Since I promised to stay out of the other thread, but have been summoned

[One Brow]

Wow -- acupuncture is a proven treatment. It does not act on the basis of a placebo effect. There is science that supports it.

Did you know that they invented sham acupuncture, in order to compare it to real acupuncture? Sham acupuncture works just as real as the real thing.

Ever have acupuncture done? I have and believe me, it is anything but a placebo. It pinpoints pressure points that trigger nerves (don't quote me on this because I might not be totally accurate on how it works) but when I had it, I was in severe pain in my lower back, and voila when the needle hit the trigger point, I felt a split-second of very sharp pain, and then sudden total numbing of the pain. That is hardly a placebo effect.

That's a great description of how the placebo effect works.

Studies have shown that elderly patients with late stage cancer live longer than without treatment than those who have chemo. I'm talking late-stage cancer. I also saw an article in the Journal of Clinical Oncology when I was doing reports for the podcasts of a holistic cancer specialist, Bill Henderson, that stated chemo for terminal-stage, elderly patients was not recommended but that doctors did it anyway to give patients hope (and who knows what else, probably to add more money to their income). In my opinion, from what I learned I would avoid chemo at all costs. Of course, you have to weigh a lot of factors, especially the type of cancer, how aggressive it's spreading, etc.

That sounds believable, and unfortunate. I agree that treatments which shorten overall lifespan should not be engaged in.

 

[Getting Traded]

Did you know that they invented sham acupuncture, in order to compare it to real acupuncture? Sham acupuncture works just as real as the real thing.



That's a great description of how the placebo effect works.

Now, Eric, you know how hard-headed I am, you think I would be convinced by the placebo effect?

 

[One Brow]

Now, Eric, you know how hard-headed I am, you think I would be convinced by the placebo effect?

I'll just say that's it's perfectly possible to be both stubborn and credulous at the same time. Nothing about one cancels out the other.

 

[Stoked]

So. recognizing that conservatives need a safe space, I will use this thread to respond to posts as I see fit. All the conservatives are welcome to join in or stay out, as befits their mental health.

Gold

 

[LogGrad98]

Wow -- acupuncture is a proven treatment. It does not act on the basis of a placebo effect. There is science that supports it. Ever have acupuncture done? I have and believe me, it is anything but a placebo. It pinpoints pressure points that trigger nerves (don't quote me on this because I might not be totally accurate on how it works) but when I had it, I was in severe pain in my lower back, and voila when the needle hit the trigger point, I felt a split-second of very sharp pain, and then sudden total numbing of the pain. That is hardly a placebo effect.

Studies have shown that elderly patients with late stage cancer live longer than without treatment than those who have chemo. I'm talking late-stage cancer. I also saw an article in the Journal of Clinical Oncology when I was doing reports for the podcasts of a holistic cancer specialist, Bill Henderson, that stated chemo for terminal-stage, elderly patients was not recommended but that doctors did it anyway to give patients hope (and who knows what else, probably to add more money to their income). In my opinion, from what I learned I would avoid chemo at all costs. Of course, you have to weigh a lot of factors, especially the type of cancer, how aggressive it's spreading, etc.

I almost fell for the feel good, no chemo approach to fighting my cancer. Looked at hyper calcium and sodium dosing, actually started taking laetrile, heavily modified my diet, etc. Etc. This was after experiencing the sheer brutality of heavy chemo first hand and thinking, no ****ing way. You have no idea until you have that needle in your arm. But luckily I listened to wiser people than me (chiefly my dad, best man I've ever known) and I proceeded with the prescribed chemo regimen. I do not credit chemo with saving my life, to me that is a joint effort, and the Lions share of the credit goes to proton therapy at Loma Linda University in California, but I thank God I did not give up on proven medicine, and that I abandoned the hokey snake oil the holistic "healers" were peddling. Hell one person I had started to see told me that proton therapy was the worst kind of radiation because it is nuclear in origin and would irradiate my cells and I would die within 5 years of radiation poisoning. Such ******** is what's really lethal.

