Donald is about to go through some things...

[Deleted member 365]

Trump is always the victim. And then once you show him the Milley quote, he’ll downplay it or play the whatabout game. You can go through all the indictments, play the phone call to Georgia’s Sec of State, and play footage of the Jan 6 insurrection (and read him the interviews of Trump cabinet members the month preceding the insurrection) and it won’t matter. It’s a never ending cycle for those in cult 45. It gives them entertainment and a sense of worth defending the indefensible.

Told you so.

A “dumb thing to say” would be like saying Little Caesars makes a better pizza than The Pie. A former president and current GOP frontrunner who already tried to overturn the last election, is promising to suspend the constitution, and threatening to execute a general who resisted Trump’s most authoritarian urges, should be disqualifying to any intelligent, moral, and patriotic American.

Sadly, we have an abundance of Americans who aren’t intelligent, are completely immoral, and unpatriotic. One of which posts here almost daily defending the indefensible because it gives his life entertainment and meaning. It feels good to be the forum’s contrarian. It’s freeing to defend the most immoral.

It’s why arguing in these forums is often a dead end. One side is just set against the other, no matter the facts or moral implications. When your identity is set to be contrarian and defend Trump, it makes it so debate is pointless.

 

[fishonjazz]

This is the effect of trumps words: https://www.yahoo.com/news/purpose-experts-alarmed-filing-reveals-191519299.html

New York Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron and his principal law clerk, Allison Greenfield have been bombarded with hundreds of threatening, harassing and disparaging telephone and social media messages

Transcribed voicemails, which were disclosed in the filing, exposed the extent of the vitriol directed at the duo. Several death threats came alongside racist and sexist attacks. “I mean, honestly, you should be assassinated,” one said. “You should be killed. You should be not assassin executed [sic]. You should be executed.”

“Resign now, you dirty, treasonous piece of trash snake. We are going to get you and anyone of you dirty, backstabbing, lying, cheating American. You are nothing but a bunch of communists. We are coming to remove you permanently," said another.

"This is on purpose," Bassin wrote on X, formerly Twitter. "This is Trump’s intent. He wants these people to feel threatened and intimidated. He’s taking a page right from the mafia, plain and simple.

"The danger is to the clerk, but it's really to the entire staff of this courthouse because the former president well-knows of the impact his words have," Vance said during a Sunday MSNBC appearance. She noted that if Trump was posting on social media innocently and without that awareness of his influence, then he would likely have stopped upon seeing the 275, single-spaced pages of threats that Greenfield has received.

Thats the biggest difference in the whataboutism of someone else saying something wrong and trump saying something wrong. Trump has a cult of millions that worship him and will use violence on his behalf.

 

[Deleted member 365]

This is the effect of trumps words: https://www.yahoo.com/news/purpose-experts-alarmed-filing-reveals-191519299.html

New York Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron and his principal law clerk, Allison Greenfield have been bombarded with hundreds of threatening, harassing and disparaging telephone and social media messages

Transcribed voicemails, which were disclosed in the filing, exposed the extent of the vitriol directed at the duo. Several death threats came alongside racist and sexist attacks. “I mean, honestly, you should be assassinated,” one said. “You should be killed. You should be not assassin executed [sic]. You should be executed.”

“Resign now, you dirty, treasonous piece of trash snake. We are going to get you and anyone of you dirty, backstabbing, lying, cheating American. You are nothing but a bunch of communists. We are coming to remove you permanently," said another.

"This is on purpose," Bassin wrote on X, formerly Twitter. "This is Trump’s intent. He wants these people to feel threatened and intimidated. He’s taking a page right from the mafia, plain and simple.

"The danger is to the clerk, but it's really to the entire staff of this courthouse because the former president well-knows of the impact his words have," Vance said during a Sunday MSNBC appearance. She noted that if Trump was posting on social media innocently and without that awareness of his influence, then he would likely have stopped upon seeing the 275, single-spaced pages of threats that Greenfield has received.

