Jazz Preparing Conley Offer in Range of 75/3

[NUMBERICA]

A bunch? I don't consider 5 games a bunch.
But yes, it sucked that he got injured.

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I guess I’m missing something because if it’s 5 games out of the 11 games of the playoffs then that is more than “a bunch” in practical terms.

He has missed ~1/3 of his games in a Jazz uniform to hamstring injuries. It’s a real problem.

 

[fishonjazz]

I guess I’m missing something because if it’s 5 games out of the 11 games of the playoffs then that is more than “a bunch” in practical terms.

He has missed ~1/3 of his games in a Jazz uniform to hamstring injuries. It’s a real problem.

I would say its a high percentage more than its a bunch. I could peel 2 bananas and one of them could have a spider inside the peel. But to me that wouldn't mean a bunch of bananas that I peeled had spiders inside the peel. Even though it would be 50% of the bananas. 1 isn't a bunch imo. Neither is 5. To me a bunch is a large number. But its semantics. In the largest sample size possible (his career) conley has been pretty healthy for playoff games. Since he has been on the jazz he has been injured more often. I do agree that his hamstring WAS a problem. And could be again. I dont think "was" "is" and "will be going forward" are necessarily the same thing. His hamstring WAS a problem is the only factual statement. I haven't seen a recent injury report on conleys hamstring but I bet he could go tomorrow if there was a game.
If we sign him then neither of those things really matters because at that point he is signed. Then we have the option as fans to be pessimistic or optimistic and both can be true/right.
Im an optimistic person by nature. So I will count on conley being healthy for the playoffs and playing great in them (like round 1 this season and like most every season of his career). Feel free to count on him being out for the playoffs. Live your life the way you want bro.

 

[NUMBERICA]

I would say its a high percentage more than its a bunch.

I guess you missed the part where I said “in practical terms” or you didn’t understand it.

The rest is you changing your argument. He missed virtually half of his playoff games this year and has missed 1/3 of his games over two years with the same types of injuries. The track record of players at his age that overcome a degenerative condition is much shorter than those that do not.

This isn’t pessimism. It’s a realistic appraisal based on facts.

 

[fishonjazz]

I guess you missed the part where I said “in practical terms” or you didn’t understand it.

The rest is you changing your argument. He missed virtually half of his playoff games this year and has missed 1/3 of his games over two years with the same types of injuries. The track record of players at his age that overcome a degenerative condition is much shorter than those that do not.

This isn’t pessimism. It’s a realistic appraisal based on facts.

Agree to disagree. Its pessimism. Of which there has been way too much around here lately imo. It does get tiring trying to be positive on this forum though thats for sure.
Have a good one.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Agree to disagree. Its pessimism. Of which there has been way too much around here lately imo. It does get tiring trying to be positive on this forum though thats for sure.
Have a good one.

I don’t disagree with most of that. Conley could get better, but I think the wiser thing here is to keep him in styrofoam peanuts as often as possible. That’s a key reason why I’m excited about Butler.

Maybe with good enough management, Conley can defy the odds.

 

[Miggs]

Didn't you see the games played for conley part of my post. He has played in 87% of his possible playoff games. Pre jazz he played in 56 of 59 games. (95%)
Doesn't seem that bad to me.

Pre-Jazz, when was his last playoff game? Five years ago? Six?

 

[jope]

We went 15-6 (.714) with Conley injured last year.
We went 37-14 (.725) with Conley playing.

Does Conley even actually tip the scales for us? Can’t we just focus on putting Don in his natural size position at the 1 and get a defensive 2 and stop having a tiny backcourt?

 

[LoPo]

We went 15-6 (.714) with Conley injured last year.
We went 37-14 (.725) with Conley playing.

Does Conley even actually tip the scales for us? Can’t we just focus on putting Don in his natural size position at the 1 and get a defensive 2 and stop having a tiny backcourt?

And take away the series versus the 8 seed when we should win as the 1 seed.... in our two elimination series with Conley, we have a better record without Conley when we played Denver and the Clips (3-4) than we did when we played with him (2-4).

I know we have a better chance at a better seed and even beat teams in the playoffs with Conley than without him, but I think we should be looking for a S&T instead of just signing him to whatever he wants.

 

[LogGrad98]

We went 15-6 (.714) with Conley injured last year.
We went 37-14 (.725) with Conley playing.

Does Conley even actually tip the scales for us? Can’t we just focus on putting Don in his natural size position at the 1 and get a defensive 2 and stop having a tiny backcourt?

This has been my (and many others around here) argument since rumors first broke that we might be pursuing Conley 2 years ago. We are now stuck in terms of salary that makes it so Conley is just about the only place we can spend money due to bird rights. I'd rather we look at larger scale (bogey, Ingles, even Clarkson if it makes sense) trades to add perimeter defenders. It's been blatantly obvious for years that we are missing long athletic defensive-minded wings and we've done nothing to address that. Conley is a good player. I like him as a good dude and teammate. He doesn't make the difference that we really need. We need to find at least 1 solid 3&D guy we can throw at the PGs and Kawais of the league, a bigger combo guard to run with, and sometimes without, Mitchell, and we need to re-tool the bench in this same mold.

We have great regular season success because we've built a team with high-floor guys, but we have limited playoff success because those same guys largely have low ceilings. In the playoffs it's the ceilings that matter.

If all we do this off-season is draft another small guard clone and re-sign Conley, which is essentially doing the same thing and expecting different results, then in all likelihood we will get the same results.

Of course there is a chance we roll into the offseason much more healthy and we buck the odds. This year I think we would have advanced if we had been completely healthy against the clippers and we had at least a 50% chance against Phoenix. But this off-season all those teams are going to look to improve and plug the holes on their teams. If we don't do likewise then we are going to **** up maybe the best window we've ever had to win a ring.

 

[campaignist]

When it comes to a guard in their thirties, I really only care about recent injury history, maybe 2-3 years. If I’m not mistaken, most if not all of the games Conley has missed due to injury here are for the same issue, the hamstring.

There is zero evidence to say it can be resolved. At this point it needs to be viewed the way Kawhi’s chronic issue is-something you load manage and hope for the best on, but you have to live with.
It’s not going anywhere.

that’s the main reason I’d rather let him walk, hopefully I’m proven wrong

 

[MTS]

I can't help but wonder if the people suggesting we "let him walk" understand that we are capped out even if he leaves.

 

[Udidthizz]

I can't help but wonder if the people suggesting we "let him walk" understand that we are capped out even if he leaves.

Or that, barring a miracle from our rookie or FA’s signed for the minimum, we have 0% chance of winning a championship without him.