Utes 2011 Football Discussion

[//r00t 4 Jazz]

Plenty of blame to go around on that one. Play calling was atrocious (again). We can't really blame it on the horrible QB either because the second half was totally different- even without John White and a starting O lineman. Decent play calling against the worst defense in the Pac 12 and the Utes probably win.

Vaikapuna had a horrible fumble. Without that the Utes probably win. Coleman Peterson again proves he may be the worst kicker in division 1 football. If he makes even 1 fg the Utes probably win.

Very disappointing. Not the end of the world though. Utah would have just been embarrassed by Oregon anyway.

At least Utah came within a missed fg on the last day of the season from winning the South division. And this was during a season where, as coach Whitt said, they had 7 or 8 major season ending injuries. Plus they had new coaches, new systems, etc. Should only get better form here.

Hopefully Norm Chow gets it together though because with the brutal play calling we saw several times this season (including the first half of that Colorado game) it won't even matter who is at QB.

As I was complaining about the play calling I just wanted to add I don't entirely blame chow he has been handcuffed with the QB and other issues and I think they went to far in the "we don't want the offense to lose the game for us" it's a fine line and as we saw in the 2nd half if they just open it a little bit they can still have some small success without letting the offense give the game away.

 

[trigg3r]

Salty Wrote:


I still have tons of worries in regards to the QB situation in 2012. A quick breakdown:

Chase Hansen: Not only is he most likely a mission kid, he's probably not even going to end up being a QB at Utah. This seems alot like the Brian Blechen scenario all over again (which isn't a bad thing). Even if he does play QB @ The U, it's 3 years down the road.

Jordan Wynn: This is going to sound extreme, but I would seriously pull his scholarship and thank him for his time. Before I get flamed, here's my reasoning: The guy has had both shoulders rebuilt. He is literally Utah's version of Chad Pennington. Utah CANNOT bank on this kid coming back. What is the point of letting him rehab all year, and letting him work as the #1 during fall camp (with no contact)? WR's will get used to Wynn being the guy, as will the Oline and RB's. That's the QB they will be adjusted to. That is going to make it all the worse when in week 1 or 2 Wynn finally gets hit on one of those shoulders and is out yet again. Mark the tape: If Utah allows Wynn back into the starting line-up in 2012, there is no possible way he remains healthy. Why waste our time?

John Hays: The guy is tough and gritty, but he's not a D1 QB. Yes, a full offseason in the system combined with his starting experience in 2011 should make him better heading into next year, but it still doesn't make him a D1 QB. You don't make serious runs at Rose Bowls with guys like this playing the most important position on your roster.

Tyler Shreve: The guy who had to wait a year before joining the Utah football team because he beat the crap out of his High School baseball coach. He showed so much promise during spring ball that Utah coaches had to scramble to find a guy like John Hays. He also won't be able to take part in the extra bowl practices this December due to surgery. I'm not exactly feeling warm and fuzzy about this guy.

Travis Wilson: This is the bright spot for Utah as long as they can get him to honor his commit come signing day. Honestly, with the other 3 options I listed above, I would take a long, hard look at starting Wilson as a Fresh. Utah will have John White and what should shape up to be a pretty good O-line, plus a good defense. That's the perfect formula to bring a young kid along without heaping too much on his shoulders.

Agreed on Wynn. What exactly would he bring to the table next year? He is a health risk who wasn't very good to begin with. Pull his scholarship and wish him well going forward. Wilson should get every opportunity to win the job for the reasons you stated.

 

[SaltyDawg]

Went to the Colorado/Utah game and Salty... you know I agree with you on many fronts.. but the playcalling wasn't the issue.

They didn't have a 1st down until the right before the half (Their 5th Drive)... that is not just playcalling. They were getting 0 push up front and White wasn't doing anything. The wind was a factor as well. The only issue with playcalling was there was 0 bubble screens ran to the wideouts but the way Colorado was playing bump they really couldn't. In the 2nd half, still facing 8 man fronts, Vakapuna was slicing up the defense. This game was lost due to mistakes/lost opportunties. Also the Utes defense could NOT get off the field on 3rd down in the 1st half. I would wager that all 5 3rd down conversions for Colorado happened in the 1st half.