Thats the biggest difference in the whataboutism of someone else saying something wrong and trump saying something wrong. Trump has a cult of millions that worship him and will use violence on his behalf.

Good post. Deep down inside, Trump wants his followers to act on his words. After all, up until just recently, only his followers faced any consequences! It’s why he uses the dog whistles and mafia speak that he does. It gives him plausible deniability while making it crystal clear to his followers, what he wants done.

We’ve seen his do this countless times. From asking Comey “to let it go” the investigation into Gen Flynn or his phone call with Georgia Sec of State to “find the votes” or with his Jan 6 rally of “you need to fight or you won’t have a country anymore” or his “vermin” talk just recently. It’s obvious what he wants to do to anyone who isn’t attempting to whitewash every Trump turd out there.

 

[Deleted member 365]

Watch this 3 min clip. Gee, how did thousands of Trump supporters end up at the capitol building after this rally? Who gave them the idea to “fight” there? Who demanded that “Congress do the right thing?” It’s gaslighting at its fullest when Trump supporters on here pretend that Trump’s words are meaningless. This is exactly what he wanted to have happen.

How many more lives are we going to allow this guy to ruin?


View: https://youtu.be/mh3cbd7niTQ?feature=shared

 

[Al-O-Meter]

This is the effect of trumps words: https://www.yahoo.com/news/purpose-experts-alarmed-filing-reveals-191519299.html

New York Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron and his principal law clerk, Allison Greenfield have been bombarded with hundreds of threatening, harassing and disparaging telephone and social media messages

Transcribed voicemails, which were disclosed in the filing, exposed the extent of the vitriol directed at the duo. Several death threats came alongside racist and sexist attacks. “I mean, honestly, you should be assassinated,” one said. “You should be killed. You should be not assassin executed [sic]. You should be executed.”

“Resign now, you dirty, treasonous piece of trash snake. We are going to get you and anyone of you dirty, backstabbing, lying, cheating American. You are nothing but a bunch of communists. We are coming to remove you permanently," said another.

"This is on purpose," Bassin wrote on X, formerly Twitter. "This is Trump’s intent. He wants these people to feel threatened and intimidated. He’s taking a page right from the mafia, plain and simple.

"The danger is to the clerk, but it's really to the entire staff of this courthouse because the former president well-knows of the impact his words have," Vance said during a Sunday MSNBC appearance. She noted that if Trump was posting on social media innocently and without that awareness of his influence, then he would likely have stopped upon seeing the 275, single-spaced pages of threats that Greenfield has received.

Thats the biggest difference in the whataboutism of someone else saying something wrong and trump saying something wrong. Trump has a cult of millions that worship him and will use violence on his behalf.

I disagree completely that this due to words of Trump. The NY case is pure weaponization of the American justice system. The idea of that case is that Trump misvalued his properties to get loans. The banks did their own valuations, and loaned the money, and the money was repaid, and the banks are happy. There is no victim in this supposed crime, but the state is saying because Trump valued his brand higher than Justice Engoron believes is accurate that NY is going to seize a quarter of a billion dollars from Trump and Trump was already pronounced guilty before the trial began.

To the best of my knowledge, Trump has never asked anyone to send death threats to Engoron. If you want to show me where he did then I'm open to it, but as of now I believe this is the result of people becoming familiar with case and becoming outraged that this can happen.

 

[One Brow]

Good post. Deep down inside, Trump wants his followers to act on his words. After all, up until just recently, only his followers faced any consequences! It’s why he uses the dog whistles and mafia speak that he does. It gives him plausible deniability while making it crystal clear to his followers, what he wants done.

We’ve seen his do this countless times. From asking Comey “to let it go” the investigation into Gen Flynn or his phone call with Georgia Sec of State to “find the votes” or with his Jan 6 rally of “you need to fight or you won’t have a country anymore” or his “vermin” talk just recently. It’s obvious what he wants to do to anyone who isn’t attempting to whitewash every Trump turd out there.

