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Trump's golf bill

Joe Biden delivered a beautiful eulogy for John McCain:

https://www.townandcountrymag.com/s...-eulogy-john-mccain-memorial-full-transcript/

"John's story is an American story. It's not hyperbole. it's the American story. grounded in respect and decency. basic fairness. the intolerance through the abuse of power. Many of you travel the world, look how the rest of the world looks at us. They look at us a little naive, so fair, so decent. We are the naive Americans. that's who we are. That's who John was. He could not stand the abuse of power. wherever he saw it, in whatever form, in whatever ways. He loved basic values, fairness, honesty, dignity, respect, giving hate no safe harbor, leaving no one behind and understanding Americans were part of something much bigger than ourselves."

"It wasn't about politics with John. He could disagree on substance, but the underlying values that animated everything John did, everything he was, come to a different conclusion. He'd part company with you, if you lacked the basic values of decency, respect, knowing this project is bigger than yourself."
 
Red said:
Thanks. Because I know my friend well, for many years, and because he is an intelligent and thoughtful individual, with a lot of heart and compassion for others, it really leaves me no choice but to believe there must be many Trump supporters who could be described the same way. It's one reason I think the divide in America is a situation that might best be described as a tragedy. I know there are a fair share of "deplorables" among Trump supporters, those who revel in and support his bigoted points of view, the alt right, the white nationalists, all those elements that seem to represent dark elements in our society. He has the capacity to bring out the worse in such people. He wants their support, regardless of his weak efforts to keep them at arms length when forced to. I doubt I will ever want anything to do with those supporters of Trump.

But I'm left with the knowledge that I am a good man who does not understand how people like my friend can believe as they do, and that people like him are left with the knowledge that they are good and cannot understand how people like me believe as I do. How this all came to be puzzles me more then anything else in the narrative that is America in the Trump era. I can appreciate when people say if, after all that Trump has done, one still supports him, then there must be something wrong with one. But knowing people like my friend makes me realize it just is not that simple.

But I'm on the side I'm on. I can feel sorry for Trump, he's human, and he's insecure and a man child, but I loathe him at the same time, for being a cynical demagogue who is willing to do to America what he is doing. It's wrong, it's so wrong. The sooner he goes, the better. But it won't bridge the divides or dampen the animosities. America will be a deeply divided society for a long time yet, I fear.
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Incredibly well said, Red.
 
str8line said:
But is it political? It's not.

How do you reconcile civility with a person who wants such an uncivil person to be our President?

l know a guy(not really a friend but I see him from time to time) who is a abuser of women. He's a great motorcycle rider and we briefly talk shop on occasion but when I found out I decided instantly I would avoid him and not support him in any manner.

Trump's constant transgressions and his psychosis affects our entire nation. The damage is real. Not political damage, but the damage of who we are as a people. Only history will know how deeply it changes us, but I'm pessimistic about the outcome.

I have changed my friendships because of Trump just as I've changed friendships over the years when I've lost respect for a person. I do it for myself, not in any hope that I'll change that person or they will come around.

Luckily very few of my friends support Trump and a few have turned on Trump after voting for him.
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Bear in mind that some people, like myself, bought into his rhetoric of wanting to help the working middle class. There are people that voted for Trump for some reasons, and some that voted for him for other, more obscure reasons. It’s not fair to put some Trump or ex-Trump followers in the same bag. People like Thriller or Dutch are who polarize the scene.
 
Jazzta said:
Bear in mind that some people, like myself, bought into his rhetoric of wanting to help the working middle class. There are people that voted for Trump for some reasons, and some that voted for him for other, more obscure reasons. It’s not fair to put some Trump or ex-Trump followers in the same bag. People like Thriller or Dutch are who polarize the scene.
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I agree, not fair to put everyone in the same bag. I still don't understand how people couldn't see who he was long before he was elected but I guess people thought he might become Presidential. At this point those who support him are just messed up people.
 
