Obese Missionaries Need Not Apply

[LogGrad98]

The sign said "Obese Missionaries Need Not Apply".

Ok actually, it was a question on the online questionnaire we were filling out for my daughter to put in her "papers" to get her mission call. It asked if you are obese. She clicked yes and it immediately gave her a message that said she would have to lose weight to serve a mission. We have had missionaries over for dinner nearly monthly for most of our marriage (over 20 years), and especially recently, and have had more than a few that would be termed morbidly obese. So, are they setting up kids to lie to go on their missions? Or do they just want young thin people representing the church? What is the reasoning behind this, any ideas?

 

[8]

Pretty odd. I can't think of any reasons that aren't incredibly shallow.

 

[cowhide]

The sign said "Obese Missionaries Need Not Apply".

Ok actually, it was a question on the online questionnaire we were filling out for my daughter to put in her "papers" to get her mission call. It asked if you are obese. She clicked yes and it immediately gave her a message that said she would have to lose weight to serve a mission. We have had missionaries over for dinner nearly monthly for most of our marriage (over 20 years), and especially recently, and have had more than a few that would be termed morbidly obese. So, are they setting up kids to lie to go on their missions? Or do they just want young thin people representing the church? What is the reasoning behind this, any ideas?

It is called marketing. It would be interesting to see if this question was asked to the males too.

 

[colton]

The sign said "Obese Missionaries Need Not Apply".

Ok actually, it was a question on the online questionnaire we were filling out for my daughter to put in her "papers" to get her mission call. It asked if you are obese. She clicked yes and it immediately gave her a message that said she would have to lose weight to serve a mission. We have had missionaries over for dinner nearly monthly for most of our marriage (over 20 years), and especially recently, and have had more than a few that would be termed morbidly obese. So, are they setting up kids to lie to go on their missions? Or do they just want young thin people representing the church? What is the reasoning behind this, any ideas?

I'm sure it's out of concern that she wouldn't be able to hold up to the physical rigors that most missions demand. (I'm not saying that she couldn't, I'm saying that's very likely the concern by the missionary dept that led to this question.) For example, Elder Perry's "Raising the Bar" G.C. talk in 2007 said this:

The minimum physical standard for full-time missionary service refers to a potential missionary’s physical health and strength. For example, one of the questions on the missionary recommendation forms asks if you “can work 12 to 15 hours per day, walk 6 to 8 miles per day, ride a bicycle 10 to 15 miles per day, and climb stairs daily.” Missionary work is hard, and full-time missionaries must be in good physical condition to serve. Raising the bar to a higher physical standard could involve further physical conditioning.

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2007/10/raising-the-bar?lang=eng

Here's a blog article from Jan 2008 that I found, discussing the topic:
https://mormonmission.blogspot.com/2008/04/higher-physical-requirements-for-lds.html

This might be the most relevant part of the article:

Missionary candidates need to work on physical conditioning prior to serving a mission. In March 2007 Donald B. Doty, Chairman of the Missionary Health Department said:

"Physical and mental preparation should begin at least two years before a full-time mission.

During 35 years of practice as a cardiovascular and thoracic surgeon, I performed thousands of operations on the heart. After cardiac surgery, patients would often ask me how they could prevent future surgery. And even if they didn’t ask, I felt obligated to advise them anyway. I would talk to them about the importance of a healthy diet, appropriate weight, aerobic exercise, adequate rest, and stress reduction. Those who acted on my advice were generally blessed with years of comfortable living. Many of those who lacked the resolve to make the necessary lifestyle changes had to face the surgical knife again—often sooner rather than later."

He goes on to say:

"Regular (daily) exercise. A missionary must be able to walk an average of six miles (10 km) per day and ride a bicycle 12 miles (19 km) per day. Prospective missionaries who aren’t walking more than from the car to a class or a job will likely get sore feet and blisters when they reach the mission field. Those who are not used to riding a bicycle regularly will also become very “saddle sore” when a bike becomes their primary means of transportation. A missionary who is out of shape will be fatigued by missionary work, and a tired missionary is more open to discouragement and health concerns than a missionary who is physically fit.

Prospective missionaries can prepare for the rigors of missionary life by establishing a regular pattern of aerobic exercise—walking, running, or cycling for one hour every day. Those whose primary form of exercise is playing electronic games or text messaging will take at least four months to achieve the level of conditioning that will allow them to actually enjoy a workout."

A few potential missionary candidates can not meet this standard even after trying and several won't put in the effort suggested. Doty says "Today about 3 percent of missionaries have their missions shortened by either physical or mental health problems. Losing 3 out of 100 missionaries may not seem like very many. But to the individual and his or her family, it is very significant."