1st drive - Mo gets the stupid personal foul or they are off the field - Colorado drives down for a TD
Onside Kick - Perfect call and all they had to do is fall on it yet somehow they don't with 4 guys around the ball
Fumble by Vakapuna
Missed 3 FGs
2 Sacks on the final drive
Kickoff throwback that if the guy doesn't 1 bounce it to Dunn the entire sideline is wide open

I forgot about that botched onside kick. I thought the kicker should have had it for sure. He really had a horrible game.

I forgot about that throw on the return too. Looked like they were trying to do the Music City Miracle, lol. Agreed though, if he doesn't one hop that throw it goes for a TD.

The sacks on the final drive were ugly, no doubt. But I am assuming the coaches told him not to take any chances because they were already in FG range. He should have thrown the ball. But the kicker did miss a 26 yarder earlier so I don't know if he would have made it even without the sacks. That kicker just had a horrible day.

Plenty of blame to go around. I do still think the play calling in that first half was horrible though. Chow was a major disappointment this season. I hope he gets it together in the offseason.

 

[SaltyDawg]

Salty Wrote:


I still have tons of worries in regards to the QB situation in 2012. A quick breakdown:

Chase Hansen: Not only is he most likely a mission kid, he's probably not even going to end up being a QB at Utah. This seems alot like the Brian Blechen scenario all over again (which isn't a bad thing). Even if he does play QB @ The U, it's 3 years down the road.

Jordan Wynn: This is going to sound extreme, but I would seriously pull his scholarship and thank him for his time. Before I get flamed, here's my reasoning: The guy has had both shoulders rebuilt. He is literally Utah's version of Chad Pennington. Utah CANNOT bank on this kid coming back. What is the point of letting him rehab all year, and letting him work as the #1 during fall camp (with no contact)? WR's will get used to Wynn being the guy, as will the Oline and RB's. That's the QB they will be adjusted to. That is going to make it all the worse when in week 1 or 2 Wynn finally gets hit on one of those shoulders and is out yet again. Mark the tape: If Utah allows Wynn back into the starting line-up in 2012, there is no possible way he remains healthy. Why waste our time?

John Hays: The guy is tough and gritty, but he's not a D1 QB. Yes, a full offseason in the system combined with his starting experience in 2011 should make him better heading into next year, but it still doesn't make him a D1 QB. You don't make serious runs at Rose Bowls with guys like this playing the most important position on your roster.

Tyler Shreve: The guy who had to wait a year before joining the Utah football team because he beat the crap out of his High School baseball coach. He showed so much promise during spring ball that Utah coaches had to scramble to find a guy like John Hays. He also won't be able to take part in the extra bowl practices this December due to surgery. I'm not exactly feeling warm and fuzzy about this guy.

Travis Wilson: This is the bright spot for Utah as long as they can get him to honor his commit come signing day. Honestly, with the other 3 options I listed above, I would take a long, hard look at starting Wilson as a Fresh. Utah will have John White and what should shape up to be a pretty good O-line, plus a good defense. That's the perfect formula to bring a young kid along without heaping too much on his shoulders.

I would definitely keep Wynn around. I would not guarantee him the starting job, but I would keep him around. If nothing else, he's a pretty good backup. He may be injury prone, but he had so much promise as a freshman. He's been around long enough that his decision making should be top notch. His decision making was petty good anyway, but should be even better next year. Hopefully the problems with his arm were a result of him not being fully healthy, which shouldn't be a problem next year. He may be too injury prone to be guaranteed a starting spot, but he is still good enough to at least be a 2nd or 3rd string.

Hays is the one that should have his scholarship pulled. Like you said, the guy isn't a D1 QB, so why is he eating up a D1 scholarship?

I think Tyler Shreve will be a good player. Isn't he a pitcher in baseball too? I thought I read somewhere that he was actually drafted in the MLB draft or something. He has to be a whole lot better than Hays, and possibly better than Wynn.
I would love to see Wilson, Shreve, and Wynn battle it out for the starting and backup spots. And however it plays out, it will be a whole lot better than the situation this year.

I'm actually not too worried about the QB spot next year. If the Utes almost won the South division with Hays suddenly thrown into a starting role and Chow looking like he should have retired a few years ago, it can only be better next season.

