Game Thread Oct 08, 2023 07:00PM MT: Jazz at Clippers (Preseason)

[fishonjazz]

1 - 0 bitches. 1st place

 

[HermanG]

Well this gamethread was obnoxious. Good job @Saint Cy of JFC. Burning the boards all in sake of defending your takes.

For the game itself, its hard to react to a preseason game without overreacting so I wont do my usual longer review.... but three things I want to note:
- I think this game didnt take us much closer to determining who the starters will be or who pairs up really well, apart from the pair mentioned in the next point.
- Even if we don't end up starting Dunn I feel really good about the Dunn/Keyonte pairing coming off the bench. They seemed to mesh well and will spearhead a really good 2nd unit.
- Yurtseven looked like he could be a solid backup C and I think he played very composed and rebounded well. Samanic also deserves a roster spot.

 

[Revolution 9]

My Thoughts.

Dunn: Game changer. As soon as he came in it looked like we were running an actual offense. Smooth, confident, and his defense was awesome.

Sexton: YIKES. I'm not that worried about the missed shots, those shots will come, but he cannot run an offense. Watching him run the offense
felt like getting my teeth pulled at the dentist.

THT: Started off red hot then fell off a cliff. He cannot run an offense either. I'm okay with him as the off guard playing more of a scoring role, but
I just dont see a lot more that someone who has some hot games now, and again. He just isnt consistent.

Omer: I liked what I saw! He played under control. Can finish good. He isn't a great defender but hes a good rebounder. I would be happy with him as our
backup C.

Kessler: Just awesome as always. The blocking machine. When he wasn't blocking shots he was affecting them. Had a couple of forced offensive moves in the paint, but
overall he looked gooood.

Ochai: His inside offensive game is nice. Slashing. Driving. His shot was falling tonight, but he made up for it with his other offensive. He looked solid!

Hendricks: Finally we get to see him! His size, and speed look good in the flesh. He is going to be a nice rebounder, and defender. He hit his first shot which
was tough, and little forced, but missed the new few. Really wanted him to hit that 3 point shot off a nice pass from Keyonte.

Keyonte: SLOW DOWN SON. Jesus he looked spazzy, and forced a lot. But he did have some good passes. He was confident, and aggressive. A little too aggressive.
He will be fine, but he was way too hyped for this game.

Luka: Played solid, and had some nice baskets in clutch time. Looks like a rotation player.

Those are the things that really stood out. MY biggest takeaway from the game is we need a PG. Dunn was by far the best tonight. Sexton is going to get traded.
I just don't see it. Love his aggression, and energy but he is a MESS on offense.

 

[Tremendous Upside]

Finally it's time to overreact. Let's go.

- Everyone looked exactly the same as last season (except Clarkson, who looked like my dad when he tried going up for a dunk). That's somewhat disappointing since this is such a young team. You'd like to see at least a hint of some new/improved skills, particularly in preseason when it's still time to experiment.

- The people who are saying Kessler could average 13ppg are dreaming. His FT shooting is still atrocious and he didn't even look at the basket unless he was right next to it. In preseason he's playing against all kinds of tryhards who guard him like he's Steph Curry, but once the reg season starts, he's going to kill the offense when he floats to the corner and the other team happily ignores him. His fit with Collins is terrible. Defensively though, it was business as usual. It's the preseason effect again - people were going at Kessler under the hoop like they'd never heard about him. That won't last.

- It's hilarious how well Keyonte fits into our current guard rotation. Quick, dribble-happy dude whose first instinct is to look for his own shot... and who can't/wont defend. It makes absolutely no sense that we have like 7 of these guys on the roster right now. Someone has to go.

- Collins is such a tough fit. He's essentially an extremely undersized rim-running center who can't guard his own position. He has zero ballhandling, so unless he shows us he's able to make spot up 3's at a respectable clip, integrating him into the offense will be a real head-scratcher. He never looked like he knew what was expected of him or what he should be doing. Forcing the ball to him on a wing post-up is such a bad idea. He has no advantage there.

- All in all we looked like a team that has zero idea of what kind of basketball it should be playing.

 

[FrenchJazzFa]

Quite a good resume. Definitly Dunn should start with JC. THT and Keyonte coming from the bench. Trading Sexton if opportunity is probably not a bad idea.

 

[Revolution 9]

Is it too late to make that Jrue Holiday trade?

I'd love it if we had a real PG, and Dunn would be an A+ back up,

I want nothing to do with THT or Sexton. They have zero idea how to run an offense.

