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Collier Starting Over Keyonte: Are We Happy?

kcgar said:
I like it a lot. I am not a Keyonte fan, because defense is the most important thing to me along with effort. Keyonte is obviously one of the worst defenders in the NBA and lack of effort is a huge contributor to that. Additionally, I don't love chuckers but I am more fine with them when they take good shots. I feel like his shot selection can be really poor sometimes and he will lean more towards contested shots. On the other side, I really like Collier and his effort. He absolutely deserves being a starter over Keyonte and I hope Keyonte learns from it.
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I dont think he takes terrible shots (like he's not out there taking Svi/THT shots). The bigger issue to me is that he doesnt get enough great shots. It's just a bunch of mediocre shots
 
I still hold out some hope that Keyonte develops into either a more well-rounded player, or at least a more dangerous 6th-man scorer. I think his personality is interesting because he comes across as someone who takes the game and practice very seriously, but he is also someone who seems caught up in the "aesthetics" of basketball. Like he was doing little hops down the court with his dribble in his rookie year. Maybe it's just naive optimism, but I feel like when he realizes the NBA might leave him behind he might start working hard and improving in the missing gaps in his game, and not just "looking the part" as a scorer.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
I dont think he takes terrible shots (like he's not out there taking Svi/THT shots). The bigger issue to me is that he doesnt get enough great shots. It's just a bunch of mediocre shots
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He does take some good shots but not enough. I think he takes terrible shots when the shot clock gets low instead of passing to Lauri etc. Sometimes, he will just dribble the ball until the shot clock gets low instead of moving the ball.
 
Keyonte has had stretches of looking like a starting level guard, offensively. Go look at his November/December splits where he was shooting about 54% efg%, on about 24% usg%.

Here is a list of guards with usg% above 20% sorted by efg% and you can see that Keyonte would be right there if he kept up that efficiency: https://www.nba.com/stats/players/a..._PCT*G*20&PlayerPosition=G&dir=A&sort=EFG_PCT

He's also a good enough passer (27.4% ast%, 2/1 ast/to ratio) that he doesn't need to be branded as just a microwave scorer or can only come off the bench guy. He's a young guard who needs to be more consistent and needs to play defense. He's still got a tone of potential.

I would bet that this benching is a motivation thing, and not some indictment on where the Jazz see Keyonte's future being.
 
SoberasHotRod said:
Keyonte has had stretches of looking like a starting level guard, offensively. Go look at his November/December splits where he was shooting about 54% efg%, on about 24% usg%.

Here is a list of guards with usg% above 20% sorted by efg% and you can see that Keyonte would be right there if he kept up that efficiency: https://www.nba.com/stats/players/a..._PCT*G*20&PlayerPosition=G&dir=A&sort=EFG_PCT

He's also a good enough passer (27.4% ast%, 2/1 ast/to ratio) that he doesn't need to be branded as just a microwave scorer or can only come off the bench guy. He's a young guard who needs to be more consistent and needs to play defense. He's still got a tone of potential.

I would bet that this benching is a motivation thing, and not some indictment on where the Jazz see Keyonte's future being.
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His passing has been pretty good this year. Doesn't get enough credit from his naysayers for that
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
His passing has been pretty good this year. Doesn't get enough credit from his naysayers for that
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Not sure I'm a naysayer I just think he's not this primary guy and offensively my biggest issue is how he runs the offense. Its just too slow and he seems to be more inefficient when trying to do it. I think he was being used wrong and is more of a cog in the offense than a quarterback of it... which is okay. I was always fine with the experiment.

I guess what I am trying to say is the passing is good. Actually great if he's a secondary/tertiary playmaker. It was the other stuff (handle, pace, feel) that left me skeptical of him as a pg. I don't think Collier passed him on the depth chart or future prospect rankings that DA has in his office lol. I just think they saw the benefit of Collier and are using both guys in different setups to see what works. We will get loads of the Collier/Key backcourt after the trade deadline. Likely wanted to provide some motivation for Key and not touch Sexton's trade value. Also lets you see Collier next to a vet more.

This year I think I am actually having a little more belief in Key as a player overall than last year. He's had more consistent good stretches. I think he just got a little too much hype for a minute there last season.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Kind of shocked no thread has been created about this, because it's a fairly large development.

Once coined "Lisan Al-Gaib" by @Handlogten's Heros he is now relegated to being our 6th man (at least until a trade is made).

Locke podcast today basically stated Collier plays harder, so that's why he is starting now.

For the record: I think it's a great move. Collier has more potential as a PG and he is a much better defender. Along with Harkless, the Jazz now have some dogs on the defensive end and I hope they are rewarded with more minutes.
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someone predicted this awhile ago: https://jazzfanz.com/threads/number...efore-collier-becomes-the-starting-pg.219647/
 
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