NAOS
Well-Known Member
pardon?
Capitalism is Devil's Dung
- Thread starter Gameface
- Start date
pardon?
NAOS
Well-Known Member
hey guis, hasn't this been a really fun attempt to discredit me? So many terms of address! And zero answers to my questions!
But he's the one demanding FACTS and answers to questions!!! (that were never actually asked, but whatevs, minor complaint right)
I'm off to read polls on what Americans think about Ford Motors killing that guy who invented the carburetor that got 100 miles per gallon. Be back to demand answers shortly.
♪alt13
Well-Known Member
Do they say that or do they say that it is more expensive? There is a difference.
There is also a difference between public schools and private ones. If you go to ITT Tech, University of Phoenix, Stephen's Henegar, The Utah College of Massage Therapy, then yeah that might end up being unaffordable.
NAOS
Well-Known Member
he didn't pursue education past high school. Ok.
Yet....
https://jazzfanz.com/showthread.php...re-met&p=1041820&highlight=nurses#post1041820
Can someone shed some light on this for me? (also, "his nurses" is LMAO, regardless of answers).
No less bizarre than "doctors speaking his name in reverence". Nobody speaks my ****ing name in reverence.
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D
Deleted member 848
Guest
*blushes*
D
Deleted member 848
Guest
In response to your rep Siro, this is definitely the first and only time I've ever been called a radical leftist in my entire life.
Bragging rights.
Bragging rights.
Ya, in no way, shape, or form are you a radical leftist. Your views are within norm for mainstream liberals in North America. You'd pretty much be a centrist in most large American cities. I suspect Franlin's view is tainted by being in Utah.
Look at the rep I gave you, apparently mistakenly. 71% of Americans saying there's a problem, along with seeing that the average student upon graduation is 30k in debt, along with higher education drafting cuts is enough for you to go look at the data.. but you won't.
I don't even bother offering you data. I want you to go find your own. You won't.
I was clearly mistaken. You're no better than the definition of conservative; "Be happy with what you have; forget anyone else that ever had any sort of problem"
Perhaps, but I'm not sure. I think somewhere down the line someone he used to respect in his life prayed poor one too many times when they shouldn't have(probably directly to him) and now he takes it out on anyone and everyone that wants to make life easier.
I have my issues too(obviously). As a kid, I just wanted to be one of the boys.. but because I was poor, no matter how well I did in school, how many games of dynamite I would win, how well I could catch a football, it just wasn't enough. Fifteen years later(after finding my own level of success) I still hold a grudge against "the club", and always assume the rich purposefully keep the poor down.
♪alt13
Well-Known Member
1)A public poll cannot tell you whether college is affordable, it only tells you what the popular perception is.
2) I'll give you the 30k debt number. So, Is 30k affordable?
According to The National Center for Education Statistics
On average a Bachelor's degree helps the person to earn $18,500 more per year. So just 2 years after graduation the degree has payed for itself. Sounds crazy affordable to me.
https://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=77
Again, a public poll is just a data point. It doesn't mean anything.
So the huge flaw in your thinking is Median vs Average. A median is middle point in a set of numbers. Average is completely different. The help desk at my place of employment often hires people with Bachelors degrees at the price of 15/hr($31.2k yearly), but often manages to get Masters graduates. So 48 can be a median all you want, but it's far from average.
But let's move on. Let's forget median vs average, and run with your $48k number.
Taxes take 20% or more. So $9700 taken out for that, right off the top.
An apartment not in student housing or living with your mother runs $700 a month, $8400 a year.
You also have to pay utilities, $200 a month(water, electricity, TV, phone natural gas) is $2400
So we've effectively brought it down to $27,500.
$400 a month in food, $4800 brings us down to $22,700
Transportation - You're a graduate! Chances are(in Utah) you're going to get a car. Leave off the down payment for now. A cheap car payment, we'll say $150 a month($1800/year), plus gas(probably more, but we'll say $100, $1200/year). And you'll want insurance... but oh wait. You're under 25. Which means you get the shaft. $100 a month for that($1200/year). So Transportation gets you for another $2400/month. Down to 20,300.
