Lol OBAMA and his "liberal" democrats securing tyranny

[babe]

Actually, when you think about, with the NSA opening up their big new data center in Bluffdale, Utah, it's almost probable that dozens of their employees read JazzFanz on the regular, not necessarily as part of their job, but just as fans. Once they decide to target him it's easy enough to track down the person posting as DutchJazzer. They probably already know what he had for breakfast.

I'm sure they have a big pile of data on him. And everyone else. What they will do with it is anybody's guess. Pretty sure there's limited will and financial and personnel resources to do anything more than isolated exemplary little displays of being serviceable to the public. Forty years ago, anyone who spoke of an attack on the President would have been arrested. Being "offshore" doesn't really mean "out of reach", then or now.

I think the management of this forum should curb this kind of statement. Obama might not be my favorite "President", though he represents a continuation of the same old deteriorating respect for law in America as our Presidents have generally had since, oh, maybe Andrew Jackson, who defied the Supreme Court saying "So Marshall has ruled, now let's see him enforce his ruling", and thence sent federal troops to unconstitutional relocate law-abiding Indian tribes residing east of the Mississippi, killing tens of thousands of them with gunfire or horrendous genocidal policies. I don't think Obama has sunk to that level, exactly.

But if we want a constitutional republic we can only maintain it by respect for our constitutional law.

https://www.pbs.org/wnet/supremecourt/antebellum/landmark_cherokee.html

However, the following year the Supreme Court reversed itself and ruled that Indian tribes were indeed sovereign and immune from Georgia laws. President Jackson nonetheless refused to heed the Court’s decision. He obtained the signature of a Cherokee chief agreeing to relocation in the Treaty of New Echota, which Congress ratified against the protests of Daniel Webster and Henry Clay in 1835. The Cherokee signing party represented only a faction of the Cherokee, and the majority followed Principal Chief John Ross in a desperate attempt to hold onto their land. This attempt faltered in 1838, when, under the guns of federal troops and Georgia state militia, the Cherokee tribe were forced to the dry plains across the Mississippi. The best evidence indicates that between three and four thousand out of the fifteen to sixteen thousand Cherokees died en route from the brutal conditions of the “Trail of Tears.”

https://history.state.gov/milestones/1830-1860/indian-treaties

 

[DutchJazzer]

You guys are also forgetting Obama wants to federalize the police force.

is he really that dumb arent the FBI already kind of the federal cops? yet i cant call for his punishment for treason?
so get the fbi and local federal police.?

hahahahaha

 

[Gameface]

You guys are also forgetting Obama wants to federalize the police force.

is he really that dumb arent the FBI already kind of the federal cops? yet i cant call for his punishment for treason?
so get the fbi and local federal police.?

hahahahaha

Instead of crying treason all the time how about you explain this capital punishment worthy treason in specifics.

Many presidents have attempted to overstep their bounds, some successfully some not. None of them were executed for their efforts.
Supposedly there are checks and balances that are supposed to protect us and it's not treason for believing the presidents authority is greater than it is supposed to be. If it ess Bush junior would have been hung for it.

 

[Stoked]

D

So you're disingenuous, as well? So the fact is the Federal agencies have been asking local governments to "gear up". It might be just a sales pitch by some politicians with big campaign support from equipment manufacturers. Another fact is Federal recommendations for police training being implemented locally. Some have brought out facts of this, terming it "police militarization". I've seen it in the swagger some police have in places like Las Vegas, where arguably there is some kind of need for this, I suppose.

I said nothing about "denying police bayonets" either being a human right or a human rights violation. Human rights exist in another level of concept, which I think you lack the ability to comprehend. For those of our readers who do have some comprehension, a gun or a bayonet can be used to protect your individual rights just as well as to deny your rights. Police can protect you, and that is what their equipment is for.

I know your a cool hipster mod, and maybe a moderate republican or whatever. I welcome your comments as grist for my mill, but I would appreciate it if you could up your game a bit.

Most of my comment was about Obama's particular views. I call it disingenuous for him, after some government actions on his watch, like selling guns to drug cartels in Mexico, and stocking up our federal agencies with surplus weaponry on an unprecedented scale, to come out and talk like he's talking now. I understand there is a sort of apparent alienation of police from citizenry that is being evoked in media coverage, and it is a smart politician to put a finger to the wind and get positioned "right" with media. That's why I use the word "disingenuous" in his case. I think the word means saying things that could have a deceitful intent, or maybe it goes to just not being a genius somehow. Maybe believing something inconsistent with a lot of your other values.