 

[jaytulao]

....and that's why coach started with the 2 guards in this game. it's pre-season folks

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I’m admitting that you are that annoying…

Go back and read your posts. When THT started hot and Sexton slow it was like the happiest moment of your life. You have problems. I don’t know what Sexton did to you, but surely a professional could help you.

You don’t like + / -… how about fg%…. How about assist to turnover ratio… wait… that’s right; you are the eyeball guy, right? No stat can dissuade you that THT is the greatest player to ever live and Sexton should be out of the NBA. And if anyone disagrees with you, or provides stats to disprove you; well, here come the insults.

It just gets old that every thread has to be the same crap every time.

Lmao

 

[Tremendous Upside]

Is it too late to make that Jrue Holiday trade?

I'd love it if we had a real PG, and Dunn would be an A+ back up,

I want nothing to do with THT or Sexton. They have zero idea how to run an offense.

If we go into the season with this revolving doors system in the backcourt, it won't be pretty. We have a whole slew of backup combo guards taking turns to pretend they're starting PG's. You can't win when the most important positions in the game are constantly in flux.

 

[HermanG]

My Thoughts.

Dunn: Game changer. As soon as he came in it looked like we were running an actual offense. Smooth, confident, and his defense was awesome.

Sexton: YIKES. I'm not that worried about the missed shots, those shots will come, but he cannot run an offense. Watching him run the offense
felt like getting my teeth pulled at the dentist.

THT: Started off red hot then fell off a cliff. He cannot run an offense either. I'm okay with him as the off guard playing more of a scoring role, but
I just dont see a lot more that someone who has some hot games now, and again. He just isnt consistent.

Omer: I liked what I saw! He played under control. Can finish good. He isn't a great defender but hes a good rebounder. I would be happy with him as our
backup C.

Kessler: Just awesome as always. The blocking machine. When he wasn't blocking shots he was affecting them. Had a couple of forced offensive moves in the paint, but
overall he looked gooood.

Ochai: His inside offensive game is nice. Slashing. Driving. His shot was falling tonight, but he made up for it with his other offensive. He looked solid!

Hendricks: Finally we get to see him! His size, and speed look good in the flesh. He is going to be a nice rebounder, and defender. He hit his first shot which
was tough, and little forced, but missed the new few. Really wanted him to hit that 3 point shot off a nice pass from Keyonte.

Keyonte: SLOW DOWN SON. Jesus he looked spazzy, and forced a lot. But he did have some good passes. He was confident, and aggressive. A little too aggressive.
He will be fine, but he was way too hyped for this game.

Luka: Played solid, and had some nice baskets in clutch time. Looks like a rotation player.

Those are the things that really stood out. MY biggest takeaway from the game is we need a PG. Dunn was by far the best tonight. Sexton is going to get traded.
I just don't see it. Love his aggression, and energy but he is a MESS on offense.

Good analysis. I agree with pretty much everything.

I think Keyonte and Hendricks had some nervousness that showed. Especially early on in their minutes Keyonte was spazzy and Hendricks looked timid. But thats like almost every rookie ever. Keyonte wasnt afraid to try and make plays so I think he is the one who picks it up faster. Hendricks probably needs another level of aggressiveness to him to unlock his potential.

Hopefully we run out another guard combo with the FC starters in the next preseason game.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Anyone who thinks THT played poorly is bonkers.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Is it too late to make that Jrue Holiday trade?

I'd love it if we had a real PG, and Dunn would be an A+ back up,

I want nothing to do with THT or Sexton. They have zero idea how to run an offense.

Hilarious that we are deciding off one preseason game against a team with elite on ball defenders that our guards can't run an offense

 

[Keefe]

Anyone who thinks THT played poorly is bonkers.

Worst +/- on the team last night. Kid’s a trainwreck.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I know the thought with Hardy is we don’t need a pg… but after a year of THT, Sexton, JC being heavily involved in the playmaking I think he may change his mind lol.

Clips defense is going to be great when healthy. They are a tough measuring stick early but a great team to play preseason.

Everything was super sloppy so all the timing stuff coming off DHO and offball screens was bad.

