Stephen A claims Hayward IS Boston's problem.

[LoPo]

He was worth every cent of his first contract

The last two years sure I'll give you that. However, he was not a max level player the first two years of his max contract. The best player on the team getting 16, 5 and 5? The first two years, he was only a max contract player on potential not on actual production.

The way I see it, I'm willing to pay a guy max money on potential if the actualization of his potential makes up for the fact that he didn't play like a max level player earlier in the contract. His peak was pretty good, but winning one series and making the All Star team doesn't make up for the fact that our team sucked and he played only pretty well for the first couple years.

Hayward never brought us national attention. He helped win one playoff series in 4 years. If he wasn't the focal point for 4 years, he would have had even more pedestrian numbers.

 

[Thee Jazz Fan]

The last two years sure I'll give you that. However, he was not a max level player the first two years of his max contract. The best player on the team getting 16, 5 and 5? The first two years, he was only a max contract player on potential not on actual production.

The way I see it, I'm willing to pay a guy max money on potential if the actualization of his potential makes up for the fact that he didn't play like a max level player earlier in the contract. His peak was pretty good, but winning one series and making the All Star team doesn't make up for the fact that our team sucked and he played only pretty well for the first couple years.

Hayward never brought us national attention. He helped win one playoff series in 4 years. If he wasn't the focal point for 4 years, he would have had even more pedestrian numbers.

You realize we were rebuilding when he got his contract and edited years of Ty before that, and was the only scoring option, and only guy you had to worry about shutting down, right?


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[Thee Jazz Fan]

The last two years sure I'll give you that. However, he was not a max level player the first two years of his max contract. The best player on the team getting 16, 5 and 5? The first two years, he was only a max contract player on potential not on actual production.

The way I see it, I'm willing to pay a guy max money on potential if the actualization of his potential makes up for the fact that he didn't play like a max level player earlier in the contract. His peak was pretty good, but winning one series and making the All Star team doesn't make up for the fact that our team sucked and he played only pretty well for the first couple years.

Hayward never brought us national attention. He helped win one playoff series in 4 years. If he wasn't the focal point for 4 years, he would have had even more pedestrian numbers.

Let’s also remember that he was forced into being an Alfa scorer, when that wasn’t his game, more of a playmaking do a little of everything robin to Batman. He was worth every penny.


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[Thee Jazz Fan]

If he regains his form from his last year with the jazz, he’s the perfect robin to Kyrie’s Batman and definitely worth this years contract.


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[oneye]

I’m not worried about him anymore. His problems, and they will be many, are his and they are in Boston now. Media/Boston fans are not going to be happy if he doesn’t improve, the injury be damned. At some point they’ll all lose patients and they won’t care about excuses. Good luck to the dude, he’s gonna need it.

 

[LoPo]

You realize we were rebuilding when he got his contract and edited years of Ty before that, and was the only scoring option, and only guy you had to worry about shutting down, right?


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I'm agreeing with you that he became worthy of a max level contract. He was that type of player for the last two years of his deal. Over the first two years, I just don't believe he was worth it.

He didn't bring any intangibles to the table. Maybe if he was charismatic like Mitchell. Or if he was an incredible guy in the community. Or if he had games from time to time which got the Jazz name out there more. But that wasn't who he was. He was a good all round player. If he was a max player for another franchise, Jazz fans wouldn't have held him so high. If he was a Bull or a Hawk or a King...

 

[Gameface]

Please move thread to appropriate forum.

Do we have a "trash" forum?

 

[Maneesh]

If he regains his form from his last year with the jazz, he’s the perfect robin to Kyrie’s Batman and definitely worth this years contract.


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Oh...thank for telling us.

 

[framer]

I'm agreeing with you that he became worthy of a max level contract. He was that type of player for the last two years of his deal. Over the first two years, I just don't believe he was worth it.

He didn't bring any intangibles to the table. Maybe if he was charismatic like Mitchell. Or if he was an incredible guy in the community. Or if he had games from time to time which got the Jazz name out there more. But that wasn't who he was. He was a good all round player. If he was a max player for another franchise, Jazz fans wouldn't have held him so high. If he was a Bull or a Hawk or a King...

Gordon Hayward is not a max player. I'm glad we aren't paying him like one. Some day we are going to look back and see what a masterful job Quinn did with him. Also, I'm not positive Gobert and Mitchell would be as spectacular sans Quinn. I mean look at Rubio and Crowder. . .

 

[infection]

This is a bit off topic, but as Hayward’s extension talks drew on and he waffled, Rudy signed his extension, and then he went on a massive stretch lighting the league on fire. It seemed to me, based on both their body language, that Rudy was asserting this as his team, and he seemed to be frustrated with Mr. Waffles’ waffling.

 

[Magic Spray]

The last two years sure I'll give you that. However, he was not a max level player the first two years of his max contract. The best player on the team getting 16, 5 and 5? The first two years, he was only a max contract player on potential not on actual production.

The way I see it, I'm willing to pay a guy max money on potential if the actualization of his potential makes up for the fact that he didn't play like a max level player earlier in the contract. His peak was pretty good, but winning one series and making the All Star team doesn't make up for the fact that our team sucked and he played only pretty well for the first couple years.

Hayward never brought us national attention. He helped win one playoff series in 4 years. If he wasn't the focal point for 4 years, he would have had even more pedestrian numbers.

Nationally, everybody wants to talk about Hayward like he was this incredible monster player before his injury. The truth is that while he was probably the most important player for the Jazz the last 2 years he was here, it took him 7 years in an incubator to develop into a one-time, alternate-due-to-injury All-Star. His stats with Utah were a product of an offense meticulously designed around him.

In a Moneyball organization such as the Jazz, the team needs to structure itself around what it can get (mid-lottery draft picks, reclamation projects, and so on) and its built-in disadvantages ("Utah is a bad city" and/or "You go live in Utah" and/or "The fans are vile"). Props to Hayward for leveraging that into a sweetheart deal with the team and coach that he wanted. Props the Jazz for being free from someone that didn't want to be here. Props to the media for all their hot takes about this. Finally, props to us who get to enjoy the schadenfreude, may it last forever.

 

[Gameface]

Looked up "schadenfreude"... left happy.