Sweet. Always did want to know how Hrpring would look in orange.
I haven't been on the fence at all this year. But keep preaching that line. Hope Exum, Hood and Gobert have monster games.
The Jazz rebuild
- Thread starter @nsanba
- Start date
Sweet. Always did want to know how Hrpring would look in orange.
I haven't been on the fence at all this year. But keep preaching that line. Hope Exum, Hood and Gobert have monster games.
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
Great idea if you want small market teams to be stuck at the bottom forever. We're already screwed when it comes to FAs, and now you want the draft to go against us as well. Utah voted against changing the lottery system for a reason. You should be glad our FO doesn't think the way you do.
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
#WinningStreakIsGood2DraftChristianWood
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
Well, my bubble has been burst a bit. I was relying on hoopshype for the cap info and got all excited by looking at just the bottom number for the Jazz ($49.3M).
What I now realize after updating my own spreadsheet is the $49M does not include the QO to Kanter and the team options on Booker and Murry. So the Jazz could only get down to about $54M after cap holds (1st round pick + roster spots up to 12 players). Probably could find a trading partner for Novak if needed, so let's say $51M. But that would include renouncing the rights to Kanter and Booker, too. I see Utah keeping Kanter, so add back the QO. Keep Booker and the Jazz will be around $66M with cap holds. Depending on how much the cap increases, we'll only have a little bit under the cap + the exceptions to go after free agents.
Someone please correct me if my numbers are wrong. GVC?
https://hoopshype.com/salaries/utah.htm
What I now realize after updating my own spreadsheet is the $49M does not include the QO to Kanter and the team options on Booker and Murry. So the Jazz could only get down to about $54M after cap holds (1st round pick + roster spots up to 12 players). Probably could find a trading partner for Novak if needed, so let's say $51M. But that would include renouncing the rights to Kanter and Booker, too. I see Utah keeping Kanter, so add back the QO. Keep Booker and the Jazz will be around $66M with cap holds. Depending on how much the cap increases, we'll only have a little bit under the cap + the exceptions to go after free agents.
Someone please correct me if my numbers are wrong. GVC?
https://hoopshype.com/salaries/utah.htm
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GVC
Well-Known Member
1. Although he hasn't put up Alec's contract yet, shamsports is the site to go for accurate salary information. Hoopshype is sometimes wrong.
2. Without considering minimum roster charges, Gordo, Favs, Exum, Novak, Burks, Burke, Hood and Gobert bring the Jazz up over $49mil. If you pick up Booker's option, and include cap holds for Enes and a top 5 pick, you can add about $20mil to that number.
3. The most recent reports I've read (it's been a while) had the owners not in favor of smoothing the increase in the cap, so if the Jazz want to keep Booker and Kanter, they effectively won't have any cap space next summer.
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
Thanks, GVC for confirming the numbers. We essentially have the same conclusions.
Guess the only thing to do if the Jazz have a FA they really want is to not pick up the option on Booker and trade Novak. They could sign the FA and then use the MLE to re-sign Booker if they still need him as a backup PF, right? Booker might sign elsewhere, but that wouldn't be a disaster. If Gobert's minutes increase next season, it has to come at the expense of the backup PF (providing Kanter is still on the roster).
If the Jazz get a big in the draft, either Booker or Kanter would be expendable. And if they get a wing, I can't see them going after another in free agency, as they already have Hayward, Burks and Hood. I think Rodney is a definite rotation player. So Jazz just need to replace the minutes Ingles is getting with a player who can shoot.
Guess the only thing to do if the Jazz have a FA they really want is to not pick up the option on Booker and trade Novak. They could sign the FA and then use the MLE to re-sign Booker if they still need him as a backup PF, right? Booker might sign elsewhere, but that wouldn't be a disaster. If Gobert's minutes increase next season, it has to come at the expense of the backup PF (providing Kanter is still on the roster).
If the Jazz get a big in the draft, either Booker or Kanter would be expendable. And if they get a wing, I can't see them going after another in free agency, as they already have Hayward, Burks and Hood. I think Rodney is a definite rotation player. So Jazz just need to replace the minutes Ingles is getting with a player who can shoot.
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Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
GVC, a couple more ?'s to ask since you are the CBA guru.
Let's suppose the Jazz do trade Novak, don't pick up the option on Booker, but give a QO to Kanter. Let's just say that opens up $8M in cap space. They use up that cap space on a free agent. Now it's time to go back and negotiate a contract with Kanter. I know they can match any offer and go over the cap in doing so, provided the FA is signed BEFORE they match an offer for Enes. I know the timing is critical on that, as we saw with the Bosh/Parsons situation in Houston. Bosh would have needed to sign first. If Kanter doesn't get an offer from another team, Utah can exceed the cap to re-sign him to any amount (well, up to a max contract), correct?
Also, as I was reading through Coon's FAQ, it appears teams under the cap have less of an MLE to use. So if Utah were to get under the cap by the moves above, would they then lose the higher MLE and not be able to re-sign Booker at the $5M price (or whatever that MLE is) and just have the lower MLE left to use?