You'll need to buy new clothes for work, and keep up on replacing old clothes, at least 5% of your yearly income, $2,375. $17,925
Medical care is another 3%, give or take - $1425 - leaving us at $16500
Then there's personal discretionary, hair cuts, gaming, dating, hobbies, eating out or going to the bar with buddies, alcohol.. for a young adult, that's at least 15% of your salary. Putting you at at $9,375
Then there's your emergency fund, savings. Which should be another 10%, $4750. Leaving you with $4625.
So, if nothing catastrophic happens(break your leg and can't work, car's transmission goes out, you don't buy presents for birthday/Christmas for anyone), you have $4625 to pay off your student loans.
$4,625 / 12 = $385 a month. So if you don't pay for ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING ELSE, not a new TV, not furniture for your place, not a new computer to talk crap on jazzfanz.com, absolutely not a tablet... no jet ski's/boats, no vacations or trips away, you live an extremely boring life and just focus on paying your loans off, and keeping your checking account at 0 most of the time, it will take you 7.6 years, accruing $4,800.
And this doesn't even include the average stuff... seasonings for said food, cleaning supplies, new furnace filters, pets you do or don't decide to have.
Public perception is utterly meaningless. They're basically a collection of what whiny people want life to be about instead of what it actually is, and that is a collection of uneducated inbreds on both sides of the isle agreeing on the same damn thing but finding a boogey man on the other side to blame there perceived problem on.
It's well known I don't relate well to those who don't understand basic economic principles, so let me tell you all how this works and what these complaints amount to. Free tuition or higher wages or this or that do nothing more than raise property prices because everyone can afford more and gets into the same ol same ol treadmill race. At that point your cost of living is higher and you've literally accomplished nothing more than making a one time transfer to old people and there descendants who will benefit in the will.
That's how society works. If you want free tuition, fine, it's basically a no-brainer to me (ElRoach knows this but keeps pretending we haven't had this exact conversation before), but if you think you're being some progressive crusader accomplishing some perceived injustice against the working poor you're as far off base as it gets. Not only will you put wage pressure on those who have already worked for it themselves but you'll also lower production and thus tax revenue in the short run and possibly the long run (look at European production for a hint here), and that means less money for actually beneficial societal programs.
The goal is to improve society constantly, not to grovel in talking points that are essentially meaningless in the grand scheme of things. That's what society does best, however, and the reason current ***public polls*** regarding Washington politics are so negative.
So you don't think our politicians should communicate?
Because that's what a dictator says
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D
Deleted member 848
Guest
meh, who the hell knows what he thinks.
Hahaha TKO'd the radicals back into their perma-trolling.
BTW dalamaintnuthin, everyone knows Siro is one of the numerous *** kissing alts you've had over the years. Pretty ****ing sad how many you have/have had to try supporting yourself on things that, in the end, are so meaningless in the grand scheme.
Or... you backed yourself into a corner because you were asked to do something you were adamant about not doing from the start, so you pull the troll card.
By ignoring public opinion, you're stating that the ruling class should rule, and not have a say. That's a cold hard fact, not trolling at all.
Let's throw out the poll. College costs are still slated to increase year by year, and the average debt of a student is approaching if not more than 30k.
Is that enough for you to even consider the possibility that there's an issue?
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♪alt13
Well-Known Member
1)The fact that it's a median only strengthens my point. Average for all Bachelors would be much higher. And the disparity between incomes greater. The average would be skewed higher by those making big bucks.
2)You have to apply the same logic to High School grads. Half of them are making less than 30k per year.
3)I said pays for itself. I didn't say that people would choose to put all their new found income towards that. The lifestyle you put forward is unavailable to the median high school grad because they only make 30k per year. Do the math on that.