I disagree completely that this due to words of Trump. The NY case is pure weaponization of the American justice system. The idea of that case is that Trump misvalued his properties to get loans. The banks did their own valuations, and loaned the money, and the money was repaid, and the banks are happy. There is no victim in this supposed crime, but the state is saying because Trump valued his brand higher than Justice Engoron believes is accurate that NY is going to seize a quarter of a billion dollars from Trump and Trump was already pronounced guilty before the trial began.

To the best of my knowledge, Trump has never asked anyone to send death threats to Engoron. If you want to show me where he did then I'm open to it, but as of now I believe this is the result of people becoming familiar with case and becoming outraged that this can happen.

Nice of the second poster to provide an example for the first.

 

[Red]

Since Trump is authoritarian, I’ve been interested in Ruth Ben-Ghiat’s perspective on Trump’s threats, she being an historian of authoritarianism.

"Lock Them Up": Trump's Authoritarian Plans for 2025

Controlling bodies in jails, camps, and psychiatric institutions makes strongmen feel powerful

lucid.substack.com

“Trump's dire words raise new fears about his authoritarian bent," reads the headline of a front-page story in the New York Times. I am quoted on how the former president used a campaign speech to circulate language with Fascist antecedents. He vowed to "root out the communists, Marxists, fascists and the radical left thugs that live like vermin within the confines of our country..."

Last week's Lucid essay examined how such dehumanizing language is meant to prepare Americans psychologically to accept the persecution of their compatriots. This week’s post explores what that persecution might look like, drawing on what Trump did during his first administration and his campaign's statements of intent.

Some have wondered why the Trump campaign is being so open about the repressive policies they intend to implement. This “transparency” is in line with authoritarian history: Autocrats often tell you who they are and what they intend to do to you before they take office. They do this as a challenge to norms, and they do this as a threat”.

Trump's "Vermin" Speech Echoes Fascist Rhetoric

Mussolini and Hitler dehumanized their enemies in the same way

lucid.substack.com

“As I argued in a recent Lucid essay, violence is now Trump's brand. To that end, he conjures existential threats to the nation from non-White immigrants and an expanding cast of internal enemies, calls the thugs who are in prison for assaulting the Capitol on Jan. 6 "political prisoners," and praises autocrats such as Xi Jinping and Vladimir Putin who depend on propaganda, corruption, and repression to stay in power.

All of this is part of his effort to re-educate Americans to see violence as justified, patriotic, and even morally righteous.

“……Typically, Trump and his advisors took exception to being called out for deploying Fascist rhetoric, resorting to threats that simply strengthened the case against them. As the Washington Post reported, Trump's campaign spokesman Steven Cheung had this to say about those (like me) who make such comparisons: "their entire existence will be crushed when President Trump returns to the White House."

Only later did Cheung apparently realize that using Fascist language was unhelpful and claimed that he meant to say their “sad, miserable existence" instead of their “entire existence" —whatever that means”.

 

[Al-O-Meter]

Since Trump is authoritarian, I’ve been interested in Ruth Ben-Ghiat’s perspective on ...

Wha???? You are interested in opinions of people who will validate your opinion? Shocking and totally unlike you except it is everything you post. Honest question to you Red: Do you ever read material that challenges your beliefs?

 

[Deleted member 365]

I’ve always found Red to be pretty well read and open minded. It’s pretty laughable to attack him. It just shows how radicalized and completely out of touch with real America some of you have become.

One of the greatest fallacies that Trump cultists keep telling themselves today is that those who don’t worship Trump and don’t embrace Trumpism live in information silos. As if the only reason why the majority of America rejects them is out of ignorance. Quite the opposite in fact. Most of the country rejects Trump and Trumpism because we know exactly what it is, an authoritarian movement headed by a disgusting immoral traitorous coward. Those who defend this movement are either unbelievably ignorant or incredibly immoral and have their identities tied up with this (and don’t want to admit that their critics have been right all along).

