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Gun Control

Some media outlets are biased, certainly. However, none of them will see their profits rise with any sort of increase in gun control. Whatever their motives and actions, there is no profit motive mixed in.

I am not claiming there is. I have already stated that their motives are different.

Read a report that the gun stories from ABC, NBC and CBS since Sandy Hook have favored gun control by an 8 to 1 margin.

I am sure Fox News has a similar slant the other way.
 
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So then you oppose the AWB? Guard.

As you have pointed out, there is no such thing as a clearly identifiable "assault weapon". Is there an actual proposal/description of what would be banned, or am I being asked to support/reject a vaporbill? I've previously said that I would support certain specific bans, for example, on magazine-loaded weapons.

Or do you oppose it for those that are part of a militia? Does that now mean that you have to register as a militia member? That would an easy way for the federal government to keep tabs on those they consider the most dangerous citizens. (see that DHS report). Also who is doing this regulation and oversight? The federal government? That will lead them down the road to becoming the same thing as the National Guard.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Guard_of_the_United_States

The National Guard are actually under the control of the governors, and only come under direct federal jurisdiction when 1) war or an emergency status is declared, and 2) subsequently, the President takes command from the governors. So, they still are a militia in the sense intended by the founders, one with great funding and training.

Do you have a specific issue with the DHS report? Did it list any specific groups in an inaccurate way?

I'm not sure why you think registering and oversight is the same as direct control. I register my employment with the federal government, but certainly don't feel that they control who I work for.
 
I would agree with that statement if you limited it to "deconstruct their federal government".

gotta disagree with this... there really was not a Federal government at the time the Constitution was written, and even after it was finally ratified, it took time for the concept of a Federal government to evolve

also, there really were no federal armed forces at all at that time, the army that fought the British in the war of independence had disbanded, battles were primarily fought by coalitions of citizens militias - - it really wasn't until the War of 1812 that there was more of a push for a standing federal army.
 
As you have pointed out, there is no such thing as a clearly identifiable "assault weapon". Is there an actual proposal/description of what would be banned, or am I being asked to support/reject a vaporbill? I've previously said that I would support certain specific bans, for example, on magazine-loaded weapons.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Guard_of_the_United_States

The National Guard are actually under the control of the governors, and only come under direct federal jurisdiction when 1) war or an emergency status is declared, and 2) subsequently, the President takes command from the governors. So, they still are a militia in the sense intended by the founders, one with great funding and training.

Do you have a specific issue with the DHS report? Did it list any specific groups in an inaccurate way?

I'm not sure why you think registering and oversight is the same as direct control. I register my employment with the federal government, but certainly don't feel that they control who I work for.

Several issues. I greatly dislike the terms they use to describe "right wing extremists". Such as listing "gun rights" and tax protest" as code words. By saying that those who are in signle issue organizations are domestic terrorists.

So I guess Planned parenthood, the brady campaign, pro-life groups...are all terrorists.

As for regulation equalling direct control. It is not, not immediately anyway.
 
gotta disagree with this... there really was not a Federal government at the time the Constitution was written, and even after it was finally ratified, it took time for the concept of a Federal government to evolve

I'm not disagreeing with you on any of those points. However, it was the fear of an over-reaching federal government that led to the Bill of Rights in the first place, even before the Constitution was approved. There was little concern about tyrannical state governments.
 
gotta disagree with this... there really was not a Federal government at the time the Constitution was written, and even after it was finally ratified, it took time for the concept of a Federal government to evolve

also, there really were no federal armed forces at all at that time, the army that fought the British in the war of independence had disbanded, battles were primarily fought by coalitions of citizens militias - - it really wasn't until the War of 1812 that there was more of a push for a standing federal army.

Actually, it was well into the Civil War before a federal army was well established. At the beginning there were so many different uniforms running around, each side shot just as much of their own as they did the other's.
 
As you have pointed out, there is no such thing as a clearly identifiable "assault weapon". Is there an actual proposal/description of what would be banned, or am I being asked to support/reject a vaporbill? I've previously said that I would support certain specific bans, for example, on magazine-loaded weapons.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Guard_of_the_United_States

The National Guard are actually under the control of the governors, and only come under direct federal jurisdiction when 1) war or an emergency status is declared, and 2) subsequently, the President takes command from the governors. So, they still are a militia in the sense intended by the founders, one with great funding and training.

Do you have a specific issue with the DHS report? Did it list any specific groups in an inaccurate way?

I'm not sure why you think registering and oversight is the same as direct control. I register my employment with the federal government, but certainly don't feel that they control who I work for.

Just read that the Bush administration argued legally that the power for some of their actions was due to the entire world being a "battleground". If Obama has continued that arguement then they could theoretically take full direct control of the National Guard since everywhere is a battleground.

The arguements that they place forward, if not contested immediately, lay the ground work for other abuses later.
 
gotta disagree with this... there really was not a Federal government at the time the Constitution was written, and even after it was finally ratified, it took time for the concept of a Federal government to evolve

also, there really were no federal armed forces at all at that time, the army that fought the British in the war of independence had disbanded, battles were primarily fought by coalitions of citizens militias - - it really wasn't until the War of 1812 that there was more of a push for a standing federal army.

gotta agree with this.

The only 'military' force we had in the early days of our independence was a whole lot of ordinary folks with their guns, who were fully invested in the continued independence of our country and its principles upholding personal liberties. A "mob" if you will, but a "mob" with the principles to establish one of the best governments the world has ever seen.

People who throughout the process of fighting for independence made the civil efforts to maintain their "colonial" or state governments staffed with their representatives, who then directed their war for independence, and people who throughout the whole process honored the concepts of respect for "their" government.

I agree with the need for an organized and well-managed military, and the provision for sufficient arms for that military to defend the nation. I disagree with wars against ideas, wars against religions, wars against chemical substances and wars against methods of making war, like "terror". I agree with protecting people in their freedom, in their states or nation, in their homes and on their highways and in their places of worship or work or entertainment. I disagree with "American" foreign policy where it looks like we're being the bully on the world street.

Our excursions away from being a principled nation go back in some respects many decades, and I could show some horrid examples of unprincipled campaigns our country has done, which are in fact horrendous, to practically our beginnings in relation to our wars against the native Americans, but even then we had elected government officials who had to look at some support base in the citizenry and hold enough respect for them they decided, cogently, to refrain from abusing at least those citizens who could vote them out of office. And for a large part, those citizens were principled people with some core values which maintained, at least for themselves, their right to run their government.

all we need, as a nation, is a government that still respects the rights of its citizens enough, that those citizens are secure in their homes, on their streets, and in their peaceable daily affairs, that is willing to let the voting booth be the seat of real power. People who have "their" government in their control can be armed to the teeth, and their government has nothing to fear from them. People like that will themselves confront mobs and armed political insurrections even if their state or nation could not or would not, and no such "mobs" would actually dare take to the streets and face such competent and principled people.

But a military under principled control of state or even federal oversight is not a bad thing. . . . the problem is only the question of principles which direct it. Just as any collection of citizens with arms might not be a bad thing, and it is the principles which the citizens hold and maintain which must be judged as good or bad.

On that point, I maintain that we have less to fear from citizens moved by ideals of representative government than we have to fear from high-handed ideologues moved by ideals of what everyone must do, even to save mother earth.
 
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