 

[prodigy]

here are missed kicks(which are all depressingly close)..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G66Y5tctxyY

the 2nd miss is still most shocking. mostly because there we were on what the 6 yard line, and got nothing out of it.
1st down - vakapuna run(understandable)
2nd down - hays run(?), i swear matthews was open in the back of the end zone
3rd down - busted play hays sacked
4th down - missed 26 yard field goal

game was lost here i believe. that and the personal foul penalty on the opening drive which whittingham admitted gave them a spark and they started playing with purpose.

 

[7StraightIsGreat]

Salty Wrote:

I'm actually not too worried about the QB spot next year. If the Utes almost won the South division with Hays suddenly thrown into a starting role and Chow looking like he should have retired a few years ago, it can only be better next season.

I realize it boils down to semantics, but this statement is not exactly true. The Utes were a game away from winning the south division because USC wasn't eligible. Had they been, Utah would have been nowhere near winning the south. Next year, USC will be eligible to win the south. IMO Utah is going to need to have alot better luck with injuries and have one hell of a better plan at QB heading into the season if they hope to compete for the south title.

That's the bad news. The good news is: USC has to come to Utah next year ( and with a little luck from the schedule makers hopefully that happens in late November), Arizona will be rebuilding with Rich Rod who is a joke IMO, ASU will be rebuilding with a new HC and new starters almost across the board, Colorado will still suck and Utah should not be lacking any motivation when they head into Boulder next year and UCLA will most likely be breaking in a new coach with a new system or better yet- they let the Nuehisal era continue.

IMO the south could be a 2 team race next year but Utah has some big QB issues to shore up before they can be considered legit contenders.

***Edit- As soon as I finished typing this I saw the headline that UCLA has already fired their HC. That means 3 out of the 6 teams in the south will be playing with new HC's/systems.

 

[SaltyDawg]

Salty Wrote:



I realize it boils down to semantics, but this statement is not exactly true. The Utes were a game away from winning the south division because USC wasn't eligible. Had they been, Utah would have been nowhere near winning the south. Next year, USC will be eligible to win the south. IMO Utah is going to need to have alot better luck with injuries and have one hell of a better plan at QB heading into the season if they hope to compete for the south title.

That's the bad news. The good news is: USC has to come to Utah next year ( and with a little luck from the schedule makers hopefully that happens in late November), Arizona will be rebuilding with Rich Rod who is a joke IMO, ASU will be rebuilding with a new HC and new starters almost across the board, Colorado will still suck and Utah should not be lacking any motivation when they head into Boulder next year and UCLA will most likely be breaking in a new coach with a new system or better yet- they let the Nuehisal era continue.

IMO the south could be a 2 team race next year but Utah has some big QB issues to shore up before they can be considered legit contenders.

***Edit- As soon as I finished typing this I saw the headline that UCLA has already fired their HC. That means 3 out of the 6 teams in the south will be playing with new HC's/systems.

Not only do all those teams have new coaches, but USC will probably be losing Barkley, and they lose more scholarships too. I don't think they will be a major concern next year.

 

[Deleted member 365]

I'm surprised how little criticism coach Whit has received.

Last year? The Utes blew chunks against Notre Dame. then, they played poorly enough to have lost to BYU.

This year? They sucked against Cal and didn't show up against Colorado.

I'm not saying that Whit sucks or should be fired. But I remember McBride winning some good games but always losing one or two a year that just left you shaking your head, "HUH?"

I'm afraid that Whit and his staff need to straighten some things out. These disappearing acts are costly. All Whit and co. had to do was minimally prepare and focus against Colorado. And they couldn't even do that....

 

[7StraightIsGreat]

I'm surprised how little criticism coach Whit has received.

Last year? The Utes blew chunks against Notre Dame. then, they played poorly enough to have lost to BYU.

This year? They sucked against Cal and didn't show up against Colorado.

I'm not saying that Whit sucks or should be fired. But I remember McBride winning some good games but always losing one or two a year that just left you shaking your head, "HUH?"

I'm afraid that Whit and his staff need to straighten some things out. These disappearing acts are costly. All Whit and co. had to do was minimally prepare and focus against Colorado. And they couldn't even do that....

