Thread for conceding you’ve been wrong about something.

[LogGrad98]

I also take the position that killing people who are at our mercy is bad for us. Not just the ones administering the drugs, or flipping the switch or pulling the trigger, but as a society we kill helpless people and I think that degrades us. I don't want to be a killer and don't take joy in the killing of a person even if they deserve it. I do think that some people deserve to die, I just don't want to sign off on killing them when they pose no threat to anyone anymore.

Sometimes their very existence poses a threat, or are allowed to continue to cause havoc and damage and put even the guards at risk.

During his decades in prison, Charles Manson has repeatedly broken rules, caused trouble

During his more than four decades behind bars, convicted murderer Charles Manson — the mastermind behind a gory 1969 Los Angeles killing rampage — has been an unrepentant and incorrigible inmate, repeatedly cited for behavioral problems including hiding cellphones and a hacksaw in his cell.

www.latimes.com

It would have been better for all involved if Manson would have been executed. I can see both sides in this but I feel the death penalty is warranted whether they are helpless or not. Sharon Tate was helpless that night, as was her baby. I can see the argument that it brings us down to his level to mete out the same fate he meted to Tate, but on the flip side, Tate did nothing to deserve it, and Manson did. Completely different set of circumstances. Now, if we start executing people who have done nothing to deserve it then we are entering Nazi territory, so that would be of course horrifying and bad. But I feel the death penalty is warranted in some case, and should be carried out with, maybe not alacrity but least with expediency.

 

[Al-O-Meter]

I also take the position that killing people who are at our mercy is bad for us. Not just the ones administering the drugs, or flipping the switch or pulling the trigger, but as a society we kill helpless people and I think that degrades us.

So abortion is wrong.

 

[fishonjazz]

I wouldn't. You can live a sort of life in prison. Read, socialize, maybe write that book I've been thinking about, etc.. For me I want to live a long time so I can see things like the first people to permanently live somewhere besides Earth, possibly find extraterrestrial life, Jazz win a championship, the conquest of our AI overlords, Trump dies. Stuff like that.

Ya for me, prison would suck too bad. I would be miserable. Spending time with other miserable people (who also happen to be murderers and rapists and whatnot). If i know im going to be miserable for like 40 years in a row then I would rather just take a long nap.

 

[One Brow]

So abortion is wrong.

Yes. Slavery is also wrong, and I support a woman's refusal to be enslaved by a fetus.

 

[Al-O-Meter]

Yes. Slavery is also wrong, and I support a woman's refusal to be enslaved by a fetus.

...with the penalty being capital punishment without due process.

 

[One Brow]

...with the penalty being capital punishment without due process.

Any slave is entitled to take the life of the one trying to be its master. It's justifiable homicide.

At this point, I will not comment further on abortion in this thread. I apologize to @Douchebag K for my part in this derailment.

 

[FalseFlagg K]

I find it strange that people try to avoid the death penalty in favor of life in prison. If you were to let me pick from those 2 options I would pick the death penalty without hesitation.

i've defn changed over the years, i was vehemently against it for a long time but now in certain cases i'm ok about it

 

[gandalfe]

Now, if we start executing people who have done nothing to deserve it then we are entering Nazi territory, so that would be of course horrifying and bad. But I feel the death penalty is warranted in some case, and should be carried out with, maybe not alacrity but least with expediency.

The Death Penalty Information Center (admitted not an unbiased source) has found that at least 190 people have been wrongly sentenced to death since 1973. Of those, some have been exonerated prior to execution, but they list 20 who were executed who had, at least, strong reasons to suspect they were innocent. How many innocent people should be executed before we stop?

https://deathpenaltyinfo.org/policy-issues/innocence

 

[LogGrad98]

The Death Penalty Information Center (admitted not an unbiased source) has found that at least 190 people have been wrongly sentenced to death since 1973. Of those, some have been exonerated prior to execution, but they list 20 who were executed who had, at least, strong reasons to suspect they were innocent. How many innocent people should be executed before we stop?

https://deathpenaltyinfo.org/policy-issues/innocence

Yes to me that is the best argument against the death penalty, for sure. What is the old phrase, I would rather see 1000 guilty men go free than to have one innocent man condemned, or something like that. I can see that argument for sure.

 

[Gameface]

Yes to me that is the best argument against the death penalty, for sure. What is the old phrase, I would rather see 1000 guilty men go free than to have one innocent man condemned, or something like that. I can see that argument for sure.

Fun fact, when I was in high school I wrote a short story titled "100 Guilty Men" which was about a low IQ convenience store employee who was accused of murder after one of the neighborhood teens was found dead next to the dumpster. The employee had befriended the group of teens this kid was part of and even allowed them to buy beer a few times. The story has three parts, the interrogation, the trial and finally the execution. I wanted to avoid racial issues in my story so that is never mentioned.

No one ever understood my story title. Like no one ever. It was very frustrating.

I used it as my entry for the Young Writers @ Work scholarship and I got the "scholarship" for their weekend conference. They gave out 60 of these scholarships and I was the only person who submitted an actual short story. Everyone else submitted collections of poetry.

Benjamin Franklin stated it as: "it is better 100 guilty Persons should escape than that one innocent Person should suffer".

 

[Gameface]

Reading the political and social threads here is so depressing. Almost every single person as a reflex sees issues from their “side”. Pretty much the only person I see who reasonably regularly concedes points from someone who he would generally oppose is One Brow. Otherwise it’s such bitter division and polarisation.

So … who can post something political or social that they have changed their mind about, or agree on something that someone from the opposite wing of politics or the social spectrum has said. Let’s hear something others than “we’re good, they’re bad” …. ???

I used to be a hardcore Objectivist style Libertarian. If the site crash of 2010 hadn't happened there would be hundreds of posts by me espousing my libertarian beliefs.

It was largely conversations I had here, most specifically with @One Brow , that my outlook changed.

 

[fishonjazz]

The Death Penalty Information Center (admitted not an unbiased source) has found that at least 190 people have been wrongly sentenced to death since 1973. Of those, some have been exonerated prior to execution, but they list 20 who were executed who had, at least, strong reasons to suspect they were innocent. How many innocent people should be executed before we stop?

https://deathpenaltyinfo.org/policy-issues/innocence

Somewhat simple solution to that. Execute the ones that there is literally no doubt about. Dahmer. Bundy. Manson.
I mean if a dude kills his whole family, is arrested with their blood all over them and the murder weapon in hand and shows zero remorse and says *I'm glad I killed them and would kill then again if I could" then I think it's ok to execute that person.

If they were convicted in more circumstantial evidence then give em life and allow all the appeals to prove their innocence.