THT is like my oldest daughter… there’s a lot of good there but there is just so much extra… like he can’t help himself… if he’s in the game there will be so much THT. Just dial back the extra by 25%. THT/Sexton might be the worst backcourt pairing to put with the starters. Not sure what the thought is there.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

We just have too many things going on. John Collins was completely unnecessary… we have 3 guards who are good as sixth men but that’s their ideal role. We have lots of projects, rookies, etc and will have to prioritize well or we in trouble.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I know the thought with Hardy is we don’t need a pg… but after a year of THT, Sexton, JC being heavily involved in the playmaking I think he may change his mind lol.

Clips defense is going to be great when healthy. They are a tough measuring stick early but a great team to play preseason.

Everything was super sloppy so all the timing stuff coming off DHO and offball screens was bad.

THT is like my oldest daughter… there’s a lot of good there but there is just so much extra… like he can’t help himself… if he’s in the game there will be so much THT. Just dial back the extra by 25%. THT/Sexton might be the worst backcourt pairing to put with the starters. Not sure what the thought is there.

I didn't think he had much extra
He missed two bunnies he should haveade, but he didn't do anything wild out there.

I thought he played under control for the most part. The issue was just incorporating Collins and the Clips defense. It was a good early test.

Sextons defense is the biggest issue. Then again, the Clippers are a great team at exploiting his defensive weakness,so it might not be as bad against most teams

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Fontecchio could probably be removed from the 10 man rotation to make room for Dunn. You'd be going smaller, but it might be better. I just dont think Fontecchio adds much, even if he is shooting it well.

 

[Release the Kraken]

Finally it's time to overreact. Let's go.

- Everyone looked exactly the same as last season (except Clarkson, who looked like my dad when he tried going up for a dunk). That's somewhat disappointing since this is such a young team. You'd like to see at least a hint of some new/improved skills, particularly in preseason when it's still time to experiment.

- The people who are saying Kessler could average 13ppg are dreaming. His FT shooting is still atrocious and he didn't even look at the basket unless he was right next to it. In preseason he's playing against all kinds of tryhards who guard him like he's Steph Curry, but once the reg season starts, he's going to kill the offense when he floats to the corner and the other team happily ignores him. His fit with Collins is terrible. Defensively though, it was business as usual. It's the preseason effect again - people were going at Kessler under the hoop like they'd never heard about him. That won't last.

- It's hilarious how well Keyonte fits into our current guard rotation. Quick, dribble-happy dude whose first instinct is to look for his own shot... and who can't/wont defend. It makes absolutely no sense that we have like 7 of these guys on the roster right now. Someone has to go.

- Collins is such a tough fit. He's essentially an extremely undersized rim-running center who can't guard his own position. He has zero ballhandling, so unless he shows us he's able to make spot up 3's at a respectable clip, integrating him into the offense will be a real head-scratcher. He never looked like he knew what was expected of him or what he should be doing. Forcing the ball to him on a wing post-up is such a bad idea. He has no advantage there.

- All in all we looked like a team that has zero idea of what kind of basketball it should be playing.

Your observations certainly have merit but don’t take into account the extenuating circumstances and let’s not forget the fact that our rag tag team actually managed to win the game. An Hawaiian vacation to train and start the Season was the last thing this green and discombobulated team needed - it certainly wasn’t Hardy’s idea. PR opportunity and certainly not the end of the world but as far as actually getting anything accomplished fawgetaboutit! Both teams looked ragged and disorganized and for good reason.

Collins looked a bit tentative but it’s not like he **** the bed out there - he looked good on a spot up three which is a contention point. The jury’s out at this point on his fit with Kessler, keeping my fingers crossed.

As you say though, it’s the guard corps that’s the biggest concern. Just thinking last night how seamless Brogdon would fit with this team as the starting QB. I don’t think it would take much besides a little draft capital. I floated the Sexton Fontechio, and lowest 25 first idea and I believe that would be enough to get the job done. If not, THT, Olynyk + prolly gets it done. Either way it’s an absolute no-brainer if we hope to compete this year. Opportunities like this don’t come along that often and this early. Wake up call, c’mon Trader Danny it’s that time; time to buy.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

The biggest bummer about Collins is that at one point he had an opportunity on a fast break that most athletic wings could have taken advantage of, but I dont think Collins has that level of ball-handling in the open court, so he had to back it out.

 

[whatthe]

Collectively as a team, if you can't pass then you must shoot. If you can't shoot then dominate rebounding. And if you can't do any of that then outrun everyone.

This team is going not to pass well, and not shoot well. It's only hope is to rebound and run and hope that the other areas will catch up. We may have a disappointing year in terms of wins - close to a bottom feeder.