TheStormofWar
Well-Known Member
A/A- on both sides. Everyone got what they wanted.
Grade the Trade: Mitchell to Cavs
- Thread starter Keefe
- Start date
Uh, I don't get it.
All of this.
The only reservation I have from this is that I fear that the Cavs picks will be worth less than the Knick's picks would have been, as I think they are pretty solid and if they see some early success they could lock this core in for nearly a decade with extensions later, which means we end up with picks in the 20's, whereas I am pretty confident the Knick's are headed to a collapse whether they had Mitchell or not, so they would at least be late lottery at the worst. Otherwise, from players and picks, this was a great haul. Solid B on the trade overall.
Yeah this is one big reason I was more than happy to move on from Mitchell. His true colors were shining through and they are really ugly. You can tell the measure of a man by how he respond when **** isn't going his way. Gobert kept fighting the good fight and doing all he could on both ends to win. Mitchell kicked back and said "**** it" and stopped playing any semblance of D and stopped any kind of play-making on the court, making it very clear he was disgruntled and wasn't going to put forth any effort as a result. Stark contrast imo. Gobert I will miss, Mitchell I am glad is gone.
I said A-. They worked on it all summer and weren't going to get a better deal. Meanwhile, they told the Knicks to kick rocks and sent Mitchell to take his wine and cheese to Cleveland.
I dig it.
I dig it.
Reality: A+
The False Delusion Most of Were Under: A-
The early hype about how much we could squeeze out of the Knicks made Mitchell's trade value prospects way too unrealistic. I think we got way over fair value for Mitchell. I think Mitchell is a top 25-30 player, not top 20. We got a Top 20 package for a flawed player. Not that I love any of the players we got, but we got 3 young starters. I wish more of them were on rookie deals, but they are all 3 on long-term fair value deals at least.
The False Delusion Most of Were Under: A-
The early hype about how much we could squeeze out of the Knicks made Mitchell's trade value prospects way too unrealistic. I think we got way over fair value for Mitchell. I think Mitchell is a top 25-30 player, not top 20. We got a Top 20 package for a flawed player. Not that I love any of the players we got, but we got 3 young starters. I wish more of them were on rookie deals, but they are all 3 on long-term fair value deals at least.
A+
Is Donovan Mitchell a 2029 unprotected 1st, 2028 pick swap, Collin Sexton (4/72M) and Lauri Markannen combination better than Dejounte Murray?
Is Donovan Mitchell a 2029 unprotected 1st, 2028 pick swap, Collin Sexton (4/72M) and Lauri Markannen combination better than Dejounte Murray?
This is counting Charlotte’s protected 2023 pick as an equal to Agbaji too. I would rather have Agbaji than that pick too.
PresidioTrojan
Well-Known Member
A/A-
Got a substantially better haul of young players than I expected, and the combination of 3 UFRP + 2 swaps from '25-'29 is as good as we could have hoped for.
I have confidence this Cavs nucleus will be very good for 3-5 years. 2027-2029? Who the heck knows. Highly likely at least one of those 3 picks is high lotto or better.
Got a substantially better haul of young players than I expected, and the combination of 3 UFRP + 2 swaps from '25-'29 is as good as we could have hoped for.
I have confidence this Cavs nucleus will be very good for 3-5 years. 2027-2029? Who the heck knows. Highly likely at least one of those 3 picks is high lotto or better.
YoungJefe
Well-Known Member
I'd give it an A.
While I think I would've preferred the package from NY that included RJ Barrett, Mitchell Robinson, Obi Toppin, and 3 1st round picks I still like the haul that we got. And I think that in the long run it may actually be a better package because it also allowed us to keep roster/financial flexibility. If we had taken that offer from the Knicks we would've had to immediately extend Barrett/Robinson and commit to them as core pieces we would be building around. Instead we added Sexton/Lauri who are both on team friendly deals for the next few seasons so if they play well we can keep them around but if they don't we can easily move off of them.
