Thanks.
Some new developments for Cavs' pick
- Thread starter The Midnight
- Start date
Thanks.
Of course that's what his agent is going to say. He doesn't do his client's draft stock any favors by saying "Yeah, it's probably for the fourth pick." There are still other teams watching.
NotDeadYet
Well-Known Member
The Cavs do need SIZE, so given that, if Rubio has indeed signed with the T'Wolves, the T'Wolves will likely take Williams for their SF slot. So the Cavs should be pretty sure either Irving or Knight will be there at #4, wheras Kanter likely would NOT. V-E-R-Y I-N-T-E-R-E-S-T-I-N-G....
Jazz4ever
Well-Known Member
I don't think Kyrie Irving's 11 college games are that much more conclusive than Kanters resume (U19 and nike summit). Add to the fact Irving refused all combine athletic tests and competitive workouts, which Kanter did for them.
Gilbert is wise to think this one over long and hard even if he does ultimately go with Irving.
Gilbert is wise to think this one over long and hard even if he does ultimately go with Irving.
U19 and Nike Summit is not a resume.
GVC
Well-Known Member
11 > 2
Last edited:
theNBAnerd
Well-Known Member
kanter will not be the top pick. if you want to dream, start dreaming that minny will take him #2, or washington will trade up to get him there, and williams falls to us. that's a long-shot, too, but at least feasible. no way kanter goes #1.
remember that cleveland has #4 as well. they might be looking hard at him there given that a lot of people have us taking someone other than kanter at 3.
remember that cleveland has #4 as well. they might be looking hard at him there given that a lot of people have us taking someone other than kanter at 3.
theNBAnerd
Well-Known Member
absolutely agree. u19 is a tournament, yes, but it's a tournament with nothing but a bunch of teenagers, and it was nearly two years ago. picking him based on that tournament would be like drafting someone because they had a nice showing during an AAU tourney or at a round robin with a bunch of really great sophomore teams. (and for the record, kanter didn't play in all six rounds of that tournament... he played in 4 games. ya know, for future reference....)
the nike summit was more recent and it sounds like he had a pretty prolific performance, but that was one game.
i like several things we're hearing about kanter, but i'm also extremely nervous about drafting someone who hasn't played competitive ball for over a year.
Two thoughts, one short & one long:
If the Jazz think there’s any chance of Irving falling to them, shouldn’t they be signaling that they’re interested in Williams and Kanter at #3 over Knight? That way Cavs feel it’s safer to have a Knight still left at #4.
From Cavs’ perspective, this may be like the Prisoner’s Dilemma used in social science and business. Let’s say Cavs have assigned the following values (out of 100) for their team situation:
Irving = 85
Williams = 83
Kanter = 82 (if they don’t also take Williams)
Knight = 80 (if they don’t also take Irving)
Valenciunus (or any other draft choice) = 72 or less
Drafting the second of Irving/Knight in the same draft or the second of Williams/Kanter in the same draft (including what they think they could get in a trade) = 73 or less
The best scenario for Cleveland is obviously Irving at 1 and Kanter or Williams at 4 (168 or 167 total value). But if Wolves and Jazz take Williams & Kanter, then the best possible value for Cavs is 158.
One possible option (from Cavs’ perspective) is to take Williams (or Kanter) at #1, and then assume that Wolves will not Irving and then be comfortable that a PG will be available at #4. Then they likely end up with 163 total value. The risk is that the Wolves trade their pick to a team that wants Irving and the Jazz take Knight. Then Cavs’ best possible value is 156.
As with the Prisoner’s Dilemma, the best solutions (for Cavs) are cooperation. In the past (I believe), teams have made deals to draft for one another. If the Cavs did this, they could do one of the following:
Solution 1: Cavs and Wolves (#1 & 2) agree to choose for one another. Wolves then get first choice (likely Williams or Kanter), then (to eliminate risk) Cavs take the other of Williams or Kanter. Then the likely value Cavs get is 163 or 162.
Solution 2: Cavs and Jazz (#1 & 3) agree to choose for each other. Jazz choose Irving. Then Cavs get 163 or 162 value.
Solution 3: Jazz and Cavs (#3 & 4) agree to choose for each other. Cavs assured of 167 or 168 value if they pick their needs.
Solution 3 is best on the face of it, but Cavs would likely have to give up value in order to persuade Jazz to go along – probably more value than it’s worth. Thus solution 1 & (especially) 2 might be the best to best balance risk and value: Wolves or Jazz might give up value to get top pick, and rookie salary of #2 and especially #3 will be lower than #1.
Again, if the Cavs valuing isn’t similar to what I’ve assumed here, this is all moot, but if the valuing is similar, there are some interesting possibilities.
If the Jazz think there’s any chance of Irving falling to them, shouldn’t they be signaling that they’re interested in Williams and Kanter at #3 over Knight? That way Cavs feel it’s safer to have a Knight still left at #4.
From Cavs’ perspective, this may be like the Prisoner’s Dilemma used in social science and business. Let’s say Cavs have assigned the following values (out of 100) for their team situation:
Irving = 85
Williams = 83
Kanter = 82 (if they don’t also take Williams)
Knight = 80 (if they don’t also take Irving)
Valenciunus (or any other draft choice) = 72 or less
Drafting the second of Irving/Knight in the same draft or the second of Williams/Kanter in the same draft (including what they think they could get in a trade) = 73 or less
The best scenario for Cleveland is obviously Irving at 1 and Kanter or Williams at 4 (168 or 167 total value). But if Wolves and Jazz take Williams & Kanter, then the best possible value for Cavs is 158.
One possible option (from Cavs’ perspective) is to take Williams (or Kanter) at #1, and then assume that Wolves will not Irving and then be comfortable that a PG will be available at #4. Then they likely end up with 163 total value. The risk is that the Wolves trade their pick to a team that wants Irving and the Jazz take Knight. Then Cavs’ best possible value is 156.
As with the Prisoner’s Dilemma, the best solutions (for Cavs) are cooperation. In the past (I believe), teams have made deals to draft for one another. If the Cavs did this, they could do one of the following:
Solution 1: Cavs and Wolves (#1 & 2) agree to choose for one another. Wolves then get first choice (likely Williams or Kanter), then (to eliminate risk) Cavs take the other of Williams or Kanter. Then the likely value Cavs get is 163 or 162.
Solution 2: Cavs and Jazz (#1 & 3) agree to choose for each other. Jazz choose Irving. Then Cavs get 163 or 162 value.
Solution 3: Jazz and Cavs (#3 & 4) agree to choose for each other. Cavs assured of 167 or 168 value if they pick their needs.
Solution 3 is best on the face of it, but Cavs would likely have to give up value in order to persuade Jazz to go along – probably more value than it’s worth. Thus solution 1 & (especially) 2 might be the best to best balance risk and value: Wolves or Jazz might give up value to get top pick, and rookie salary of #2 and especially #3 will be lower than #1.
Again, if the Cavs valuing isn’t similar to what I’ve assumed here, this is all moot, but if the valuing is similar, there are some interesting possibilities.
Help me out here guys, I'm confused. I thought it was the U18 tournament and that it lasted 9 games:
https://www.usbasket.com/player.asp?Cntry=USA&PlayerID=130617 (ignore and scroll down past the log-in box)