Rubashov said:
I'm a public sector worker, over the last ten years the cost of parking at my work has increased by 1500p/a my wages have increased by slightly less in that time. if i didn't have outside sources of income i'd be screwed or a least working in another job, its a joke. The worst bit is the excuses that management trawl out for this nonsense, the best one for a near 50 percent increase in the cost of parking was to encourage staff to take public transport to improve our green footprint. Makes perfect sense if you live in the city and can walk or grab a tram and be at work in 10 minutes, at the time i was living in one of Melbourne's high crime suburbs, catching the train to a night shift was dangerous for me and i'm 6'2 280 pounds, let alone an immigrant cleaner or kitchen hand. That is i think the perfect example of the liberal elite, tell all the right lies, then act exactly like the Tories and pretend to claim the moral high ground.
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I've been searching all morning for exact figures but can't find them so you'll have to take my word for it.

At one point during the Great Recession, I calculated compounded Utah State worker pay increases and compared that to inflation. State workers took over a 20% pay deduction in real terms. At the same time, new hires took more than a 5% cut to retirement benefits and insurance premiums went up, even in years where total HC costs went down. Employee portion of medical care went up plenty. They call it "co-insurance" now, an absurd, nonsensical term. Total compensation probably went down by close to 30% in 5 years, and more for low wage earners who pay disproportionately higher % towards HC.

To make matters worse, merit increase is virtually non-existant in Utah state employment. This is problematic, not only for morale, but because we live in an economy built around earning increases typically coming as you progress through life and gain skill (duh). The opposite of "Prime earning years" tends to happen to state employees chained to the golden leash, as pay diminishes while you get stuck to pension years of service.

Unlike your situation, this is driven largely by the population but compounded drastically by do-gooders and special interests on the Hill. For example, one year when tax receipts were booming Governor Herbert thought he could only find $7.6 million for total employee compensation increases, an amount below inflation, but requested something like $18 million to retrofit a handful of school buses to satisfy his clean air pet project. 18 million for 35 ****ing buses. A real pay cut for thousands. Ask yourself, do you think changing 35 old buses to natural gas is going to do a damn thing for our bad air? No, not a damn measurable bit of difference. But a huge cost. When it wasn't funded Gov. Herbert unsuccessfully pushed for it again the next year. That's the state of the state and how we get took.
 
idestroyedthetoilet said:
I've been searching all morning for exact figures but can't find them so you'll have to take my word for it.

At one point during the Great Recession, I calculated compounded Utah State worker pay increases and compared that to inflation. State workers took over a 20% pay deduction in real terms. At the same time, new hires took more than a 5% cut to retirement benefits and insurance premiums went up, even in years where total HC costs went down. Employee portion of medical care went up plenty. They call it "co-insurance" now, an absurd, nonsensical term. Total compensation probably went down by close to 30% in 5 years, and more for low wage earners who pay disproportionately higher % towards HC.

To make matters worse, merit increase is virtually non-existant in Utah state employment. This is problematic, not only for morale, but because we live in an economy built around earning increases typically coming as you progress through life and gain skill (duh). The opposite of "Prime earning years" tends to happen to state employees chained to the golden leash, as pay diminishes while you get stuck to pension years of service.

Unlike your situation, this is driven largely by the population but compounded drastically by do-gooders and special interests on the Hill. For example, one year when tax receipts were booming Governor Herbert thought he could only find $7.6 million for total employee compensation increases, an amount below inflation, but requested something like $18 million to retrofit a handful of school buses to satisfy his clean air pet project. 18 million for 35 ****ing buses. A real pay cut for thousands. Ask yourself, do you think changing 35 old buses to natural gas is going to do a damn thing for our bad air? No, not a damn measurable bit of difference. But a huge cost. When it wasn't funded Gov. Herbert unsuccessfully pushed for it again the next year. That's the state of the state and how we get took.
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Why do you think I left the state, all that and nepotism, and not being part of the “club”. I’m way off better now.
 
Bulletproof said:
Wait! You're not in Utah anymore?
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I think he meant working for the State. I could be wrong.

I took a job with the State 3.5 years ago because I had been laid off my previous job and was looking for a job that had security and good benefits as I wind up my career. The pay is crappy, though.
 
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