The standard according to Doty is "that missionaries have a body mass index no higher than 37. This is actually on the border between obesity and morbid obesity. Prospective missionaries should strive to keep their weight in the normal range, thereby avoiding obesity-related health problems. Being markedly under normal weight can also have serious health consequences."
...
Those who cannot meet the standard are considered honorably excused from a regular proselyting mission. They can serve in other ways back in their home communities on service missions. LDS families need to consider the impact of lifestyle choices well in advance of a child serving. It is very disappointing to not serve a mission due to the fact you might have ate too much fast food or spent your life playing video games or watched too much television.

If I applied for a mission today at my current weight I would be turned down for not just obesity but for morbid obesity. I don't criticize those who can't meet the standard. I think if you can handle the work but your body mass isn't low enough you should still apply I am sure they consider every missionary's situation in making a determination. My dear departed father used to say "They can only say no."

 

[bigb]

That info Colton was providing was spot on for me. I was walking a minimum of six miles per day (probably much more than that, and in my last area, it would be considered more like "hiking") in the mission field, although I never once got on a bike. I've been pretty overweight my entire life and actually lost a bunch of weight on my mission. The physical part never really wore me down though as I was working a very physical job up until the day before I entered the MTC.

 

[moevillini]

The question Cowhide asked is interesting. Shoul be easy to answer though.

Log, or anybody - is this a standard, general online application used by all genders or are young men and women directed to separate forms?

And would the application be different depending on your "home base"?

I can see why there would be definite health concerns given the high level of physical activity and the sometimes remote areas why they may serve. Do they ask about other health issues or make you pass a physical before you go?

 

[Stoked]

I'd say health reasons. Especially depending on where you are sent. BigB s experience is the same as mine. I walked several miles a day in very hot weather. Often up mountain roads. Very demanding.

 

[Duck Rodgers]

Probably plenty of people that should be thankful they are forcing them to trim. 37 BMI is still pretty beastly though, so it seems like they give you a lot of leeway.

 

[green]

My guess is the Church is spending way too much money taking care of missionaries who get sick due to obesity issues, which includes having to send someone home early, train a replacement, move missionaries around, etc.

Something I have always found funny living in Utah, is the Word of Wisdom condones obesity, smoking, drinking, coffee, etc...yet we only with hold temple recommends for smoking, drinking, coffee. For some reason, it is okay to be obese, but not to smoke. I dunno, maybe I skipped the scripture that said some things were worse than others.

 

[colton]

The question Cowhide asked is interesting. Shoul be easy to answer though.

Log, or anybody - is this a standard, general online application used by all genders or are young men and women directed to separate forms?

I haven't filled out an application since I myself was preparing for a mission (1989), so I don't know what the current forms are like. But I would be surprised if there were separate application forms for males and females.

And would the application be different depending on your "home base"?

I think all of the applications (regardless of place of origin) get sent to the same place (church missionary committee) for assignments, so I would expect them to all be the same basic application. However country of origin certainly would affect things like visas, so perhaps there are some subtle differences.

I can see why there would be definite health concerns given the high level of physical activity and the sometimes remote areas why they may serve. Do they ask about other health issues or make you pass a physical before you go?

Yes, you do have to have a physical before you go. And a general health questionnaire is very likely part of that. At least I'm pretty sure that was the case back in 1989 and I don't see why they would have changed that.

 

[Gameface]

My guess is the Church is spending way too much money taking care of missionaries who get sick due to obesity issues, which includes having to send someone home early, train a replacement, move missionaries around, etc.

Something I have always found funny living in Utah, is the Word of Wisdom condones obesity, smoking, drinking, coffee, etc...yet we only with hold temple recommends for smoking, drinking, coffee. For some reason, it is okay to be obese, but not to smoke. I dunno, maybe I skipped the scripture that said some things were worse than others.

I don't think condone means what you think it means.

 

[green]

I don't think condone means what you think it means.

yeah. It's opposite day.

 

[Gameface]

yeah. It's opposite day.

Wait, does that mean it's actually not opposite day?

 

[b_line]

The sign said "Obese Missionaries Need Not Apply".

Ok actually, it was a question on the online questionnaire we were filling out for my daughter to put in her "papers" to get her mission call. It asked if you are obese. She clicked yes and it immediately gave her a message that said she would have to lose weight to serve a mission. We have had missionaries over for dinner nearly monthly for most of our marriage (over 20 years), and especially recently, and have had more than a few that would be termed morbidly obese. So, are they setting up kids to lie to go on their missions? Or do they just want young thin people representing the church? What is the reasoning behind this, any ideas?

