Chargers Jazz Angels
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Jokic couldn't either
Following Potential 2018 Draftees
- Thread starter Dr. Jones
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Jokic couldn't either
Wasn't KD another one that had zero reps on the bench?
Yeah, but KD was 19 and an absolute freak physically.
If your role is suppose to be 3&D energy wing that can defend multiple positions, I think strength might be pretty important. It's a red flag to me. I think he is suppose to be known for questionable work ethic/dedication off the court.
Yeah, and Jokic is an absolute trash defender who is insanely gifted offensively from a skills and IQ standpoint. Frazier is not.
LoPo
Well-Known Member
I think bench press is overrated for a guy we are talking about drafting as late as we are drafting.
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No one is saying the bench press is an important number, but it's the only strength number they give us at the combine. If you are in the gym working on your body, you are going to touch the bench press every now and then to keep your body balanced. I'm not saying I need to see 15 reps to be impressed. All I'm saying is that it's a reflection of work ethic and dedication. 0 reps is a red flag at his age. Don't use KD, a 19 year old who was a generational a talent from a size/skills standpoint, as a counterpoint. It doesnt fit. I bet you anything by the time he was 22 he could put out reps.
Frazier is a completely different level of prospect if he can play the 4, like Ariza does, but at 200 lbs with minimal strength and turning 22 in a few months, that doesnt seem likely.
Frazier is a completely different level of prospect if he can play the 4, like Ariza does, but at 200 lbs with minimal strength and turning 22 in a few months, that doesnt seem likely.
LoPo
Well-Known Member
Just look at this list from this year's combine. There are a number of guys who did 2 or less. If you consider a number of top prospects who didn't even do the measurement for whatever reason (Bridges, Bamba, Grayson, etc) you realize its not a true indicator of NBA ability.
https://stats.nba.com/draft/combine-strength-agility/
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https://stats.nba.com/draft/combine-strength-agility/
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Reading must be hard for you.
No one in this thread has made any argument for it being an indicator of NBA ability. It's an indicator of work ethic. That much is undeniable in my eyes. And again, don't give me anything about 19/20 year olds. We are talking about a guy who is turning 22 in a few months.
D
Deleted member 5000
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Bench press tends to favor short wingspan guys, it's not really a fair stat for players with arms for days.
LoPo
Well-Known Member
Cy - you are predicting work ethic now?
The guy plays for Tulane. He's not playing for a prospect engine. He is an obvious late bloomer. I just don't put much stock into bench press and shuttle times.
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The guy plays for Tulane. He's not playing for a prospect engine. He is an obvious late bloomer. I just don't put much stock into bench press and shuttle times.
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Y'all are really missing the point on this.
D
Deleted member 5000
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Which is?
He likely doesn't like weightlifting. It might be a sign of poor work ethic.
That athletic and physical development are important things in the NBA and I want players who are as dedicated to the weight room as they are the basketball court.
While the bench press number is not important, it's the only number we have for strength at the combine. It's a sign of work ethic in the weight room. Being able to rep 185 zero times when you are nearly 22 is a sign to me that the guy either never touches weights or has a hard time gaining strength. I'm not discussing specific numbers or putting stock into a guy who can do x amount more than this player. I just want a player who is actually dedicated to his body and 0 reps at his age point to him not being dedicated.
aka Andrei Kirilenko syndrome.
*And yes, guys who are insanely talented can overcome a so-so work ethic in regards to tuning their bodies to peak performance, but I dont think Frazier is skilled enough to have that luxury*
LoPo
Well-Known Member
So Kevin Durant is okay having zero bench presses because he was 19 but Frazier is a terrible prospect idea for us because he had zero bench presses at 21.
Just making sure we are all seeing the same logic.
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Just making sure we are all seeing the same logic.
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And to be clear, I'm a fan of Frazier. I think he is likely an energy wing off the bench who can make some cool plays.
I just don't have much confidence for him to reach his ceiling, whatever that may be. And a lot of that doubt comes from how his lack of strength will hold him back from playing the position he is best suited for in the NBA, small ball 4.
I just don't have much confidence for him to reach his ceiling, whatever that may be. And a lot of that doubt comes from how his lack of strength will hold him back from playing the position he is best suited for in the NBA, small ball 4.
You are either dumb as hell or purposefully being daft. I have explained my position on this pretty well and this isnt at all what I am getting at.
BTW @rare144 is right about the wingspan. Players with longer arms have harder time with the benchpress.