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The Non-Jazz NBA Thread in the Jazz Section

Saint Cy of JFC said:
Another win for the Conley trade
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If you look back now not much was lost (other than the theoretical opportunity to trade for a better player than Mike):
Korver: retired.
Crowder: signed for the minimum by the Bucks and barely playing at the end of last year.
Bazley: just waived by Brooklyn.
Kessler: came home to us.
So essentially all we lost was Grayson Allen, whom most here can live without.
 
Udidthizz said:
If you look back now not much was lost (other than the theoretical opportunity to trade for a better player than Mike):
Korver: retired.
Crowder: signed for the minimum by the Bucks and barely playing at the end of last year.
Bazley: just waived by Brooklyn.
Kessler: came home to us.
So essentially all we lost was Grayson Allen, whom most here can live without.
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And we got high level play for multiple years and another pick when we moved him (with other parts… but he was the centerpiece).
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
And we got high level play for multiple years and another pick when we moved him (with other parts… but he was the centerpiece).
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The net gain of the Conley tradewas massive. We wouldn't have been a top regular season team without him. He raised everyone's value which led to massive trade packages for Gobert/Mitchell and later on himself.
 
The opportunity cost of not having someone else besides Conley is what killed us. Don+Mike never had a chance. Adding terrible perimeter defense on top of that certainly didn’t help though.
 
The Conley trade worked out. But I feel like we should all remember how poor Mike's first year with the jazz went. That's the reason that many people got entrenched in their hatred of the trade. For a full year their suspicions of pushing ALL IN for Mike were confirmed.
 
Mike's first regular season was really bad, but it was probably his biggest playoff contribution (bubble year). He helped us win a lot of regular season games, but he got injured the next playoffs and was horrid in the DAL series. The definition of success is person to person so to each their own, but I still think we should have done better with those assets. There was a big obsession with getting a PG to play with Don. Realistically, Joe Ingles was the perfect backcourt partner all along and those assets should have been used for a different kind of player.

We would have done a lot better with Mike with a more well rounded roster, however, so I can't put all the blame on him. He was part of the defensive problem, but so was most of the roster and the FO decided to sit on their hands rather than mix it up. Too much investment in no defense players and backup C's. Really poor job of building around the strengths/weaknesses of Don and Rudy.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Injuries killed us.
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Maybe....maybe we beat DEN with Bogey, LAC with Conley healthy. Problem with that is those players didn't really help us with our biggest problems in those series, which was getting absolutely cooked on defense. But those two gave us a better chance in a shootout.
 
If the threshold is championship or the trade wasn’t successful then 99% of the transactions in the nba were failures. The Mike trade was a win… we just needed a bigger win.
 
All you Justise Winslow fans: He signed an Exhibit 10 today. That means the number five through ten picks of the 2015 draft are out of the league. That was the draft where the Jazz drafted Trey Lyles.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
If the threshold is championship or the trade wasn’t successful then 99% of the transactions in the nba were failures. The Mike trade was a win… we just needed a bigger win.
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My personal threshold isn’t a championship. We didn’t get anywhere close to a championship. But when you’ve got Don and Rudy on your team I think the threshold is a bit more than being a better regular season team. Conley was just one of a long string of moves that made it very difficult to advance further in the playoffs and almost impossible to win a championship. It wouldn’t have been as bad if we didn’t fill the roster with bad perimeter defenders and continue to double down on that roster composition + coach.

We ended up recouping a lot of the assets back. But again, there was a big opportunity cost in using up our Don/Rudy with those guys. We had a team that we knew would get cooked in the playoffs, we continued to get cooked, and we made no significant changes.

But Conley definitely does not the worst move/non-move of that Jazz era. It’s just not a move I would do again. He was always going to be a bad pairing with Mitchell in the playoffs.
 
Udidthizz said:
If you look back now not much was lost (other than the theoretical opportunity to trade for a better player than Mike):
Korver: retired.
Crowder: signed for the minimum by the Bucks and barely playing at the end of last year.
Bazley: just waived by Brooklyn.
Kessler: came home to us.
So essentially all we lost was Grayson Allen, whom most here can live without.
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That is really not the case. The talk was that it was between us and the pacers for the Conley trade. Let the pacers take Conley and we are in the perfect position to step in and snag Brogdon for a future 1st like the pacers got him for. Add Brogdon, Crowder and Allen to the 19-20 and 20-21 teams and maybe we are looking at an nba title right now.
 
sip said:
That is really not the case. The talk was that it was between us and the pacers for the Conley trade. Let the pacers take Conley and we are in the perfect position to step in and snag Brogdon for a future 1st like the pacers got him for. Add Brogdon, Crowder and Allen to the 19-20 and 20-21 teams and maybe we are looking at an nba title right now.
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Because Brogdon improved the Pacers so much?

Has nobody watched Brogdon play?
 
NAOS_pt2 said:
The Conley trade worked out. But I feel like we should all remember how poor Mike's first year with the jazz went. That's the reason that many people got entrenched in their hatred of the trade. For a full year their suspicions of pushing ALL IN for Mike were confirmed.
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I remember how excited the crowd would get when mike would hit an easy gimme shot because he was stone cold terrible for the first couple months here. I don't know if he was even shooting at 20% from the field in those first weeks. Worst shooting I've seen from a guy who was a well established player that shot at least decently well for years in Memphis.

In the end I liked the guy and was happy to have him on the team, but whoa that was a rough start.
 
sip said:
So you are telling me that Brogdon isn't a solid player that would have been a good fit with Mitchell?
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He's not better than Mike, and wouldn't have been a good fit with Don.

He found his role as a 6th man, but doesn't play good enough defense or make others better, so isn't a starting point guard.
 
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