The New Hate?

[LogGrad98]

And to add, I at no point said that all politicians are corrupt, or even that majority are corrupt. They just tend to know what to say, when to say it, and how to keep the public and private persona separate. Oh, and not to bite the hand that feeds them. Both in Canada and the USA, it's nearly impossible to get elected to federal office as an independent.

When his party was in opposition, the minister I know broke ranks with the party and was one of 5 MPs who voted for gay marriage, based on very deep personal convictions. 3 years later, he voted with his party(now in power) to raise the age of consent, despite seriously opposing the law in private. Why? First of all, because despite the claims by the party that they don't enforce voting discipline, he might have faced censure. Second of all, because he might have then had to explain the reasons his opposition to the law, which the masses would've likely found very controversial.

He's a great guy, and has a really strong moral compass, but can I blame him for not messing with his own career?

This is a good assessment I think. But how long can you step back and forth across that line until it is blurred beyond all recognition?

 

[JimLes]

This is a good assessment I think. But how long can you step back and forth across that line until it is blurred beyond all recognition?

It's not about blurring the line. I think our elected officials should be open to compromise and working with one another. The problem is that people hold public servants to higher standards than themselves(boy, don't I know it). Norquist tax pledge, anyone?

So, a senator or a congressman made a pledge to get elected, then changed their mind, and they end up facing a massive backlash. ****, who hasn't gone back on something they said to get hired? I told my grade 10 boss at McD's I could work weekends, but then immediately made up Torah classes after he hired me. We've all done it, but somehow, when a politician does it, let's string him up. The electorate treats intransigence like it's a virtue.

We have to accept that a politician changing their mind on an issue isn't a bad thing. Sure, some of them are honest, and some of them are doing it for gain, but does it matter? If we're seeking compromise, it's a positive thing, regardless.

 

[LogGrad98]

It's not about blurring the line. I think our elected officials should be open to compromise and working with one another. The problem is that people hold public servants to higher standards than themselves(boy, don't I know it). Norquist tax pledge, anyone?

So, a senator or a congressman made a pledge to get elected, then changed their mind, and they end up facing a massive backlash. ****, who hasn't gone back on something they said to get hired? I told my grade 10 boss at McD's I could work weekends, but then immediately made up Torah classes after he hired me. We've all done it, but somehow, when a politician does it, let's string him up. The electorate treats intransigence like it's a virtue.

We have to accept that a politician changing their mind on an issue isn't a bad thing. Sure, some of them are honest, and some of them are doing it for gain, but does it matter? If we're seeking compromise, it's a positive thing, regardless.

It sounds to me like you are talking about 2 different things. One is going against ones personally held moral beliefs to get elected. That is blurring the line, in this context. The other is changing your mind on an issue. I think you can do the latter without doing the former.

 

[sirkickyass]

They GOP have been going to "shut down the government" for 2 years now don't get your panties in a bundle.

Hey look, they did it.

 

[Deleted member 365]

It's called the counter culture revolution.

White Christians have had their panties in a twist since the 60s. Reagan gave them a boost. AM radio and foxnews have been waging this war since the early 90s. It's all coming to a point right now. As the middle-class has disappeared, Latino culture exploded, and gays have gained political clout, conservative white Christians have pushed back even harder. Now, these tea baggers are willing to shut down the government and throw our economy off a cliff. They perceive an enemy, whether it be immigrants, gays, progressives, intellectuals, non-Christians, etc and will do everything in their power to reverse the cultural, social, and political trend that has always been progressing but really became prevalent in the 60s counter culture movement.

 

[Stoked]

It's called the counter culture revolution.

White Christians have had their panties in a twist since the 60s. Reagan gave them a boost. AM radio and foxnews have been waging this war since the early 90s. It's all coming to a point right now. As the middle-class has disappeared, Latino culture exploded, and gays have gained political clout, conservative white Christians have pushed back even harder. Now, these tea baggers are willing to shut down the government and throw our economy off a cliff. They perceive an enemy, whether it be immigrants, gays, progressives, intellectuals, non-Christians, etc and will do everything in their power to reverse the cultural, social, and political trend that has always been progressing but really became prevalent in the 60s counter culture movement.

Hahahaha. Keep on blindly hating.

 

[Deleted member 365]

Hahahaha. Keep on blindly hating.

If you disagree then disagree and provide evidence. The only person blindly hating is you.

 

[Revolution 9]

Everyone's experience will likely vary.

this

 

[LogGrad98]

So did the GOP shut down the government all by themselves or did they have "help", so to speak? The dems are completely blameless in all of this? Lots has been made of what the GOP had to do to keep the government going, but what could the dems have done?

 

[Stoked]

It's called the counter culture revolution.

White Christians have had their panties in a twist since the 60s. Reagan gave them a boost. AM radio and foxnews have been waging this war since the early 90s. It's all coming to a point right now. As the middle-class has disappeared, Latino culture exploded, and gays have gained political clout, conservative white Christians have pushed back even harder. Now, these tea baggers are willing to shut down the government and throw our economy off a cliff. They perceive an enemy, whether it be immigrants, gays, progressives, intellectuals, non-Christians, etc and will do everything in their power to reverse the cultural, social, and political trend that has always been progressing but really became prevalent in the 60s counter culture movement.

The Democratic Senate was equally willing to shut down the government as they rejected several House proposals. Fact.

But you just want to hit one side. Fact.

 

[sirkickyass]

The Democratic Senate was equally willing to shut down the government as they rejected several House proposals. Fact.

But you just want to hit one side. Fact.

Those are not facts.

The House proposals are designed to either eliminate or neuter the primary domestic policy achievement of the administration. An issue that the President has run on twice and won two elections on. Threatening to shut down the government unless a party votes to repeal its own validly passed laws, laws that you can't get repealed through the normal process because you don't have the votes, is not valid process. It's hostage taking.

If you believe sides are equally to blame then you're either uninformed or willfully ignorant of what's actually happening.

 

[LogGrad98]

Those are not facts.

The House proposals are designed to either eliminate or neuter the primary domestic policy achievement of the administration. An issue that the President has run on twice and won two elections on. Threatening to shut down the government unless a party votes to repeal its own validly passed laws, laws that you can't get repealed through the normal process because you don't have the votes, is not valid process. It's hostage taking.

He ran on the issue of healthcare reform, not the final product of Obamacare, not the same thing.

Also, as I stated elsewhere, if you really think this is the only reason anyone voted for Obama and proves that everyone fully supports Obamacare in its current iteration, well I have a bridge for sale.

And you actually hit on the real issue, IMO, in all of this. The repubs are trying to neuter the president and take out his signature legislation, and the dems are doing all they can to avoid that. Neither are looking at it from the standpoint of what is best for the American people. It is party-line **** all over again.