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Too Many Question Marks

Hekate said:
Dozier would have played for us but he was also part of their rotation till Harris came back. Vonleh sucks ***. His only okayish season was with Knicks and he isn't a good defender at all.

I remember Morgan getting chances at 5 and then getting yanked because he wasn't an answer defensively. There were a few games he committed and 1s in quick succession. I agree that he would be a better defender than Bradley if we played switching or high pressure defense but who is going to accompany him? And don't say Brantley or Oni. I like the guys but they are not worth the trade-off.

Bradley isn't a good fit with JC or Niang but he is the best one. That just sucks.

What were our options? Our best bet was to make Murray a passer but he could always find Jokic and reset for a hand off.
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Your memory is bad... Morgan only played center a couple times outside of garbage time.

Vonleh has been solid at times.

not sure what to tell you but we had options... tried a few changes here and there.

This isn’t about the Denver series... it’s about the roster going forward. Tell me which one of the prospects we rostered this year do you feel like we can rely on... and remember we consider ourselves a contender. It’s a total guess right now because we didn’t try any of these guys... then Quins hands are tied in the playoffs because he has no guys he trusts because we signed too many lotto tickets.
 
Hekate said:
It didn't matter who played Back-Up 5 in the playoffs this year. Bradley offers better rim protection because he takes more space, Morgan is quicker. They are both not Kanter.
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Quin benched TB in game 7 doe... so he thought it mattered.
 
Eenie-Meenie said:
I thought it was more that he didn't get the calls against him, not that he got called for fouls that he committed like TB, but yes he didn't get respect either.
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He’d get called for hand checking and the smallest amount of contact on defense... it sucked.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Your memory is bad... Morgan only played center a couple times outside of garbage time.

Vonleh has been solid at times.

not sure what to tell you but we had options... tried a few changes here and there.

This isn’t about the Denver series... it’s about the roster going forward. Tell me which one of the prospects we rostered this year do you feel like we can rely on... and remember we consider ourselves a contender. It’s a total guess right now because we didn’t try any of these guys... then Quins hands are tied in the playoffs because he has no guys he trusts because we signed too many lotto tickets.
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Hey, don't diss my memory, man!

Vonleh has been good in idea only. Doubt he gets any meaningful minutes anymore on a play-off team unless ofc injuries.

There were also few changes we have made, they didn't stick. You can't get much creative with this roster defensively.

Regarding prospects, this year we couldn't rely on any of them. Next year? Who knows? Off season will be huge for them and May be they can fight for a rotation spot. There will be a whole new season for them to prove themselves.

Also you don't contend with your 11 to 15th men. They are there for injuries, development, locker room presence and garbage time and sometimes they pan out like Royce or Ingles.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Quin benched TB in game 7 doe... so he thought it mattered.
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Of course, he thought it mattered. He played him more than Bradley in games 4 and 5. İt's his job to think and win every small margin. All I was saying is we were going to lose the series regardless who played more in the regular season.
 
Hekate said:
Hey, don't diss my memory, man!

Vonleh has been good in idea only. Doubt he gets any meaningful minutes anymore on a play-off team unless ofc injuries.

There were also few changes we have made, they didn't stick. You can't get much creative with this roster defensively.

Regarding prospects, this year we couldn't rely on any of them. Next year? Who knows? Off season will be huge for them and May be they can fight for a rotation spot. There will be a whole new season for them to prove themselves.

Also you don't contend with your 11 to 15th men. They are there for injuries, development, locker room presence and garbage time and sometimes they pan out like Royce or Ingles.
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I mean you could use those roster spots for pieces that help you get creative. We came in with too many unestablished players to add as many projects as we did.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I mean you could use those roster spots for pieces that help you get creative. We came in with too many unestablished players to add as many projects as we did.
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Rotations aren't more than 10 men in the playoffs. We could have had some turnaround but we did promote Morgan and signed Tucker. We could have waived NWG but I think they kept him as Mudiay's replacement. He will prolly be waived midseason.

Even Raptors with their high variance defense don't play their last 4-5 guys rotation minutes. They just give Matt Thomas some spot minutes to get a shot off as 3pt specialist.

Those spots just aren't there for changing the outlook of the team or get creative. Those happen with your rotation players. We got a little creative with Bojan posting him up because he can do multiple stuff on offense. We got creative with Rudy slipping screens because teams know they have to close the ballhandler's space. We did Clarkson-Conley slips etc. We were a good offensive team that just moved away from what worked.

But we don't have guys that can do multiple stuff on defense or a guy that can lockdown people.
 
I’d love to see what Jazz could get for Conley but I don’t think it will be a ton of value. I think we personally keep him, resign Clarkson, add Favors, try and trade Davis/Bradley/1st rounder for rotational players like Tony Snell/Luke Kennard . Detroit needs to rebuild and maybe that first might help them move griffin and they tear it down.

or

trade Davis /Bradley/gross/oni and our 1st for Portis. Jazz could run Conley/ Mitchell/bogdanovic/Portis/Gobert with a bench of Clarkson, Royce, ingles, favors. I know it’s a lot to give up for Portis but we turn dead cap space into a starting stretch 4.
 