Well your lengthy dissertation was in response to my post about liking the move preventing police from having bayonets. So I made a joke.

I may be disengenous but you have a tendency to be an over reactionary blow hard.

But whatever. Have fun storming the castle.

 

[babe]

D

Well your lengthy dissertation was in response to my post about liking the move preventing police from having bayonets. So I made a joke.

I may be disengenous but you have a tendency to be an over reactionary blow hard.

But whatever. Have fun storming the castle.

Looking at the actual definition of disingenuous I doubt it applies to you, except obliquely or in fairly normal ways wherein most people dodge the logical ramifications of what they've said.

I'd call your evaluation of me, personally. . . . well. . . . overstated.

 

[The Thriller]

Cops need to have bayonets in order to...

Uhhhh...

Ummmm...

 

[babe]

You guys are also forgetting Obama wants to federalize the police force.

is he really that dumb arent the FBI already kind of the federal cops? yet i cant call for his punishment for treason?
so get the fbi and local federal police.?

hahahahaha

In America, "treason" usually is invoked only in a military context, and politicians are presumed to be loyal to our country even if their ideas or actions don't logically follow some interpretations of our Constitution. We have all kinds of people calling for a new Constitutional Convention. Some want to replace it wholesale, some want to re-invent 1789. Obama has a huge federal bureaucracy behind him, most of whom harbor expansive notions of how they need more money or need to ignore some old-fashioned idea of "Law" or "Constitutional Principle". If you ride into town invoking your rhetoric, you'll be painted quickly..... if not in methods beyond words. . . . some kind of pathological nutjob. It's a favorite term used to describe someone beyond a person's comprehension. You might be Patrick Henry, or the equivalent of some other patriot, but you still need to use good sense. There's plenty of people who will not use good sense who have some few vocabulary terms they will apply without reason to someone who is not just content to move along with the herd.

You fail to have the sophistication involved in invoking due process under the law, and under the Constitution, for charging Obama, getting him Impeached by Congress, and tried. And under our system, the most we can do to a politician is remove him from office, and that requires an overwhelming public sentiment in support of doing it, otherwise our Congress or Courts will not do it.

All we need, in our system, is an election where the votes are actually counted correctly, and the people who will vote for a better President.

 

[babe]

He's not an American? Are you one of those birther nutjobs? Our are you referring to Dutch?

Dutch is not an American, by his own characterizations that I've seen.

As I understand it, Obama's father was from Kenya, his mother an American who went abroad and there is some question as to where Obama was born, but the State of Hawaii has produced a birth certificate of questionable authenticity, and a lot of people asking questions have been called names like "nutjob" by people as ignorant as you are. I sometimes pride myself that I don't degrade people who have questions, or dissimilar views, and I view people, like Mods in here, who do blithely degrade people with epithets like "nutjob", as being questionably within JazzFanz standards. But then I do the same thing sometimes when being "silly". However, at some fundamental level even if I don't live up it rhetorically, I do think people should have my respect. I might not agree with opinions, and values, but it is an exercise of mine in discussion to lay out some issue and see what people will say. I do that with a view to moving on in some respect to some better idea. I don't know why Obama didn't have to present a birth certificate anywhere when he filed as a candidate for President of the United States. I believe that children born to American Citizen parents, as particularly evident when the mother is a US Citizen, abroad, are US citizens, anyway. Even if the parents are Marxist ideologues. If I run for President, I will publish my birth certificate with pride, and never dodge a single stupid question about it.

I thought I was clear enough in discussing why Dutch might not be subject to US law, to say he (Dutch) is not a US citizen.

 

[babe]

Cops need to have bayonets in order to...

Uhhhh...

Ummmm...

I want the cop who's defending me to have the tools he needs. I think the term is proportionate response. When a mob is moving down the street torching businesses and homes, I want the police to use effective tools that can really just convince the mob to stop the burning and looting.

I probably don't want officers passing out speeding tickets to be commandos with military weapons, grenades or even fixed bayonets, and if some officer comes onto my property with weapons like that, and no warrant, and no reasonable explanation, well, that strikes me as "over the top" like some rhetoric. I might think the officer is a nutjob, but I won't use that term in that situation.

