Playing time for development

[idiot]

This has worked out well for OKC. This iteration of the team has not had 5 players 24 or younger play 2000 minutes, but that is mainly becuase SGA aged out last year. If you look at their last few season, their young talent have gotten tons of minutes from the moment they got there.

Right. The Thunder have given their youngsters plenty of playing time. They are one of several teams (though it still hasn't been a common occurrence) throughout NBA history giving 4 guys 24 and younger 2000+ minutes. Back in the days when Durrant/Westbrook/Ibaka were that age, OKC also did it a couple of times as well.

In doing the research, I'd estimate that approximately 1/3 of the time 4 young players reached 2000+ minutes, those players collectively turned out to be truly quite good, as likely is the case in both recent and past OKC examples. About 2/3 of the time, the players collectively turned out to be nothing all that special. But certainly, most of the players we'd regard as stars had their turns as part of the 24 and younger 2000+ minute list, often in multiple seasons.

Of course the question remains whether they became good because of the playing time, or whether they got PT because they were good (or some combination). It didn't work in every case, of course--Darius Bazley nearly reached the 2000 minute-mark one season.

 

[idiot]

Good post. The quality vs quantity argument is always very tricky, but it has definitely been proven over the years that quantity alone does not guarantee results.

I think finding optimal roles for players to develop in is very underrated. So many players are tasked to do stuff they are not good at to maximize their development. I personally think that is fine only if the player either has extreme high level of confidence or proven NBA skills to fall back to. This relates to the bad habit topic you discussed. And finding optimal roles also comes down to who they are playing with.

Kessler is a good example. In year 1 he had Conley to play with who knew how to operate PnR and get Kessler involved in the offense. It hasnt been mentioned much, but I think one major part why Kessler progress stalled was that we traded away Mike and were left with no one who could operate the PnR at a high level.

Real competition is also another thing many people underestimate. By real I mean not pitting two rookies who are still scrubs on NBA level against each other, but having actual hurdles that the rookies need to leap to win/keep the job. Competitive drive should be a thing that we will value anyways, so if you got a guy who has it he should be able to fight his way into rotation as long as the obstacles are not too high. Also if/when they get into the rotation, having guys behind them that could "steal their jobs" is equally important. I think pretty much everyone would agree that complacency is the worst enemy of development.

I'm generally with you here.

 

[idiot]

Any takers on the third team in addition to 2023-4 Spurs (Popovich) and 2022-3 Rockets (Silas)? One hint (if I give any more, it will probably become too easy): the third coach has generally not been regarded as a successful NBA coach.

 

[idiot]

My prediction for minutes for the 24-and-younger crowd for the Jazz this year (baseline of 72 games --figuring in time missed for injuries; if I predict fewer games it's because of DNPs/G League). I might be out-of-my-mind optimistic on these:

George 72 games, 33 mpg, 2376 total minutes
Kessler 72, 29, 2088
Hendricks 72, 27, 1944
Williams 72, 24, 1728
Sensabaugh 68, 22, 1496
Collier, 60, 18, 1080
Filipowski 56, 22, 1232
Juzang 40, 13, 520

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Play who plays well more, play who plays less well less. Reward defensive effort. Prioritize defense.

If you are playing a fellow tanker, sit your good players.

 

[idiot]

Play who plays well more, play who plays less well less. Reward defensive effort. Prioritize defense.

If you are playing a fellow tanker, sit your good players.

Yeah, I do hope to see defense prioritized a lot more this season.

 

[fishonjazz]

My prediction for minutes for the 24-and-younger crowd for the Jazz this year (baseline of 72 games --figuring in time missed for injuries; if I predict fewer games it's because of DNPs/G League). I might be out-of-my-mind optimistic on these:

George 72 games, 33 mpg, 2376 total minutes
Kessler 72, 29, 2088
Hendricks 72, 27, 1944
Williams 72, 24, 1728
Sensabaugh 68, 22, 1496
Collier, 60, 18, 1080
Filipowski 56, 22, 1232
Juzang 40, 13, 520

I would love those minutes per game amounts.

Sent from my CPH2451 using Tapatalk

 

[KqWIN]

My prediction for minutes for the 24-and-younger crowd for the Jazz this year (baseline of 72 games --figuring in time missed for injuries; if I predict fewer games it's because of DNPs/G League). I might be out-of-my-mind optimistic on these:

George 72 games, 33 mpg, 2376 total minutes
Kessler 72, 29, 2088
Hendricks 72, 27, 1944
Williams 72, 24, 1728
Sensabaugh 68, 22, 1496
Collier, 60, 18, 1080
Filipowski 56, 22, 1232
Juzang 40, 13, 520

In my quick minutes projections, I had it as follows:

George - 2165
Kessler- 1771
Hendricks - 1574
Williams - 1574
Sensabaugh - 984
Flip - 984
Collier - 787
Juzang - 590

You have a lot more minutes for the young guys....definitely possible, it just requires a lot less minutes for the vets than I had.

 

[idiot]

In my quick minutes projections, I had it as follows:

George - 2165
Kessler- 1771
Hendricks - 1574
Williams - 1574
Sensabaugh - 984
Flip - 984
Collier - 787
Juzang - 590

You have a lot more minutes for the young guys....definitely possible, it just requires a lot less minutes for the vets than I had.


View attachment 17102

Yeah, I was just wildly spitballing, without figuring in minutes for the "vets". I'm sure this is more realistic.

 

[HermanG]

I will just sneak in a hot take that you guys may be underestimating Juzang minutes. I have a feeling we will hear Boler mispronounce his name more this year than last year.

 

[KqWIN]

I will just sneak in a hot take that you guys may be underestimating Juzang minutes. I have a feeling we will hear Boler mispronounce his name more this year than last year.

Possibly, he could be the best wing out of the young group next season. I wouldn't be surprised if he gets priority of Sens or even Hendricks. I think Cody is getting the golden path though.

 

[HermanG]

Possibly, he could be the best wing out of the young group next season. I wouldn't be surprised if he gets priority of Sens or even Hendricks. I think Cody is getting the golden path though.

Cody will get the opportunity for sure, but our lack of 3&D wings gives a chance for both to get minutes.