Utah coming out flat against Colorado is 100% on coaching. Whit shouldn't get a pass for that, but he's also had his teams ready to perform in so many big time games that it's hard to beat him up over it just yet. McBride was a bit different because his let downs usually didn't come against a Notre Dame on the road, a TCU squad who may have been the best team in the country last year and a Colorado squad that Utah faced after suffering through an injury ravaged first season in the Pac12. McBride's letdowns would come against 6-and-5 New Mexico teams, etc. I am a little concerned, but at this point I think Ute fans would be crazy not to have faith in Whit. We'll see how it evolves from here.

Another thing, but it's a bit off topic: Should Utah go hard after a 4 or 5 star RB or at least a JC star to back-up John White next year? I'm not giving up on Langi, but Utah had nothing behind White this year. Not only that, but FB Shawn Asiata was a very big part of White's success this year and Utah's going to need to replace him this offseason. Langi's size at least lends itself to the idea that he could be the replacement at FB. In fact, some of the writers on recruiting sites last year seemed to believe Langi actually projected better as a D1 fullback.

Langi is quite a bit more athletic than Asiata. If he could beef up a little and become a good lead blocker, I think he'd add an extra dimension catching balls out of the backfield. I like the idea of having White and Langi on the field at the same time under that scenario. It could open up a new dimension to what seems to be an extremely vanilla Norm Chow offense.

 

[Cope]

I'm surprised how little criticism coach Whit has received.

Last year? The Utes blew chunks against Notre Dame. then, they played poorly enough to have lost to BYU.

This year? They sucked against Cal and didn't show up against Colorado.

I'm not saying that Whit sucks or should be fired. But I remember McBride winning some good games but always losing one or two a year that just left you shaking your head, "HUH?"

I'm afraid that Whit and his staff need to straighten some things out. These disappearing acts are costly. All Whit and co. had to do was minimally prepare and focus against Colorado. And they couldn't even do that....

You really think Whit should have criticism for this year? Really?

New Conference
Starting QB that gets injured 1/3 of the way into the season
New QB that played at a program that no longer exists
JC Transfer at Tailback that wasn't even recruited by a school out of high school
Offense line that has had injuries all year
ZERO depth at any position due to just entering the Pac 12
New Offense (Chow) and another new offense when Wynn went down

I called 8-4 at the beginning of the year being a GREAT year. 3 Missed FGs and you got 7-5 vs. 8-4.

To me Whit out of any coach in the Pac 12 would be considered for Coach of the year. If they win against Colorado, he is the coach of the year in my opinion.


I guess I just don't have the Crimson colored glasses on as I am a fan of the Utes from a far (Same with BYU).


To me this is probably his best coaching job to date outside of the 2008 season.

 

[Deleted member 365]

You really think Whit should have criticism for this year? Really?

New Conference
Starting QB that gets injured 1/3 of the way into the season
New QB that played at a program that no longer exists
JC Transfer at Tailback that wasn't even recruited by a school out of high school
Offense line that has had injuries all year
ZERO depth at any position due to just entering the Pac 12
New Offense (Chow) and another new offense when Wynn went down

I called 8-4 at the beginning of the year being a GREAT year. 3 Missed FGs and you got 7-5 vs. 8-4.

To me Whit out of any coach in the Pac 12 would be considered for Coach of the year. If they win against Colorado, he is the coach of the year in my opinion.


I guess I just don't have the Crimson colored glasses on as I am a fan of the Utes from a far (Same with BYU).


To me this is probably his best coaching job to date outside of the 2008 season.

If getting your asses kicked by Colorado at home when you had everything on the line doesn't get you criticism, then I don't know what will.

If the majority of Utah fans are like you, then I want Utah to just give Kyle a $1 billion dollar lifetime contract. Open up heavens gates, because he can do no wrong.

 

[NUMBERICA]

If getting your asses kicked by Colorado at home when you had everything on the line doesn't get you criticism, then I don't know what will.

If the Utes didn't have Whittingham, they wouldn't be in the Pac 12 and they wouldn't have been in a position for this game to even mean anything.

You seriously lack perspective.