Ask yourself, how many times have you seen mainstream media interview Biden voters from the inner city? How many times have you seen journalists interview women in the suburbs asking them why they voted for Biden? Why haven’t we seen any stories interviewing POC asking them why they voted for such an old white man?

Compare that to the endless amount of stories we’ve seen from journalists going into rural diners and asking a bunch of cultists why they continue to support Trump (take yer country back! We need a leader with balls! Load them immigrant vermin up in trains! Save der childrin from der liberals! Imprison Fauci! Lock her up! Biden crime family! Sssshhhhina! CRT and kids usin kitty litter!).

Analyze their answers and see how ridiculous they sound because they’re stuck in their Qanon Trump worship information silos. Just look at how Al has his entire identity tied up with being the contrarian on this site. It gives him meaning to push back against the indefensible no matter how dumb or awful Trump is. He knows what he’s saying is bogus. But it’s better than to admit that you’ve been correct all along.

Honestly, MAGA cultists in general and rural America in particular would benefit a lot by talking to, interacting with, and learning from real America. They’ve just completely lost touch with most of the country. It doesn’t always have to be this way. But in order for that to change… their voters are going to have to start caring about more than just getting their dopamine hit from watching hate tv and listening to bigoted radio and low info podcasts. Unfortunately, there’s a lot of money involved in providing cultists their drugs. And the addicts respond by asking for more and more. And the cult leader uses both to cover his crimes and enrich himself. It's a vicious cycle.

 

[Al-O-Meter]

...would benefit a lot by talking to, interacting with, and learning from real America.

The level of projection is astounding. Let's get real for a moment. The progressive left, the group you comfortably fit with, makes up roughly 6% of the American population. That 6% is who you see as "normal" or "real America". The remaining 94% of America is too far right for you. That 94% ranges from nearly every conservative on this site, to registered Libertarian me, to lefty One Brow who you won't talk to because he commits the great sin of talking/interacting/learning from those even in the 94%. Social media is highly effective at curating a feed of information as so you think the 94% are the fringe minority.

However it is the other half of your statement that I find mind-blowing. You, the user who has blocked more people so he doesn't have to talk/interact/learn, is faulting the 94% for failure to talk/interact/learn. You act as if talking/interacting/learning is a good thing and yet still have the most opposition to it. I'll talk and interact with anyone. Every one of these lefty think pieces Red posts, I read them. Most of the authors he prizes I'm already familiar with.

I will admit that recently you have been a bit better about talking to those outside the progressive left. The break from the site may have done you some good, or maybe it is the baby. Congratulations on that BTW. Whatever it is, I do hope that you continue a willingness to talk/interact/learn. I agree with you on that being a good thing.

 

[Red]

Wha???? You are interested in opinions of people who will validate your opinion? Shocking and totally unlike you except it is everything you post. Honest question to you Red: Do you ever read material that challenges your beliefs?

She’s excellent in her analysis. And that’s a problem for you. And again, I understood what Trump represented the very day he descended the escalator in Trump Tower, and announced in 2015. I was where Ben-Ghiat is coming from years ago. I did not have to go looking for someone to validate my opinion. I’m a sharp guy, and I can actually think on my own two feet, lol.

I noticed the thread had turned to a subject that might be helped by including Ben-Ghiat’s perspective. You have a problem with that?? Really?? You have a problem with a diversity of views regarding the subject being discussed? WTF is wrong with you??

Lol, I offer an intelligent analysis by a historian of autocrats, and the best you can do is complain that I posted an opinion that I agree with?

Your main critique is that I contributed to the conversation?? What a complete jerk you are!! So sorry, bear with it, I may post again sometime!

 

[Red]

Wha???? You are interested in opinions of people who will validate your opinion? Shocking and totally unlike you except it is everything you post. Honest question to you Red: Do you ever read material that challenges your beliefs?

And again, just so we’re clear, this comment adds absolutely nothing to the conversation. It’s just a jerk complaining that someone actually has an opinion that differed from his own. That’s DEEP, man, that’s really, really deep!