I knew a kid on my mission that had to lose 100+ pounds to go on a mission, and was still the biggest kid on the mission. He must have been over 400 pounds. I also had a companion that was like 5'8" and 350 at the start of his mission. Maybe the rules have changed a bit since I was out there. I thought before, it was purely health concerns that drove the weight loss thing, you know, not wanting kids out there having heart attacks after they ride their bike for like 40 miles a day. When I did my papers, they had a height/weight requirement that we had to follow. It was pretty liberal back then, like 11 years ago.

 

[LogGrad98]

I have many concerns about this, not the least of which is the pressure it could put kids under to lie on the application to skirt this "requirement". I know my daughter feels she can perform the duties necessary, and she has been working on her conditioning, but the BMI is a very out-dated and poor reflection of physical conditioning and still shows she is morbidly obese, when, not to be too revealing or inappropriate, she is a 5'4" and a 32 triple F bust size and probably carries around enough weight in her breasts to push her over the BMI limits regardless of her actual body fat content. She did the right thing and indicated that according to their standard she is obese, and that is probably accurate in any case, but she was very tempted to tweak the numbers to avoid this as an issue and delay her going on her mission.

When I went on my mission, also in 1989 (not sure if colton wants this to get out, or even remembers, but we went into the MTC at the same time going to the same mission, but in different MTC districts), I was definitely overweight, at just under 6'2" and about 280 lbs. I came home at nearly 6'3" and 215 pounds, so physically the mission did me good. But even at my weight beforehand I had always been in pretty good shape, having played 3 sports and still remaining very active in basketball and other sports (played competitive racquetball for a while), so I had no problem keeping up, but I would definitely not have met the "specs" to go on the current application form.

I also can understand wanting to raise the bar, and ideally that would be the case that kids are preparing for their mission from the time they are 16. But I know from my own experience, and now with 3 of my kids having moved through these years, that this is a rough time for kids. Things change rapidly. Their hormonal changes can spur great changes in attitude, behavior, feelings, everything. I didn't make the decision to go until the month before I put in my papers. My daughter wanted to go, but had a high school sweetheart that she thought she would marry, so she had her mind and heart set on that first, a mission second. Now it worked out differently and she wants to serve a mission, but isn't as prepared as she could have been. Some of the best missionaries I knew were last-second deciders. I just wonder how many kids they are alienating if they make this process any more difficult.

But I guess that is another good question, should it be difficult, at the risk of pushing some kids away. Is "losing" some kids worth it to make sure the kids that go are the best they can be? Is it a winnowing process in which the ones who just "can't hang" are weeded out so they don't taint the field later?

Seems counter to the mission of the church to me, which most succinctly stated would be "to bring about the immortality and eternal life of man". Wouldn't that mean equal opportunity for all, and not just those that are lucky enough to be in good shape, or are able to get things straight for themselves years ahead of time during what for most kids is a pretty chaotic time in their lives? I find that just a little disturbing. Admissions requirements for BYU is one thing, space is limited. The church has neither limited space, nor limited funds when it comes right down to it, when it comes to missionary service, and anyone who feels the spirit prompt them to serve should be given that chance, shouldn't they? Regardless of concerns about financial liability.

Either it is governed by revelation, both personal and by proxy say through a bishop, or it is regulated by regulations. I don't see the 2 coexisting very harmoniously when the decision is such a personal thing and not some over-arching canonical teaching.

 

[green]

I bet you 100% that this is a money issue. It's the same reason why the church wants you to get your wisdom teeth out before you leave on your mission. If they are gone, the church won't have to pay for any issues that might arise from problems caused by wisdom teeth.

It's the same reason that the articles of faith talk about obeying the laws of the land, yet the church has not problem putting felons (illegal aliens) in positions of authority and giving those people temple recommends.

My mission president would always tell me that decisions/callings/etc are always dictated by inspiration or desperation. The point is, it is not always black and white. The Church makes exceptions to a lot of things that we are told is black and white (like breaking the law and the word of wisdom) and there is always a "but".

Just know that we are all imperfect people (me more than most), and the church is true and the church is trying to deal with all of us. Sometimes is is confusing or looks shady. That is where your testimony carries you through, and you realize that you do what you have to do and let God sort out all this other garbage.

 

[b_line]

I bet you 100% that this is a money issue. It's the same reason why the church wants you to get your wisdom teeth out before you leave on your mission. If they are gone, the church won't have to pay for any issues that might arise from problems caused by wisdom teeth.

