This season will vindicate Ty Corbin
- Thread starter franklin
- Start date
Here's a fun question you blind Quin worshipers are avoiding like the plague.
Quin could improve on a defense consisting of no true center, and either Kanter or undersized Marvin and Evans playing a combined 48 minutes at the 4. Evans played 18 mpg at the 4. 18! Kanter played 26 mpg, some at the 4, some at the 5, and Marvin played 25 at the 4 and 3 combined. JLIII and the rest of the no point guard group logged enough minutes to make any defense an utter disaster.
Quin could not improve on that with a much better squad until the Kanter trade. Why?
Trevor Booker is a much better fill in at the 4 than Marvin (who has no business playing the 4 at all) or Evans (a novelty who appears to fit better on the Mixtape Tour than in the NBA).
Exum is head and heels better than anything the Jazz played at point last season. It's not even a comparison between him and Trey, let alone the rest of last year's mia squad. 21 mpg at point this season.
Derrick Favors at the 4. HUGE advantage year over year.
Rudy Gobert, true defensive center, and MUCH improved over last season, was playing 22 mpg pre-Kanter trade vs. 9.6 and constant foul trouble all last season.
All those advantages and Quin couldn't improve the defense until Kanter was traded. Why?
Quin could improve on a defense consisting of no true center, and either Kanter or undersized Marvin and Evans playing a combined 48 minutes at the 4. Evans played 18 mpg at the 4. 18! Kanter played 26 mpg, some at the 4, some at the 5, and Marvin played 25 at the 4 and 3 combined. JLIII and the rest of the no point guard group logged enough minutes to make any defense an utter disaster.
Quin could not improve on that with a much better squad until the Kanter trade. Why?
Trevor Booker is a much better fill in at the 4 than Marvin (who has no business playing the 4 at all) or Evans (a novelty who appears to fit better on the Mixtape Tour than in the NBA).
Exum is head and heels better than anything the Jazz played at point last season. It's not even a comparison between him and Trey, let alone the rest of last year's mia squad. 21 mpg at point this season.
Derrick Favors at the 4. HUGE advantage year over year.
Rudy Gobert, true defensive center, and MUCH improved over last season, was playing 22 mpg pre-Kanter trade vs. 9.6 and constant foul trouble all last season.
All those advantages and Quin couldn't improve the defense until Kanter was traded. Why?
Quick question - do you give any credit to Quin for the development of Gobert?
That is not actually correct. The defense started to improve back in January before the Kanter trade. It didn't explode till Kanter was traded but the trend had already started.
From Jan till the Allstar break the Jazz allowed 95.33 ppg from a quick add up. That is still good for #1 in the NBA by .1 a point (current rankings). That is 21 games with Kanter. During that time Kanter played 27.1 mpg. (He actually sat out 4 games in this stretch with that ankle sprain)
In 2013-14 Cobin played Kanter 26.7 mpg and the Jazz allowed 102.2 ppg. So the Quinn started to improve the D while Kanter was getting roughly equal burn.
Yes Corbin was handicapped by players such as JLIII and Biedrins. But to say Snyder didn't improve the D till Kanter left is not correct.
That is about as deep and insightful post as you are going to get from me. Hope it helps bring the discussion you and GVC want. I won't have time to reply so in depth again for the day.
Perhaps you're right about me not being right about anything, but in this case you're either just lying or don't know what the hell you're talking about. Knowing you I'm not sure which option makes more sense.
We do have a search engine here. As far as I can tell, the only thing I was critical about Quinn was that Rudy wasn't starting over Kanter, and I believe I've been proven right about that (well me and anyone else who saw how obviously better the Jazz played when Gobert was starting). And I prefaced that by saying that I still love Quinn as a coach. In other threads I've said he was a coaching genius.
But I can see a nerve has been touched with you. I'd feel bad too if I started a thread as insanely dumb as this one. I mean the premise of this thread is just laughable.
b_line
Well-Known Member
Good points. One thing, Quin was improving the defense before Kanter was traded for sure, just slower than it has jumped since the trade.
I think the point about the roster being constructed to fail last year is a huge one. The players might be rookies and D-League players, but they fit way better than last year. I would bet that the Jazz Front Office does not view Ty in the same light that the fans do, and that they think more highly of him than a lot of fans. Ty was not a bad coach, but he was not Dennis Lindsay's guy. On equal footing, Quin is probably a bit better coach than Ty, but Quin being DL's pick is a huge point that has not been mentioned here. DL will build the roster the way he knows best to succeed, and he believes that Quin will be the guy who can succeed best with his roster. The discussion about Quin vs Ty is a bit more nuanced than a lot of posters believe.
Sure, Quin is probably a better coach overall. But the question is not necessarily about who is a better coach, it is about who fits better with the vision of the front office and the roster.
b_line
Well-Known Member
Frank has said he likes Quin better. I think he is just arguing that Ty is not a total turd.
gregbroncs
Well-Known Member
Perfect Example. For those defending this troll...Please tell me how. He says right in this post we would be better off this year with Corbin over Quin. Completely ignoring that half the players on this team quit on him last year. Claims we would be better off because of continuity but fails to accept that the team quit on Corbin. Hayward is having a banner year because Corbin no longer here. Favors if having his best year on both ends of the floor because Corbin is no longer here. Exum would be rotting away on the bench behind both Burke and Clark if Corbin was here. Because Corbin did not value defensive talent and Exum does not look good on offense.
.
You say I don't say anything that's not crazy. Yet you just said Corbin would be better for the Jazz this year while completely ignoring all the problems Corbin had. Because of all the factors in the previous paragraph my assertion is that the Jazz would have 15-20 wins right now if Corbin was the coach. The team would be in a similar tail spin to last year. And we still wouldn't know what we had in Hood, Exum, Ingles (who never would have played for Corbin) Millsap or Gobert. You claim last years roster was set up to fail. But this years roster had far more question marks on it to start than any season Corbin coached.
As a HC, all evidence points to Ty's strong resemblance to a turd. Frank's points of defense are cherry-picked and misrepresented. Ty failed here, Ty failed so badly in Sacto that they bounced him in short order calling him a "mistake". Ty showed zero evidence of improving the Jazz. They finished way way down in most teams stats if I remember right. Frank just does not know when to admit defeat.