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poll: is Pau worth his contract the next two years (yes or no).

is he worth $38,285,850 over two seasons?

  • Yes

    Votes: 19 40.4%

  • No

    Votes: 28 59.6%
  • Total voters
    47
JazzyD said:
Not many players are worth that. But Pau is definitely not one of those. In my eyes he's a really good player but not a superstar. The Jazz aren't in a position to trade for him. I don't think he would be the missing piece to a championship. Besides, the word is the Lakers aren't looking to deal him anymore now that they have Nash.
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Well this does not make any sense at all.
 
vslice02 said:
If you're paying someone salaries of $19 million and then $19.3 million, he better be:
a) A bonefide franchise player - the marketable "face of the franchise"
-or-
b) A second-fiddle but a difference-maker who gives you a legitimate (not hopeful) chance at winning a championship in that window

The answer on both of those issues with Pau on the Jazz is both "no," and "doubtful."
Click to expand...

So you're willing to throw the entire asset building concept out the window over these two simplistic rules? Seems a little out of character for you, slice.
 
franklin said:
So you're willing to throw the entire asset building concept out the window over these two simplistic rules? Seems a little out of character for you, slice.
Click to expand...
franklin, I don't follow your reasoning, or perhaps you don't follow mine. I fully support acquiring assets - but I don't view acquiring Pau as acquiring an asset as much as he's a piece that costs you assets, since Pau is 32 and will be 34 at the end of his contract. My reasoning w/Pau is it's foolish to pay someone, who isn't a franchise player, essentiallya third of the salary cap if you're not seriously competing for a championship.
 
Darkwing Duck said:
12-13 contracts between 7-8 million. (List not updated day by day of couse.)

Caron Butler $8,000,000
Tyrus Thomas $8,000,000
Jameer Nelson $7,600,000
Arron Afflalo $7,562,500
Marcus Thornton$7,525,000
Andres Nocioni $7,500,000
O.J. Mayo $7,390,019
Desagana Diop $7,372,200
Beno Udrih $7,372,200
Mike Conley Jr $7,305,786
Trevor Ariza $7,258,960
Marcin Gortat $7,258,960
Ron Artest $7,258,960
Blake Griffin $7,226,892
Travis Outlaw $7,000,000


Griffin is on rookie contract. Looks like Williams fits right in with that group as a 10/5 player in 28 minutes. Conley is 12.5/6.5. Gortat's value may lessen with Nash's departure. Seems like Marvin Williams is paid pretty much what he's worth.
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Guys on rookie deals don't count. The rest were signed under the old CBA to mostly MLE or Bird Rights deals. New MLE is 5 to start, 4 years, and 3% raises. So the new market value has yet to be set for most players, but it will undoubtedly be lower for the middle class. Additionally, most of those guys were signed by tax teams who, under the old rules, had to overpay because someone else would.

If Marvin Williams was to opt out next season, his likely destination would be MLE Country. Salary starts at 5 which is 50% less than he will make. He would need a team with cap space to value him at 50% more in his first year, and then pony up the raises. I don't see that as being very likely.
 
vslice02 said:
My reasoning w/Pau is it's foolish to pay someone, who isn't a franchise player, essentiallya third of the salary cap if you're not seriously competing for a championship.
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This.

I could buy into it if I believed Pau get's us over the hump, but I don't. A lot of people keep mentioning that Kanter isn't ready for starter minutes, and that is true. However, there were quite a few times last year when he was playing well enough that he should have been left in the game, but was yanked instead so Corbin could stick to his routine. He's not ready to be a starter, but I definately believe we didn't make the most of developing him last year. Unless you lose both Al AND Millsap, trading for Gasol is spending 19 million to further hinder Kanter's development, only to chase what exactly? One year I would certainly consider, but not two.

The new tax penalties kicking in provide for special circumstances next year, and rather than spending 19 million to ensure choking the hope out of Kanter for 2 years, I feel confident Utah can find other opportunities to spend that money in better ways.
 
A little overpaid, but worth it. He is a game changing 7' big man with passing skills, rebounding skills, and a great midrange and post up game.
 
billyshelby said:
Guys on rookie deals don't count. The rest were signed under the old CBA to mostly MLE or Bird Rights deals. New MLE is 5 to start, 4 years, and 3% raises. So the new market value has yet to be set for most players, but it will undoubtedly be lower for the middle class. Additionally, most of those guys were signed by tax teams who, under the old rules, had to overpay because someone else would.

If Marvin Williams was to opt out next season, his likely destination would be MLE Country. Salary starts at 5 which is 50% less than he will make. He would need a team with cap space to value him at 50% more in his first year, and then pony up the raises. I don't see that as being very likely.
Click to expand...

Let's see if this is true.

Butler. 3 yrs 24 mil. Signed with Cap room new CBA
Thomas 5 yrs 40 mil. Bird Rights old CBA
Nelson 5 yrs 38 mil. Bird Rights old CBA
Afflalo 5 yrs 38 mil. Bird Rights new CBA
Thornton 4 yrs 31.15 mil. Cap room new CBA
Nocioni 6 yrs. 45 mil Bird rights old CBA
Diop 5 yrs full MLE old CBA
Udrih same
Conley 5 yrs 40 mil Bird Rights old CBA
Ariza 5 yrs Disabled players exception.
Gortat. 5yrs full MLE
MWP Same
Outlaw Signed with cap room, I think.

Pretty mixed ways they were signed.

Closest players that were signed with cap room are Butler and Thornton. Williams matches up well against those two.

https://www.basketball-reference.co...012&p2=butleca01&y2=2012&p3=willima02&y3=2012
 
Not too sure Thornton and Butler would qualify as an effective market for Williams. Butler was vastly more accomplished than Williams has ever been, and his reputation has contributed greatly to his value. Thornton had the youth angle, although Sacto bid against themselves in that deal (as an RFA no less). A nine year guy with Williams' numbers? No way he gets a deal to start at 7.5.
 
vslice02 said:
If you're paying someone salaries of $19 million and then $19.3 million, he better be:
a) A bonefide franchise player - the marketable "face of the franchise"
-or-
b) A second-fiddle but a difference-maker who gives you a legitimate (not hopeful) chance at winning a championship in that window

The answer on both of those issues with Pau on the Jazz is both "no," and "doubtful."
Click to expand...

Marry me.
 
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