I like all three of the players that we got in the deal and think that all three can be rotational guys for us going forward. Sexton is one of the better young scoring guards in the league, Lauri is an extremely skilled 7 footer, and Agbaji was a lottery pick that fits the 3&D mold perfectly.
As far as the picks are concerned I think Ainge is more so banking on the 2027/2028/2029 picks being the real value we got back from this deal. Donovan will likely be gone, we've seen stars force their way out of small markets before, and they won't have any real means to retool quickly or improve their team if things don't pan out. With the recent rumors about us wanting one of the Lakers picks as well I think the plan is to try and be good when that 2026-2027 roles around and then potentially add the final piece during that draft.
While I think I would've preferred the package from NY that included RJ Barrett, Mitchell Robinson, Obi Toppin, and 3 1st round picks I still like the haul that we got. And I think that in the long run it may actually be a better package because it also allowed us to keep roster/financial flexibility. If we had taken that offer from the Knicks we would've had to immediately extend Barrett/Robinson and commit to them as core pieces we would be building around. Instead we added Sexton/Lauri who are both on team friendly deals for the next few seasons so if they play well we can keep them around but if they don't we can easily move off of them.
I like all three of the players that we got in the deal and think that all three can be rotational guys for us going forward. Sexton is one of the better young scoring guards in the league, Lauri is an extremely skilled 7 footer, and Agbaji was a lottery pick that fits the 3&D mold perfectly.
As far as the picks are concerned I think Ainge is more so banking on the 2027/2028/2029 picks being the real value we got back from this deal. Donovan will likely be gone, we've seen stars force their way out of small markets before, and they won't have any real means to retool quickly or improve their team if things don't pan out. With the recent rumors about us wanting one of the Lakers picks as well I think the plan is to try and be good when that 2026-2027 roles around and then potentially add the final piece during that draft.
We all would but that was never even close to being on the table.
I am torn between A+ and A. In essence we got the Gobert trade for Mitchell too. The only reason I have hesitation is whether or not we could have gotten even more from NYK.
MIN 25 = CLE 25
MIN 26 swap = CLE 26 swap
MIN 27 = CLE 27
MIN 29 < CLE 29 (Cleveland pick is unprotected, MIN is top 5 protected)
MIN 23 <= CLE 28 swap
#22 pick in 2022 draft(Walker Kessler) < #14 pick in 2022 draft(Ochai Agbaji)
Patrick Beverley
Jared Vanderbilt
Malik Beasley
Leandro Bolmaro
vs
Collin Sexton
Lauri Markkanen
So if we were elated by the Gobert trade, I have no idea why we wouldn't be about this one... This is a pretty amazing return and fits our priorities and goals in the short and the long term.
MIN 25 = CLE 25
MIN 26 swap = CLE 26 swap
MIN 27 = CLE 27
MIN 29 < CLE 29 (Cleveland pick is unprotected, MIN is top 5 protected)
MIN 23 <= CLE 28 swap
#22 pick in 2022 draft(Walker Kessler) < #14 pick in 2022 draft(Ochai Agbaji)
Patrick Beverley
Jared Vanderbilt
Malik Beasley
Leandro Bolmaro
vs
Collin Sexton
Lauri Markkanen
So if we were elated by the Gobert trade, I have no idea why we wouldn't be about this one... This is a pretty amazing return and fits our priorities and goals in the short and the long term.
SoUjazzfan
Well-Known Member
It was preemptive and gives a glimmer of hope for the future. Another season of Donovan would just be procrastinating the inevitable and the return was heavily in our favor when looking to the future. The fact that for now the Knicks lose out on a player who wants to be there puts it over the top.
YoungJefe
Well-Known Member
Didn't Woj report that the Knicks offered Barrett/Robinson/Toppin and 3 unprotected 1sts in July?
The way you broke down the picks is interesting and I tend to agree. The players we got in the Donovan trade blow away the players from the Rudy trade though. Not even close.