevitably happen, but I see it, or some version of it, as a possibility that is made more likely by this outcome and the responses--e.g., more countries leaving the EU--it is likely to trigger.)
So, while I think the Brexit itself as a bad thing for the UK and for the rest of the world, I see what it portends to be even more troublesome.
D
Deleted member 365
Guest
Trumpism wins in the UK!
Polls show that the older and whiter voters wanted to leave. While those younger and more diverse wanted to stay.
This is going to be disastrous economically for the British. Especially for the next few years. But they made this bed.
Polls show that the older and whiter voters wanted to leave. While those younger and more diverse wanted to stay.
This is going to be disastrous economically for the British. Especially for the next few years. But they made this bed.
jimmy eat jazz
Well-Known Member
I agree with your last statement. I would only add that, and I'm generalizing pretty broadly here, most of these people also lack an understanding of how the world economic/political systems work, and thus their cost/benefit calculation is a grossly misinformed one. A similar example here in the US were all the Tea Baggers who thought it was not such a bad thing for the US to default of its debts. Their opinions were honestly held but they lacked any understanding of how the international capital markets work and the role that the US and the US dollar play in the world economy (and how that fact that the rest of the world wants to hold dollar denominated assets allows the US in the first place to incur such large debts--once they no longer want to hold dollar denominated assets . . . watch out!). While I understand the common person's anger toward the elites (and the elites richly deserve it, they are out of touch, corrupt and often incompetent), I am very, very hesitant about turning decisions that affect such critical economic outcomes over to people who haven't the first clue about the implications of those decisions. Yes, that's how democracy works, but that also why there's few (if any) true democracies (democratic systems are better defined as representative systems) and most policies are made essentially by a specialized elite and technocrats. As galling as that is at times (and how justifiable the anger toward these corrupt and self-serving yahoos is), it's preferable to making such decisions by the popular votes of the uniformed masses.