 

[Getting Traded]

I almost fell for the feel good, no chemo approach to fighting my cancer. Looked at hyper calcium and sodium dosing, actually started taking laetrile, heavily modified my diet, etc. Etc. This was after experiencing the sheer brutality of heavy chemo first hand and thinking, no ****ing way. You have no idea until you have that needle in your arm. But luckily I listened to wiser people than me (chiefly my dad, best man I've ever known) and I proceeded with the prescribed chemo regimen. I do not credit chemo with saving my life, to me that is a joint effort, and the Lions share of the credit goes to proton therapy at Loma Linda University in California, but I thank God I did not give up on proven medicine, and that I abandoned the hokey snake oil the holistic "healers" were peddling. Hell one person I had started to see told me that proton therapy was the worst kind of radiation because it is nuclear in origin and would irradiate my cells and I would die within 5 years of radiation poisoning. Such ******** is what's really lethal.

Log, this is not a simple black and white issue. There are numerous testimonies of people who were given up by doctors and told they should prepare to die and took the holistic treatment and cured themselves. It is a known fact the chemo and radiation are carcinogenic. Yes, they kill cancer but they also kill the rest of you, including your immune system, but if you are young and strong, you have a better chance of being cured. I saw a senior citizen die within weeks after undergoing aggressive chemo. There is a series, The Truth About Cancer that goes into depth about holistic treatment. Also, there is the cancertutor.com. You are lucky to survive, and you know yourself that your doctors only hoped their treatment would work. No one has a foolproof cure for cancer, conventional or alternative doctors.

 

[One Brow]

Not really both are toxins that may be the cause of the increase in neurological conditions.

May be, but are not.

It's not just the vaccines themselves as much as the solution in which they are prepared, at least that's my understanding. I linked a massive collection of studies that are looking into this.

Studies by people who have decided the conclusion ahead of time, done with little or no scientific rigor, and contradicting every major study on the topic, ever.

The jury is not out at all. If the jury was out, then there wouldn't be increasing number of health conditions affecting people.

You mean, how we are starting to get measles outbreaks in the US again?

Our toxic environment is spawning many health problems and pharmaceutical drugs are not preventing them, just treating them, often with many adverse side effects. Stop thinking you or the medical establishment knows it all -- they don't.

Everyone succumbs to some medical disease eventually. If you live long enough, you get cancer. Our environment is much less toxic than it was 200 years ago.

 

[One Brow]

There are numerous testimonies of people who were given up by doctors and told they should prepare to die and took the holistic treatment and cured themselves.

There are a small number that regressed, which can happen with no treatment at all (which is basically the same as holistic treatment, but let's pretend it is different). There are larger numbers that had surgery, chose not to have the follow-up radiation/chemotherapy, got a lucky dice roll on no recurrence, and credited woo instead of the surgeons that took out their cancer.

There is a series, The Truth About Cancer that goes into depth about holistic treatment.

It features lots of cancer and very little truth.

No one has a foolproof cure for cancer, conventional or alternative doctors.

True. However, conventional doctors increase your survival rate, and alternative doctors don't.

 

[LogGrad98]

I will say this about the placebo affect. Doctors really don't understand exactly how it works or how powerful it can be.

Log, this is not a simple black and white issue. There are numerous testimonies of people who were given up by doctors and told they should prepare to die and took the holistic treatment and cured themselves. It is a known fact the chemo and radiation are carcinogenic. Yes, they kill cancer but they also kill the rest of you, including your immune system, but if you are young and strong, you have a better chance of being cured. I saw a senior citizen die within weeks after undergoing aggressive chemo. There is a series, The Truth About Cancer that goes into depth about holistic treatment. Also, there is the cancertutor.com. You are lucky to survive, and you know yourself that your doctors only hoped their treatment would work. No one has a foolproof cure for cancer, conventional or alternative doctors.