 

[DutchJazzer]

In America, "treason" usually is invoked only in a military context, and politicians are presumed to be loyal to our country even if their ideas or actions don't logically follow some interpretations of our Constitution. We have all kinds of people calling for a new Constitutional Convention. Some want to replace it wholesale, some want to re-invent 1789. Obama has a huge federal bureaucracy behind him, most of whom harbor expansive notions of how they need more money or need to ignore some old-fashioned idea of "Law" or "Constitutional Principle". If you ride into town invoking your rhetoric, you'll be painted quickly..... if not in methods beyond words. . . . some kind of pathological nutjob. It's a favorite term used to describe someone beyond a person's comprehension. You might be Patrick Henry, or the equivalent of some other patriot, but you still need to use good sense. There's plenty of people who will not use good sense who have some few vocabulary terms they will apply without reason to someone who is not just content to move along with the herd.

You fail to have the sophistication involved in invoking due process under the law, and under the Constitution, for charging Obama, getting him Impeached by Congress, and tried. And under our system, the most we can do to a politician is remove him from office, and that requires an overwhelming public sentiment in support of doing it, otherwise our Congress or Courts will not do it.

All we need, in our system, is an election where the votes are actually counted correctly, and the people who will vote for a better President.

USUALLY, but it can be aplied to any citizen even politicians and the president.

Title 18 U.S. Code, Section 2381 further defines “treason” as:

Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

we can debate and argue whether obeezy does the above

 

[babe]

USUALLY, but it can be aplied to any citizen even politicians and the president.

So here's the problem we have. We can't just hang half the people in this country calling it "Treason".

I don't want another Civil War. I just think it's time for some of us to respond to propaganda the phony socialists and phony commies and servile statists have been running through our education system. John Dewey from a century ago with the idea that the State should train people to be good workers for the corporate interests. Obedient to the managerial class of bureaucrats with all their wonderful little delusions of good public order under their control. It's time we let freedom ring again.

Where'd Dal and Siro go, anyway. I've been hoping to win them over to the idea of competitive thinking and competitive management where people get to try stuff that's not just "off the shelf" of old ideas approved because they're convenient to the fascist megalomaniacal UN/NWO groupies.

But don't rhetorically omit the due process rights of even a tyrant. If we lose our human rights we lose everything.

 

[babe]

So here's the problem we have. We can't just hang half the people in this country calling it "Treason".

I don't want another Civil War. I just think it's time for some of us to respond to propaganda the phony socialists and phony commies and servile statists have been running through our education system. John Dewey from a century ago with the idea that the State should train people to be good workers for the corporate interests. Obedient to the managerial class of bureaucrats with all their wonderful little delusions of good public order under their control. It's time we let freedom ring again.

Where'd Dal and Siro go, anyway. I've been hoping to win them over to the idea of competitive thinking and competitive management where people get to try stuff that's not just "off the shelf" of old ideas approved because they're convenient to the fascist megalomaniacal UN/NWO groupies.

But don't rhetorically omit the due process rights of even a tyrant. If we lose our human rights we lose everything.

Well, humans never do really lose their rights. When rights are denied by government, the government loses its legitimacy, and, well, someday people will tire of a tyrant for whatever reason. Soldiers will tire of tyrants, too. When government gets bad enough, it will fall like every government eventually has fallen.

 

[Cappy_Smurf]

Dutch is not an American, by his own characterizations that I've seen.

As I understand it, Obama's father was from Kenya, his mother an American who went abroad and there is some question as to where Obama was born, but the State of Hawaii has produced a birth certificate of questionable authenticity, and a lot of people asking questions have been called names like "nutjob" by people as ignorant as you are. I sometimes pride myself that I don't degrade people who have questions, or dissimilar views, and I view people, like Mods in here, who do blithely degrade people with epithets like "nutjob", as being questionably within JazzFanz standards. But then I do the same thing sometimes when being "silly". However, at some fundamental level even if I don't live up it rhetorically, I do think people should have my respect. I might not agree with opinions, and values, but it is an exercise of mine in discussion to lay out some issue and see what people will say. I do that with a view to moving on in some respect to some better idea. I don't know why Obama didn't have to present a birth certificate anywhere when he filed as a candidate for President of the United States. I believe that children born to American Citizen parents, as particularly evident when the mother is a US Citizen, abroad, are US citizens, anyway. Even if the parents are Marxist ideologues. If I run for President, I will publish my birth certificate with pride, and never dodge a single stupid question about it.

I thought I was clear enough in discussing why Dutch might not be subject to US law, to say he (Dutch) is not a US citizen.

