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Its Time to Tank

HermanG said:
I guess its more about everyone expecting the tank so any plausible evidence triggers confirmation bias.
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Well put.

At some point (even if it has taken more than 3/4 of the season to get to this point) the pro-tankers will end up being right that the Jazz let go of the rope (just as we were all convinced of the night of the trade, after which we proceeded to go 4-2). Or they won't be.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Andy is my spirit animal
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The front office has obviously been in tank mode for some time, but I'm not convinced Hardy is trying to lose games yet. I think he just didn't have enough NBA players to compete yesterday. Even then, if Agbaji doesn't go down, we still probably would have won last night.

The injury situation will be interesting to watch. Freak injuries that take way longer to heal than they should are sure fire tanking moves that shows the front office is kicking up our tank a few notches.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
It’s pretty obvious right.
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Its a huge contradiction as I look at that recent trade as a super tank trade. I look at the Donovan mitchell and rudy gobert trades as pretty damn tanky. I look at the royce oneal trade as a tank trade. i look at the bogey trade as a semi tank trade. Dumping a very successful coach for a rookie first time head coach looks pretty tanky. Playing rudy Gay more minutes than last year looks tanky. i look at our record and see no tank. Honestly I think the contradiction all comes down to one thing. Lauri Markennan. If he were simply as good as most everyone thought he would be (decent starter) or if he were injured or never acquired then we would be right near the bottom of the league in wins and losses. Danny Ainge did his best to make a great tank but Lauri broke it.

And Im fine with that. Just means that the rebuild should be faster and easier. We already got our star. Thats the hardest part. Now fill out the roster with the million assets we got making tank trades.
 
I don't think anyone is claiming that the deadline deal didn't make the team much less likely to win games. Whether the main purpose of that deal was to get the LAL pick and cap room OR to lose this season, that's debatable (and has been done so...).

Holding Sexton and JC out as proof of tanking is not something I'd say for certain right now. They both have actual documented injuries. If we don't see them at all in March, then yes.

But for Andy Larsen to say that Dok's minutes, lack of timeouts or whatever small decisions Hardy made last night was proof that he just suddenly started tanking in game 63 of the season is pretty wild in my mind. That just doesn't make sense on any level.
 
Korisfani said:
I don't think anyone is claiming that the deadline deal didn't make the team much less likely to win games. Whether the main purpose of that deal was to get the LAL pick and cap room OR to lose this season, that's debatable (and has been done so...).

Holding Sexton and JC out as proof of tanking is not something I'd say for certain right now. They both have actual documented injuries. If we don't see them at all in March, then yes.

But for Andy Larsen to say that Dok's minutes, lack of timeouts or whatever small decisions Hardy made last night was proof that he just suddenly started tanking in game 63 of the season is pretty wild in my mind. That just doesn't make sense on any level.
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Ya I still dont think hardy is tanking. he is a rookie head coach is all and makes some mistakes (hiring a rookie head coach was kinda tanky imo in the first place. Ainge was hoping he would make rookie mistakes)
I think Hardy will, and should, still try to win games.
 
Im totally pulling this out of my *** but I think Lauri has been so unexpectedly amazing (like top 10 player level amazing) that his unexpectedly amazing play accounts for 10 wins by itself. I think if we got Cleveland level Lauri then our record would be something like 21-42. That would make us 5th worst in the league and really really close to 4th worst.
 
fishonjazz said:
Im totally pulling this out of my *** but I think Lauri has been so unexpectedly amazing (like top 10 player level amazing) that his unexpectedly amazing play accounts for 10 wins by itself. I think if we got Cleveland level Lauri then our record would be something like 21-42. That would make us 5th worst in the league and really really close to 4th worst.
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I don't think there is any doubt that Lauri's exceptional play has led to at least 10 wins. Particularly when we have had such a large amount of close wins.
 
Besides Lauris explosion we have Kessler.
Im always hearing that tanking is a bad idea because rookies dont help much and take a long time to eventually help a team. This is also why tanking/rebuilds take forever to get out of. Yet here we have Kessler, an after thought late first round pick throw in part of the trade, playing like a 30 million a year 2 time all star, 2 time all nba, 3 time defensive player of the year. As a rookie. I dont think anyone saw that coming. I also expected conley to miss more games due to injury and Clarkson to struggle more as a starter.

So many pleasant (or unpleasant depending on the person) surprises from this team.
 
Well, the 538 WAR stat says about 7 wins above replacement. And some of the post-deadline games have been clearly down to Lauri. For example take out Lauri's 43 from the OKC game and replace them with Rudy Gay minutes and that's always a loss. So, maybe 8-9 less wins are more losses is reasonable.
 
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