It's a calculated risk and no two diseases take the same track. But the odds are much greater with modern medicine than it is with "ancient medical-ish secrets". I predict if every cancer patient abandoned their modern treatments for laetrile and accupuncture you would see cancer morality rates sky rocket.

 

[Getting Traded]

May be, but are not.



Studies by people who have decided the conclusion ahead of time, done with little or no scientific rigor, and contradicting every major study on the topic, ever.



You mean, how we are starting to get measles outbreaks in the US again?



Everyone succumbs to some medical disease eventually. If you live long enough, you get cancer. Our environment is much less toxic than it was 200 years ago.

You are such a sophist, and you know, it was because Aint argued points exactly like you on your website that I realized you were the same guy. Deny all you want. I know it, but that's ok with me. We all have our own truths. And you realize the arguments you make are not based on any evidence just your own personal supposition. About the measles, some are saying it came from Israel where a lot of people are not vaccinated. But if you actually look at the titles of the voluminous number of studies and reports in that huge pdf, you will see there have been quite a few suspicious measles outbreaks in the last 20 years. I'm a skeptic and actually I thought you were too ... so why argue with such certitude in favor of an industry that has trillions of dollars invested in their treatments?

 

[Hotdog]

So. recognizing that conservatives need a safe space, I will use this thread to respond to posts as I see fit. All the conservatives are welcome to join in or stay out, as befits their mental health.

I dont need no safe space bro. Im ducking no one. Ive never used the ignore function once. That absolutely been a tool favorite of the left on this board.

Its a cute tactic of the left recently to try and flip the safe space, snowflake insults onto the right. Thats laughable. It well known facts that the left started the safe spaces. Literally. Its a real thing, setup on college campuses, for leftist pansies. The left is also the ones rioting and shutdown free speech all over the country.

Is that where the left is at at this point? Just straight up denial and trying to distort truth and reality. How weak is that? At least stand by your principles. Is the left actually just as embarrassed of themselves as the right is for them?

What a sad state of affairs this world is in. Setup safe spaces, hide in them, make loud noises when someone says something you dont agree with, then when someone makes fun of you for it, deny you do it, then say nu uh, you do it. Thats literally how little children act. Now we have grown adults in their 20's behaving the same way. Who in their right mind would ever want to be a part of that group.

 

[One Brow]

I dont need no safe space bro. Im ducking no one. Ive never used the ignore function once. That absolutely been a tool favorite of the left on this board.

People on both, or neither, sides of the aisle use the ignore function.

Its a cute tactic of the left recently to try and flip the safe space, snowflake insults onto the right. Thats laughable.

It's so laughable, why don't you go into the thread titled "A Place for Liberals" and comment on how they shouldn't need a safe space?

It well known facts that the left started the safe spaces.

I don't believe you are that stupid. Safe spaces were started by the powerful to protect themselves from the masses. They were throne rooms, court rooms, legislatures, and fortresses/castles for thousands of years. They were men's clubs and whites-only sleeping cars. Conservatives only started deriding them when minorities started doing the same thing.

Literally. Its a real thing, setup on college campuses, for leftist pansies. The left is also the ones rioting and shutdown free speech all over the country.

Who's stopping you from speaking, snowflake? Why are you so scared of criticism that you shut up?

Is that where the left is at at this point? Just straight up denial and trying to distort truth and reality. How weak is that? At least stand by your principles. Is the left actually just as embarrassed of themselves as the right is for them?

You're the one whining about liberals using tactics that conservatives used for centuries.

What a sad state of affairs this world is in. Setup safe spaces, hide in them, make loud noises when someone says something you dont agree with, then when someone makes fun of you for it, deny you do it, then say nu uh, you do it.

Why don't you go into the thread titled "A Place for Liberals" and comment on how they shouldn't need a safe space?

Thats literally how little children act. Now we have grown adults in their 20's behaving the same way. Who in their right mind would ever want to be a part of that group.

I can think of people who started one particular thread on this board.