It's the same reason that the articles of faith talk about obeying the laws of the land, yet the church has not problem putting felons (illegal aliens) in positions of authority and giving those people temple recommends.

My mission president would always tell me that decisions/callings/etc are always dictated by inspiration or desperation. The point is, it is not always black and white. The Church makes exceptions to a lot of things that we are told is black and white (like breaking the law and the word of wisdom) and there is always a "but".

Just know that we are all imperfect people (me more than most), and the church is true and the church is trying to deal with all of us. Sometimes is is confusing or looks shady. That is where your testimony carries you through, and you realize that you do what you have to do and let God sort out all this other garbage.

I think the money issue is more complicated than "the church does not want to pay for it." What about the kids from Mexico or the Philippines that can barely afford to go on a mission, who will have to pay more if the cost goes up due to medical costs? The church has kept the cost of missions down by subsidizing it with tithing and the missionary fund, but kids and parents will still have to pay some of the cost. I just don't believe that the church is callously saying "it comes down to economics, and we aren't paying for the chubby's.

That said, what about in the D&C where it says "if ye have desires to serve god, ye are called to the work..."? I hate that there are kids who have such a strong desire to serve a mission that never get to go. I have personal experience with this, because my bishop when I was 19 was way too strict. He didn't let any of the kids my age go on missions, for one reason or another, so we all had to wait until he was released a few months later, and then went when the new bishop asked us all to go. The first guy was crazy. He wouldn't let kids go on missions if they had fought with their parents in the last six months. Not even bad stuff, the guy just thought we should all be perfect in order to be missionaries.

Log Bro, I hope your daughter gets to go on a mission, it is a great experience, as you probably know. And hopefully her experiencing the adversity of trying to be able to go will make her a better, more sympathetic person.

 

[LogGrad98]

Thanks b. I am sure we will get her there. The bishop here is very excited for the youth to serve and he has been great. She is working through all the current requirements, including a new one to me that they serve in the temple before they go. Not sure if that is a local thing or a church-wide thing, but she will be a temple worker for a month or so while waiting for her call, and she is really excited about that. I think that is a good idea. I went through the temple all of once before I went on my mission and it kind of left a funny taste in my mouth since it was before they changed it to exclude certain, let's just say unsavory, parts.

 

[b_line]

Thanks b. I am sure we will get her there. The bishop here is very excited for the youth to serve and he has been great. She is working through all the current requirements, including a new one to me that they serve in the temple before they go. Not sure if that is a local thing or a church-wide thing, but she will be a temple worker for a month or so while waiting for her call, and she is really excited about that. I think that is a good idea. I went through the temple all of once before I went on my mission and it kind of left a funny taste in my mouth since it was before they changed it to exclude certain, let's just say unsavory, parts.

That temple requirement is new to me. seems like a good idea though. I felt the same way as you about the temple going into my mission. It is good that you have a good bishop that actually cares about the people, it seems. That is the only thing that makes the church have any truth, imo.

 

[The Thriller]

I had a friend in high school who was 380 lbs. He put in his mission papers (back when they used papers and not an electronic system) and received a letter from church HQ saying that he needed to lose like 100 lbs and reapply. He did so... And was called to Brasilia in Brazil. He then lost another 100 lbs while serving. He came back a far better man both spiritually and physically. There was no chance in hell he could have served at nearly 400 lbs. Just fitting into the airplane for the 15 hr flight would have been challenging.

Missions are extremely physically demanding. Not necessarily on a day sprint basis. I played 3 sports in HS so to me nothing was worse than hell week in 2001 (record setting temperatures in Aug). However, 13-14 months into the mission I really began to feel it in my hips, ankles, knees, and back. I was only 170 lbs too. But walking up and down those hills 4-8 miles per day in Brazil while carrying mission materials was really taxing. There's no way I could have done that weighing double what I did. No way.

So I think most of the concern is for the well-being of the missionaries. However, there probably is a concern appearance. I know that recently at the MTC in Provo they've set up make-up and hair classes for the sisters. I don't know how extensive they are. I'm pretty sure they're more on the basics of how to make yourself look good despite living on a missionary's budget, timetable, and/or living in a 3rd world country.

I would say an irony I do see in the church was what Green brought up a few posts ago... The Word of Wisdom is all about controlling your passions and living "wisely." Obesity is prevalent in leadership positions (both male and female). Part of it is genetics. Part of it is just stress and the busy lifestyle. Part of it probably is due to falling into the passion of eating crap and not working out.