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Hekate said:
Rotations aren't more than 10 men in the playoffs. We could have had some turnaround but we did promote Morgan and signed Tucker. We could have waived NWG but I think they kept him as Mudiay's replacement. He will prolly be waived midseason.

Even Raptors with their high variance defense don't play their last 4-5 guys rotation minutes. They just give Matt Thomas some spot minutes to get a shot off as 3pt specialist.

Those spots just aren't there for changing the outlook of the team or get creative. Those happen with your rotation players. We got a little creative with Bojan posting him up because he can do multiple stuff on offense. We got creative with Rudy slipping screens because teams know they have to close the ballhandler's space. We did Clarkson-Conley slips etc. We were a good offensive team that just moved away from what worked.

But we don't have guys that can do multiple stuff on defense or a guy that can lockdown people.
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It is less about the playoffs and more about knowing what you have... if Ingles doesn’t play in actual games all those years ago you don’t know what you have.

our “proven” players included mudiay, Niang and TB. Then you add Tucker, Oni, Morgan, NWG... those guys are fine for two way projects but they can’t take up that much of your roster. Ed not working out is really problematic, but like you said those spots are for injuries. Some of those g league guys should at least be tested if you gonna have that many spots dedicated to them. Now we will add a pick and roll into next season keeping most of those guys around... they flame out and we are thin again... but folks will say it wasn’t their fault they wanted to see if the young guys could contribute... should be a one season question but will take multiple.

And spare me the practice talk... you can’t evaluate what these guys are in practice. They don’t scrimmage all the time and scrimmages are worlds different than live games.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
And spare me the practice talk... you can’t evaluate what these guys are in practice. They don’t scrimmage all the time and scrimmages are worlds different than live games.
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TBH, I think you're really downplaying how important practice is for player evaluation. There's really probably only one thing that's better than practice to get a good assessment on player capabilities and that's pre-draft workouts.
 
UtahJazz32 said:
As long as DL is in charge we will be a mediocre team or slightly lower. I think Gayle should fire him for his stupid Conley trade . He is the most passive and cowardly GM in the NBA.
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I thought DL did a masterful job when Haywood screwed us signing Jonas, Ekpe and Thabo to give us some hope. This year was a bomb.
 
NUMBERICA said:
Yeah but you gotta have at least eight which the Jazz didn't and don't.
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I’m done trying to explain it with this post. You almost always have one injury... we started with DM, Joe, Mike, Royce, Rudy, Bojan, Ed, Jeff as established nba players. That’s 8. Jeff is always a wildcard so that’s tough to rely on him. We also were counting on Exum which is generally not smart. So we started with 8.5ish guys. Got JC so that’s fine and helpful but also released Jeff. So we started thin on established guys and then went for even more projects.

The projects do well in the g league... great then let’s try them in the big league to see if their games and roles translate since we are thin as ****... but nah we rode with mediocre/poor performance from a couple guys rather than trying some things. Even when Quin had to know it would be tough to play Niang and TB in the playoffs.

Say we come into the season with one more established guy or pick one up during the season... might be the difference in a playoff series that went down to the wire. Either that or try to give Brantley/Morgan/Oni a realrotation spot so you can see what they have and what they need to work on. G League is great but the role those guys will play is so different than what they will play in the league. Honestly too much time down there can be counterproductive... call it the Jimmer or Morris Almond syndrome. They learn a little down there but now they need to learn the role they will play.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I’m done trying to explain it with this post. You almost always have one injury... we started with DM, Joe, Mike, Royce, Rudy, Bojan, Ed, Jeff as established nba players. That’s 8. Jeff is always a wildcard so that’s tough to rely on him. We also were counting on Exum which is generally not smart. So we started with 8.5ish guys. Got JC so that’s fine and helpful but also released Jeff. So we started thin on established guys and then went for even more projects.

The projects do well in the g league... great then let’s try them in the big league to see if their games and roles translate since we are thin as ****... but nah we rode with mediocre/poor performance from a couple guys rather than trying some things. Even when Quin had to know it would be tough to play Niang and TB in the playoffs.

Say we come into the season with one more established guy or pick one up during the season... might be the difference in a playoff series that went down to the wire. Either that or try to give Brantley/Morgan/Oni a realrotation spot so you can see what they have and what they need to work on. G League is great but the role those guys will play is so different than what they will play in the league. Honestly too much time down there can be counterproductive... call it the Jimmer or Morris Almond syndrome. They learn a little down there but now they need to learn the role they will play.
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youre a skip-stepping sonnuvabitch, aren’t u!
 
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