Let's suppose the Jazz do trade Novak, don't pick up the option on Booker, but give a QO to Kanter. Let's just say that opens up $8M in cap space. They use up that cap space on a free agent. Now it's time to go back and negotiate a contract with Kanter. I know they can match any offer and go over the cap in doing so, provided the FA is signed BEFORE they match an offer for Enes. I know the timing is critical on that, as we saw with the Bosh/Parsons situation in Houston. Bosh would have needed to sign first. If Kanter doesn't get an offer from another team, Utah can exceed the cap to re-sign him to any amount (well, up to a max contract), correct?
Also, as I was reading through Coon's FAQ, it appears teams under the cap have less of an MLE to use. So if Utah were to get under the cap by the moves above, would they then lose the higher MLE and not be able to re-sign Booker at the $5M price (or whatever that MLE is) and just have the lower MLE left to use?
GVC
Well-Known Member
1. Yeah, Utah can sign their own free agents for up to the max.
2. The MLE used to only be available to teams who didn't use cap space. The cap space MLE is new with the current CBA. The Jazz can claim either the full MLE if it would put them above the cap OR use their cap space and the cap space MLE. I suspect the Jazz will be looking to move Booker before this becomes an issue.
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
Given the Jazz' needs and what I think they'll do with Enes...DL sounded very sure about keeping him in a recent interview.
Sorry, can't find the link, but I think it was transcribed from a radio show.
1. I see a Gobert/Kanter/Favors rotation next season. Gobert probably still comes off the bench, but his minutes increase to 25+. Those minutes come at the expense of the backup PF. Jazz will also probably try to find a shooter to develop at the 4, either via the draft or in free agency. So maybe we keep Booker, maybe not. Booker could also be a good asset to trade at the deadline. I think a contender would be willing to part with a prospect or a late first for him. His contract, IINM, is a team option for next year, so he's a potential trading asset this year or next.
2. Burks, Hayward and Hood look like a decent rotation. Not saying trades can't be made, but with limited money available for free agents, this may be the spot to target via the draft or free agency. Will need to look at players in the MLE range.
3. Given our need for outside shooting, I think Johnson, Porzingis or McCullough might be great draft picks. There are others, of course. And plans really would change if the Jazz landed in the top-3. I'm a big Johnson guy myself (which my wife loves, of course). Seriously, he'd be a great pick. Jazz have to plan for Hayward potentially opting out and leaving after the 2016/17 season. Johnson could step in and start if that happens.
4. Neto comes over as the 3rd PG. I see Trey being traded at the 2016 deadline unless he suddenly becomes an outstanding shooter. Exum may/may not be ready to start. I'd like the jazz to go after a solid veteran who would split time with Dante initially, then start to give way as Exum takes over. Realistically, I think it might be 2 or even 3 more years before Exum is ready to play 30 mins/per.
Sorry, can't find the link, but I think it was transcribed from a radio show.
1. I see a Gobert/Kanter/Favors rotation next season. Gobert probably still comes off the bench, but his minutes increase to 25+. Those minutes come at the expense of the backup PF. Jazz will also probably try to find a shooter to develop at the 4, either via the draft or in free agency. So maybe we keep Booker, maybe not. Booker could also be a good asset to trade at the deadline. I think a contender would be willing to part with a prospect or a late first for him. His contract, IINM, is a team option for next year, so he's a potential trading asset this year or next.
2. Burks, Hayward and Hood look like a decent rotation. Not saying trades can't be made, but with limited money available for free agents, this may be the spot to target via the draft or free agency. Will need to look at players in the MLE range.
3. Given our need for outside shooting, I think Johnson, Porzingis or McCullough might be great draft picks. There are others, of course. And plans really would change if the Jazz landed in the top-3. I'm a big Johnson guy myself (which my wife loves, of course). Seriously, he'd be a great pick. Jazz have to plan for Hayward potentially opting out and leaving after the 2016/17 season. Johnson could step in and start if that happens.
4. Neto comes over as the 3rd PG. I see Trey being traded at the 2016 deadline unless he suddenly becomes an outstanding shooter. Exum may/may not be ready to start. I'd like the jazz to go after a solid veteran who would split time with Dante initially, then start to give way as Exum takes over. Realistically, I think it might be 2 or even 3 more years before Exum is ready to play 30 mins/per.
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freakazoid
Well-Known Member
Bump.
Just curious if any of the doomsdayers have lightened their stance on the progress of Utah's rebuild since the start of this thread. I think Gobert has already emerged as a much more valuable player, sooner than anyone would have thought. I also see progress from everyone not named Trey. Asset wise, I believe Rudy has shown how quickly things can change when you have as much youth/potential as Utah does.
Just curious if any of the doomsdayers have lightened their stance on the progress of Utah's rebuild since the start of this thread. I think Gobert has already emerged as a much more valuable player, sooner than anyone would have thought. I also see progress from everyone not named Trey. Asset wise, I believe Rudy has shown how quickly things can change when you have as much youth/potential as Utah does.