It's ok to question whether or not Obama is an American citizen, but some people became irrationally obsessed with it to the degree that nut job would be a fitting label. I don't think asking if you are one of those people is necessarily the same as calling you one.

 

[babe]

It's ok to question whether or not Obama is an American citizen, but some people became irrationally obsessed with it to the degree that nut job would be a fitting label. I don't think asking if you are one of those people is necessarily the same as calling you one.

The Constitution is interpreted by some according to the ordinary meaning of ordinary words, to require that the President must not only be a citizen of the US, but one born on US soil. The issue of location of birth was important to early American thinkers because of their experience with Great Britain and a lot of Tory folks, which in their minds required some precaution to ensure that our President has no conflicting loyalties.

today we have a lot of people who literally believe that the future of the world is best placed in the hands of a world government, and in fact we have a huge contingent of our citizens who think "globally". Most don't really care about the US Constitution. We even have Supreme Court Justices today who will look to other nations' laws for "relevant" considerations in their rulings.

So, like I said, we don't really want to hang all the Americans who believe that way. But it is a pretty ignorant world view. People will not have better lives under "management", and the reality will not be the dream. Anyone who will begin to ask questions will reject it, if they actually care about the outcomes. Most of the folks who believe in the dream will reject it when they realize the false premises of "management".

real human rights that governments can't suppress or deny are the mainsprings of human creativity and progress. Human liberty is no dream. It is the ultimate fact of life.

 

[The Thriller]

I want the cop who's defending me to have the tools he needs. I think the term is proportionate response. When a mob is moving down the street torching businesses and homes, I want the police to use effective tools that can really just convince the mob to stop the burning and looting.

I probably don't want officers passing out speeding tickets to be commandos with military weapons, grenades or even fixed bayonets, and if some officer comes onto my property with weapons like that, and no warrant, and no reasonable explanation, well, that strikes me as "over the top" like some rhetoric. I might think the officer is a nutjob, but I won't use that term in that situation.

I want a specific situation where cops need bayonets to do their jobs.

 

[babe]

I want a specific situation where cops need bayonets to do their jobs.

I sorta get it that you're all hot about the cops or something. I've had drunks with knives attack me, and drunks with deer rifles, too. I've had thieves break and enter into my home, as well. I've been on the street when some rioters overturned some buses and set them afire. I pay good money so the local government can protect my life and my property, and I expect them to do the job. If it's a mob with broken bottles coming at them, slashing at them, I'd say a bayonet would answer the need. A long knife can make peace, bro.

For that matter, with the chicken**** mayor and cops of Baltimore, for example, I think I need to augment my own tools.

It's a clear-cut case of fraud for a city to tax you for police, and not defend you or your rights.

 

[Harambe]

cancer is a big bucket of specific medical conditions which share one generalized negative outcome, that being a runaway tissue growth depleting nutritional reserves and damaging vital organ or tissue functions incompatible with life. I wouldn't call him disingenuous if he did something he actually believed in doing, for principles he actually supports, and gained his intended objective. I think it takes a certain habit of indirectness to be "disingenuous".

Some folks complain that he actually did so some things he promised to do, others find some huge issues where he did the opposite of what he promised.

According Marxist principles, any deception that furthers "the cause" is justifiable, in terms defined by supporters of "the cause", or the belief system. A lot of adherents have made liberal use of this priority in values.

Buddy, your understanding of the "noble lie" is disingenuous. Marx just ripped it off of someone else...

Enter: PLATO!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_lie

So if Obama is a "big fat liar", as you see it, I encourage you to call him a Republican[in it's very truest sense], not a Marxist.

 

[Stoked]

Buddy, your understanding of the "noble lie" is disingenuous. Marx just ripped it off of someone else...

Enter: PLATO!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_lie

So if Obama is a "big fat liar", as you see it, I encourage you to call him a Republican[in it's very truest sense], not a Marxist.

hahahahahaha

 

[Harambe]

hahahahahaha

Right?

The funny thing here is when I read the line about "any deception blah blah blah", it transported me to the first season of Trailer Park boys where bubbles had to explain it to Julian.

 

[babe]

Buddy, your understanding of the "noble lie" is disingenuous. Marx just ripped it off of someone else...

Enter: PLATO!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_lie

So if Obama is a "big fat liar", as you see it, I encourage you to call him a Republican[in it's very truest sense], not a Marxist.

JF Forums wouldn't let me rep this. You are right. McConnell knows you're right. Boehner knows you're right.